Why We Must Raise Taxes on the Rich

[Mott the Hoople]

We will have to raise taxes, at least on a temporary basis, but the notion that raising taxes is a stand-alone solution to the budget deficit is ludicrous. Furthermore, raising tax rates back up to 91% would not generate $350 billion in revenue. It would destroy jobs, companies would close their doors, and revenues would plummet.

Kenneth isn't the brightest bulb in the box, that is for certain.

That's trure but I didn't see either Yurt or SMK advocate an 90% top marginal tax rate. You are both correct in that the solution lie in both spending cuts and tax increases. I would have no problem seeing tax rates raised back to Clinton era levels in addition to spending cuts. The economic impact on business would in the long term be a stimulus as government with a balanced budgest would stimulate economic growth, even with slightly higher marginal tax rates.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

$1 million/year is well off, but not necessarily rich, especially if they are a small business (e.g. s corp) owner who employs others. I'd prefer to create an entirely new bracket for multimillionaires, such as 45% on >$20 million, provided that ALL of the revenue generated from this tax increase is put toward the national debt. That would have to be a legal requirement. Otherwise, I have no doubt whatsoever the libbies will simply take that money and blow it on a wasteful, counterproductive government program. It is guaranteed.

You wouldn't even have to do that. Even if you raised taxes back to Clinton era levels the tax rates would still favor the wealthy but it would generate added revenue to help balance the budget. Then their are the three pillars. SS is an easy fix, you only need to lift the pay roll tax cap and that problem is solved. Medicare-Medicaid would be absorbed into health care reform with the adoption of universal coverage and a single payer system, that's a solved problem too. That leaves the military. There's vast room for making cuts there as the US is grossly over extended militarily and we cannot contiune to justify this expense with no clear and present danger to our national security being present.

 

[Topspin]

slash/gash spending taxes are too high even on the evil rich.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Voltaire, Dixies correct on this one.

We need to open up more opportunities for people, and not focus on raising taxes on anyone.

Fine, then what services that are important to you are you willing to do with out? Cut military spending in half? Eliminate Social Security? Eliminate Medicare-Medicaid? You can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

slash/gash spending taxes are too high even on the evil rich.

again, fine, what programs are you willing to cut or do with out? Are you willing to cut military spending by half?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

What is fair is if an income group controls 20% of the wealth then they should pay 20% of the taxes.

Why do you presume this to be fair? I could see it if people were just born automatically controlling wealth, or if they were granted wealth based on who they are... but that is seldom the case in the real world. Most people who control wealth, earned that wealth. NOTHING should be done on the basis of what "group" controls the wealth! That's not fair, that's a Marxist punishment for people who have been successful!

And let's get your figures straight... The top 20% pays about 95% of the taxes now... so you are actually suggesting we cut taxes for the wealthy considerably, or at least, shifting the bulk of the tax burden away from the top 20%. I'm fine with that, but I doubt that was the point your Marxist ass was intending to make.

 

[Minister of Truth]

You're so fucking clueless and apparently as incapable of doing math as Dixie. What is fair is if an income group controls 20% of the wealth then they should pay 20% of the taxes.

The top 1% pay 33% of the federal income tax revenues, and the upper half pays 90%. I don't see the point in whining that the wealthy don't pay a fair share.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

I don't see the point in whining that the wealthy don't pay a fair share.

Jealousy, envy, and an entitlement mentality.... that is the point and reason for the whining.

Hey Mott.... What if I am wealthy and I decide to cruise the world in my yacht instead of earning an income? Should the government still be able to confiscate my wealth and pay a portion of the tax burden with it, based on how much wealth I control? Why don't we just take away all the wealth from the rich and redistribute it to the poor? Why don't we say, anything you earn that is more than it costs an average family to live, belongs to the government? Oh wait.... we'd have to repeal the Constitution to do that!! Nevermind!

 

[Guns Guns Guns]

Would the tea party movement be happy with a 20 percent across-the-board tax cut?

All taxes, all sources — state, local, excise, corporate, whatever.

And real cuts, measured by real taxes that people actually pay — the actual share of taxes in gross domestic product — without being misled by the nominal rates that almost no one pays in reality.

Amazingly, we’ve already tried that. In 2000, perhaps our last truly prosperous year, U.S. all-source taxation was 29.5 percent of GDP. In 2009, by contrast, all-source taxation was only 24 percent of GDP — a nearly 20 percent cut.

If one listens to the din from new conservative governors, from the Pauls, père et fils, and from most Republicans in Congress, America is groaning under a unique burden of heartless taxation.

In truth, however, we live in one of the most lightly taxed advanced nations in the world.

Each year, with about a two-year lag, the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development computes the GDP share consumed by all taxes in its 34 member nations. The United States is always at the low end.

In 2007, it was fifth from the bottom, and in 2008, fourth from the bottom.

In the new 2009 data, it is trailed only by Chile and Mexico.

The median tax share of GDP for the countries in the table (note to dumbfucks and PMP - wait, I'm repeating myself: you'll have to click the link to see the table) is about 34 percent — or 42 percent higher than in the U.S.

That’s not surprising, for American taxes are somewhere around a post-World War II low.

Federal taxes, at about 15 percent of GDP, are the lowest since 1950.

That’s the sweet spot — just after the all-out postwar demobilization and just before the big tax impact of the Korean War and the Cold War arms buildup.

State and local taxes have been roughly flat as a share of GDP for almost 50 years.

Certainly, we need to maintain special vigilance over government spending. The “bridges to nowhere,” the subsidies to oil companies and big agriculture, all have a way of becoming permanent.

We need to keep an eagle eye out for entitlement cheats and ping-ponging testing scams in Medicare mills.

It’s worthwhile asking whether American safety requires spending more than the next 20 biggest military spenders combined.


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0411/52661.html#ixzz1J1kObgaQ

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Nice little shell game you've come up with, but it Epically FAILS.

You can't judge taxation based on GDP, most people don't even understand GDP. You can make a really neat (but irrelevant) chart, and it looks like Americans are getting off easy on taxes... but your chart fails to recognize our GDP is mammoth compared to most other countries. In fact, I am kinda surprised we aren't at the very bottom of the list, if that is the criteria you are using.

AND When the hell did this mindset develop, that we must constantly be comparing ourselves with other countries around the world? I don't give a shit how much tax someone pays in Venezuela! It makes NO difference to me, and it makes NO difference to my country! I don't care that America is not like France! I don't want to be like France! This is the United States of America, founded on principles of freedom and liberty for all, and the greatest liberating force ever known to mankind.

 

[Guns Guns Guns]

Nice little shell game you've come up with, but it Epically FAILS.

You can't judge taxation based on GDP, most people don't even understand GDP. You can make a really neat (but irrelevant) chart, and it looks like Americans are getting off easy on taxes... but your chart fails to recognize our GDP is mammoth compared to most other countries. In fact, I am kinda surprised we aren't at the very bottom of the list, if that is the criteria you are using.

AND When the hell did this mindset develop, that we must constantly be comparing ourselves with other countries around the world? I don't give a shit how much tax someone pays in Venezuela! It makes NO difference to me, and it makes NO difference to my country! I don't care that America is not like France! I don't want to be like France! This is the United States of America, founded on principles of freedom and liberty for all, and the greatest liberating force ever known to mankind.

So you don't understand GDP? Hardly surprising.

Here you go: http://www.investorwords.com/2153/GDP.html. No need to thank me.

I noted that you don't address the fact that our taxes are currently lower than they've been at any time since 1950. Care to dispute that?

How did you arrive at the conclusion that the US is "the greatest liberating force ever known to mankind" Certainly not by "comparing ourselves with other countries around the world"?

​

 

[Topspin]

always the fuckign students who can't even change thier diapers but they can speak to taxes.

Epicurious gaylord

 

[Rationalist]

Uhm, no they don't. Not unless they are insane economists on crack.

And obviously, you weren't familiar with the Laffer Curve or you wouldn't have made the smart ass comment about lowering taxes to .05%

Yawn...

http://www.justplainpolitics.com/sh...ribution&p=721935&highlight=laffer#post721935

 

[Guns Guns Guns]

​

Argle-bargle.​

​

Go join the Dix.​

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

I love it when people who are not rich defend tax cuts for the rich because they fear the rich will take their toys and leave. Thing is, when you look at outsourcing, downsizing, tax breaks....they already have left, in a fashion.

If you return the taxes to Clinton era, the rich will still be rich and more revenue will be added to the country's coffers.

and outsourcing is done why?

Probably nothing to do with the high corporate tax rates (which get passed on to consumers).

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

As for taxes.... we need a truly progressive tax code. Not the regressive one we have today. Raising tax rates looks great, right up until the wealthy, special interest groups/corps bribe their way to deductions and loopholes.


It is time for this country to become fiscally responsible. The national debt has increased every fiscal year since 1960. What has happened to the responsibility of the two parties? Both like to point the blame at the other, but in reality neither have been responsible fiscally. It is time for a change. Let’s begin with our tax code. It should be simple enough that the average person can understand it. It should not be filled with thousands of loopholes and deductions. Let us push for the flat tax with a standard deduction and nothing more.

Start with a standard deduction of $30k (adjusted for inflation annually) for each adult and then tax every dollar over that $30k at 20%. This is simple, easy to understand, fair and progressive. It protects the low-income individuals and couples from paying federal income taxes. It provides the middle-income families a lower effective tax rate than the wealthy. This plan would encompass ALL income, including earned income, capital gains and dividend income.

A person making $30k pays an effective rate of 0%.

A person making $50k pays an effective rate of 8%.

A person making $100k pays an effective rate of 14%.

A person making $200k pays en effective rate of 17%.

A person making $1mm pays an effective rate of 19.4%

Everyone has the same deduction and takes it. Which causes the effective tax rate to increase the more you make.

To reduce the national debt I would propose we add an additional temporary bracket to the flat tax. Every dollar over $1 million (again adjusted for inflation annually) would be taxed at 30% rather than 20%. The additional 10% would be mandated to pay down the debt.

It is our responsibility to pay our own way and not dump trillions of dollars of debt on future generations. We need to begin electing leaders that are fiscally responsible. The future of our nation depends upon it. We are our own worst enemy. It will be our ever-increasing debt that leads to our demise. We must act now.

Submit the above to your Senators and Representative.

Side note: the above means NO corporate income taxes.... that is one of the most regressive taxes we have. It hurts the middle and lower income families far more than the wealthy. The sooner the people learn this simple fact.... the better. The ignorance of the 'corporations are evil... tax them more' crowd needs to be resolved.

 

[Liberty]

Fine, then what services that are important to you are you willing to do with out? Cut military spending in half? Eliminate Social Security? Eliminate Medicare-Medicaid? You can't have your cake and eat it too.

I'm curious to see what happens to the military, but Social Security, Medicare-Medicaid, department of eduacation, the EPA, etc won't be around by the end of my life. It's only a matter of time.

The USA is broke.

 

[Bonestorm]

Here's a chart of what happens if we do absolutely nothing:

If we do nothing, we have no problem at all. The problem is that everyone wants to do stuff.

 

[Liberty]

Here's a chart of what happens if we do absolutely nothing:

If we do nothing, we have no problem at all. The problem is that everyone wants to do stuff.

?????

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Here's a chart of what happens if we do absolutely nothing:

If we do nothing, we have no problem at all. The problem is that everyone wants to do stuff.

Anybody wit a box of crayons can make a chart to show how everything is going to be just fine. I'm not sure what this was supposed to prove, hell, I can't even figure out what it's showing me! Here's a stat for ya though.... Our INTEREST on our debt (not the debt itself) will cost us more per year, than ALL military expenditures combined by 2016. The deficit for this year alone, is more than the total cost of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars combined. If our debt continues to grow at present rates, our children will have to pay 75% tax on each dollar made, to pay the interest on the debt.

Now you can run around with your little charts, crowing about how there is no problem here... but there is indeed a problem, and only someone who is completely ignorant of the facts, would even attempt to argue otherwise.