WOW!! Federal judge in TX declares obamacare UNCONSTITUTIONAL

Darth Beto Omar said:
The taxpayers are the payer. But you’re right: the ‘free’ part is an illusion.

Medicare for old folks is fine though. Especially, since they’ve paid into the system for decades. And if they would cut spending elsewhere it’s totally manageable. The problem is so many people want the government to provide everything from free healthcare to free tuition plus food stamps plus infrastructure plus etc.

Why aren’t politicians who advocate for that honest about it?
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Do you know what a medical school education costs in other countries.. and when those doctors take the ECFMG they score on par or higher than US doctors.
 
kudzu said:
80% of Americans didn't have healthcare.
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I might as well be one of them lol.

Ten years ago I never worried about my deductible. It’s insane now. If I crash my mountain bike and break an arm it would set me back considerably. I used to not worry about that. One of my doc buddies would fix me for free but the hospital is forced to treat employees like everyone else because reimbursements are fallen off. It used to be an unwritten benefit to have your bill waived off if you were an employee—but those days are gone.

Thanks, Obama.

People who have health insurance are *excluding themselves* from the market because they don’t want to pay a high deductible for the MRI that’s required before insurance will cover their elective shoulder surgery—or whatever.

The whole system is on a steady decline. And it wasn’t like it was ‘broke’ before.
 
Darth Beto Omar said:
I might as well be one of them lol.

Ten years ago I never worried about my deductible. It’s insane now. If I crash my mountain bike and break an arm it would set me back considerably. I used to not worry about that. One of my doc buddies would fix me for free but the hospital is forced to treat employees like everyone else because reimbursements are fallen off. It used to be an unwritten benefit to have your bill waived off if you were an employee—but those days are gone.

Thanks, Obama.

People who have health insurance are *excluding themselves* from the market because they don’t want to pay a high deductible for the MRI that’s required before insurance will cover their elective shoulder surgery—or whatever.

The whole system is on a steady decline. And it wasn’t like it was ‘broke’ before.
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You have completely missed the point.. The price of healthcare was increasing exponentially decades before Obama. HMOs, PPOs, various insurance carriers added more than 39% in administrative costs that have NOTHING to do with patient care.
 
distraff said:
I personally agree with Justice Roberts that the fine in the Individual Mandate works as a tax, and I myself paid that fine/tax myself last year. It was just added to my April 15th bill. Also, the individual mandate has already been repealed by congress a few months ago, while the rest of the law has been kept in tact, so I don't see how striking down the mandate hurts the law any more than currently.

Personally, I am not a big fan of Obamacare, and while it is somewhat better than before, it didn't come close to fixing our healthcare system at all. If Obamacare is struck down, this will create such a political crisis with millions becoming uninsured and the loss of pre-existing conditions protections. I don't even know if congress can get a compromise together. I think this crisis will result in a Medicare for All solution to emerge in the early 2020s.
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Sure...it was a foundation that was meant to be built upon.

But the ACA was never allowed to exist as written, once the House started de funding key aspects of the plan.

As such, we saw hikes in premiums, which were to be expected once the Fed. guarantees to insurers were never granted. We can only wonder where we'd be right now if House Republicans didn't politicize the law.

But none of us can be a 'fan', or 'not a fan' of ACA. We never got to experience it in its actual form.
 
Apple Lung-Li-Chiao said:
That's your insurance company, not Obamacare. If you want to complain, complain about the insurance companies.
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True to a point, and also worth noting is that many employers are to blame. The vast majority of people in this nation know very little about the cost of health insurance. When ACA was passed, a vast number of employers simply passed more of the insurance costs onto the employees, and blamed ACA.

It was a lie, but they took the opportunity to cut their expenses.
 
distraff said:
You can't go back. We have a much older population, higher obesity, more expensive technology, and healthcare providers who know they can get customers at a higher price. There ain't no going back to the 50s.

If you get the government out of healthcare, then you won't be paying those payroll taxes but you will still have to pay those ridiculous healthcare premiums which keep going up every year. Personally I'd keep the payroll taxes and ditch the healthcare premiums, deductibles, and out of pocket.
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Or something in between. Start with a public option, and give insurance companies some competition
 
distraff said:
Actually those higher prices are a result of lower price elasticity in the healthcare market. If you remove the government from the equation, then you just have healthcare companies dealing with hospitals (providers) and pharmaceutical companies, and that doesn't fix the cost problem at all, because thats what most people deal with anyway and their healthcare is very expensive. Hospitals charge 3.5 times the cost of care, American doctors are paid like small CEOs, and hospitals and drug companies earn 15% profit margins, .... and tylenol in hospitals cost $35 per pill.
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I used to be angry about that, until I started dating a nurse. At $45/hour, if a nurse spends 15 minutes with a patient, that's more than $10 in labor...if she isn't getting paid overtime.

Then you have to pay the staff to mop the floor. Then you have utilities, etc.

Don't get me wrong. I don't advocate for $20 aspirin. (of course, the insurers never pay that). I just understand it.
 
Kacper said:
Not necessarily. Many plans got killed off because of Obamacare leaving the insured no choice but to switch to another plan. I know a few people that happened to. I cannot change policies without being forbidden to re-enter the policy I am in because it is grandfathered in. At least that was the case up until this year. Not sure how the law changes will affect my insurer's ability to offer the high deductible HSA account policies now. Ironically, my ramp isn't nearly as bad as some of the bronze care policies and my per year out of pocket cap is much lower than some of them. I have a 2500 deductible with a 3800 out of pocket/person cap policy.
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I don't know if that qualifies for a HSA contribution? Sounds like a Silver plan
 
Darth Beto Omar said:
The taxpayers are the payer. But you’re right: the ‘free’ part is an illusion.

Medicare for old folks is fine though. Especially, since they’ve paid into the system for decades. And if they would cut spending elsewhere it’s totally manageable. The problem is so many people want the government to provide everything from free healthcare to free tuition plus food stamps plus infrastructure plus etc.

Why aren’t politicians who advocate for that honest about it?
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Take a guess...how many transactions occur on Wall St. every day? You might not believe it.

A $.25 fee on every transaction will more than pay for Single Payer
 
Althea said:
That's one way. Unfortunately, that means self employed people will get hammered. We currently pay both halves of FICA...app. 16%
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You're right.. I hadn't thought of that.

We could make investing in people a priority????

The Spanish Empire fell apart because they horded gold and didn't invest in the Spanish people.
 
Althea said:
I used to be angry about that, until I started dating a nurse. At $45/hour, if a nurse spends 15 minutes with a patient, that's more than $10 in labor...if she isn't getting paid overtime.

Then you have to pay the staff to mop the floor. Then you have utilities, etc.

Don't get me wrong. I don't advocate for $20 aspirin. (of course, the insurers never pay that). I just understand it.
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$20 Aspirin is about COST SHIFTING........
 
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