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the proof Bush team Knew Iraq had no weapons in 2002
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Paula Jones would have never pursued it if she hadn't been contacted by certain conservatives to help bring him down.
She later posed for "Playboy", got a nose job and probably a nice Swiss bank account...I don't feel sorry for her one bit! I do feel sorry for women who are honestly harrassed by their bosses.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
It has nothing to do with having a king, it's a matter of executive powers, placed in the presidency by the founding fathers. Yes, Congress retains the right to declare and fund wars, but the decision to invade or attack a country, or anything else, is left solely with the commander in chief. I am not making this point to debate this point, or whether Congress should always be the ones to authorize wars, I am showing that there was no tenable justification for Bush to lie. He simply didn't need to concoct a lie about Iraq to levy military actions. If you would like examples, I can cite plenty, but the president doesn't need Congressional approval to engage in military action against anyone.
The premise that Bush "lied us into war" is flawed, there was no tenable reason for Bush to lie about Iraq. Under the executive powers of his office, he could have ordered the militarily to invade and occupied Iraq without approval from anyone else. Once troops are deployed, no politician is going to leave them stranded without funding, it would be political suicide.
Beefy
Worst gambler ever
This is so intellectually dishonest its beyond belief. You really believe that W could have waged his dream war without selling it to the public first? You really think that being the Commander in Chief would have gotten him this beloved war as it stands without a sales pitch? Either you have no understanding whatsoever of politics (which may be the case considering your opinion that Hussein would disarm in the face of invasion), or you're being dishonest (which may be the case considering the fact that you spin faster than a neutron pulsar).
maineman
Banned
DIxie, of course, refused to acknowledge the political reality of America. Presidents don't NEED public opinion to do a lot of things... but they do need public opinion to do a lot of things and get reelected or do a lot of things and have their party hold on to whatever seats it has in congress.
No one is doubting the fact that George Bush could have invaded Mongolia with the 82nd Airborne for no other reason that he wanted to capture a bunch of chefs skilled in the preparation of mongolian barbeque..... that is certainly within his powers as commander in chief. What is missing from Dixie's vapid analysis is the FACT that were Bush to invade Mongolia for that reason alone in his first term in office, he would guarantee that it would be his only term in office and he would similarly guarantee that his party would lose a whopping number of seats in Congress....
which is why Bush WAS compelled to lie... about Saddam's Weapons of Mass Destruction and his alliance with Al Qaeda... because Bush wanted to invade Iraq AND have his party increase seats in the mid term elections AND he wanted to get reelected... AND he wanted to have his party maintain seats in the SECOND midterm election AND he wanted to set the stage for another republican to waltz into the White House in 2008 on the coattails of his powerful and successful wartime accomplishments.
He was able to invade...he was able to gain seats in the first midterm..and he was able to get reelected.... but then, the people started realizing that the emporer wasn't wearing any clothes....the people began to wake up and rub the faux patriotism out of their eyes and realize that:
there really were no WMD's and there really were no connections between Iraq and Al Qaeda or 9/11...that this war had cost them an unbelievable price in life, limb and treasure and that it had not made us any safer and it had not gotten us any closer to finding and defeating the people who attacked us and it had only served to make us fewer, poorer, more despised and less safe then before we invaded and that our meddling had started a terrible sectarian civil war in motion that threatens to engulf not only Iraq but the entire middle east...
and when the people began to realize this, they stopped his agenda at the second midterm high water mark. They ripped control of congress away from him and, in response to that political bitchslap, this complete deaf moron of a president failed to listen to the message the people sent him in that election and he is going to throw more troops into the fray in Baghdad and Anbar because he somehow is convinced that if he repeats his previous disasterous strategy with even MORE American lives in the cross hairs, that somehow it will be completely different this time.
I have said it before but I will say it again: I will do my best to live a healthy lifestyle if for no other reason than to outlive George W. Bush... so that I can travel - no matter how frail I may be or close to death - to his grave site so that I can deposit a stream of hot piss on his grave. I firmly believe that NO man in my lifetime has done more egregious harm to this wonderful country that I served for so long than George W. Motherfucking Bush....may he rot in hell and may he do so damp with my piss when he get there.
No one is doubting the fact that George Bush could have invaded Mongolia with the 82nd Airborne for no other reason that he wanted to capture a bunch of chefs skilled in the preparation of mongolian barbeque..... that is certainly within his powers as commander in chief. What is missing from Dixie's vapid analysis is the FACT that were Bush to invade Mongolia for that reason alone in his first term in office, he would guarantee that it would be his only term in office and he would similarly guarantee that his party would lose a whopping number of seats in Congress....
which is why Bush WAS compelled to lie... about Saddam's Weapons of Mass Destruction and his alliance with Al Qaeda... because Bush wanted to invade Iraq AND have his party increase seats in the mid term elections AND he wanted to get reelected... AND he wanted to have his party maintain seats in the SECOND midterm election AND he wanted to set the stage for another republican to waltz into the White House in 2008 on the coattails of his powerful and successful wartime accomplishments.
He was able to invade...he was able to gain seats in the first midterm..and he was able to get reelected.... but then, the people started realizing that the emporer wasn't wearing any clothes....the people began to wake up and rub the faux patriotism out of their eyes and realize that:
there really were no WMD's and there really were no connections between Iraq and Al Qaeda or 9/11...that this war had cost them an unbelievable price in life, limb and treasure and that it had not made us any safer and it had not gotten us any closer to finding and defeating the people who attacked us and it had only served to make us fewer, poorer, more despised and less safe then before we invaded and that our meddling had started a terrible sectarian civil war in motion that threatens to engulf not only Iraq but the entire middle east...
and when the people began to realize this, they stopped his agenda at the second midterm high water mark. They ripped control of congress away from him and, in response to that political bitchslap, this complete deaf moron of a president failed to listen to the message the people sent him in that election and he is going to throw more troops into the fray in Baghdad and Anbar because he somehow is convinced that if he repeats his previous disasterous strategy with even MORE American lives in the cross hairs, that somehow it will be completely different this time.
I have said it before but I will say it again: I will do my best to live a healthy lifestyle if for no other reason than to outlive George W. Bush... so that I can travel - no matter how frail I may be or close to death - to his grave site so that I can deposit a stream of hot piss on his grave. I firmly believe that NO man in my lifetime has done more egregious harm to this wonderful country that I served for so long than George W. Motherfucking Bush....may he rot in hell and may he do so damp with my piss when he get there.
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maineman
Banned
Dixie sez:
"Men who cheat on their wives, and more importantly, forsake their vows to God, are not men of very high moral character. Men who are accused of sexual assault on numerous women, to the most extreme degrees, are not generally considered any more than a scoundrel."
I assume that you will NOT be voting for Newt Gingrich then, if he gets your party's nomination for president in '08?
"Men who cheat on their wives, and more importantly, forsake their vows to God, are not men of very high moral character. Men who are accused of sexual assault on numerous women, to the most extreme degrees, are not generally considered any more than a scoundrel."
I assume that you will NOT be voting for Newt Gingrich then, if he gets your party's nomination for president in '08?
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Thanks, I have a big day on Friday and after that it will be touch and go, but I hope to be more touch than go!
I am unemployed now! Don't know how to act...I have worked since I was 13!
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So, if Bush didn't need to lie us into a war, then why the hell did he need to sway public opinion with his great exaggerations?
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
This is so intellectually dishonest its beyond belief. You really believe that W could have waged his dream war without selling it to the public first? You really think that being the Commander in Chief would have gotten him this beloved war as it stands without a sales pitch?
We do in fact have a war, and what has Bush got, besides this 'sales pitch'? Sell it to the public? When did that happen? The public, by and large, is always opposed to war.
What you are saying is... Bush knowing told America a lie to take us to war, realizing full well, that the public would eventually discover the lie, because he thought this was better than utilizing his executive authority granted to him in the Constitution, and just doing what he felt needed to be done at the moment.
As I said, he had no tenable reason to lie. He didn't need public approval to engage militarily in Iraq, he didn't even need the approval of Congress, there was no need for a sales pitch, the president has the authority to command the military as he sees fit. Now, would there have been political ramifications? Well, that is a different debate, but the point is, Bush could have done it that way, he didn't have to make the sales pitch.
This is important to understand, because it goes to the heart of principle. People don't lie for no reason, there has to be a tenable reason for the lie, or the person has to be a habitual liar, like Maine and Prissy. Bush had no reason to tell a lie to sell the war, he could have waged war without a sales pitch, he has that Constitutional authority as commander in chief.
You want to argue that he would have had hell to pay, if he had taken that route, but look around you... do you mean a different variety of hell?
We do in fact have a war, and what has Bush got, besides this 'sales pitch'? Sell it to the public? When did that happen? The public, by and large, is always opposed to war.
What you are saying is... Bush knowing told America a lie to take us to war, realizing full well, that the public would eventually discover the lie, because he thought this was better than utilizing his executive authority granted to him in the Constitution, and just doing what he felt needed to be done at the moment.
As I said, he had no tenable reason to lie. He didn't need public approval to engage militarily in Iraq, he didn't even need the approval of Congress, there was no need for a sales pitch, the president has the authority to command the military as he sees fit. Now, would there have been political ramifications? Well, that is a different debate, but the point is, Bush could have done it that way, he didn't have to make the sales pitch.
This is important to understand, because it goes to the heart of principle. People don't lie for no reason, there has to be a tenable reason for the lie, or the person has to be a habitual liar, like Maine and Prissy. Bush had no reason to tell a lie to sell the war, he could have waged war without a sales pitch, he has that Constitutional authority as commander in chief.
You want to argue that he would have had hell to pay, if he had taken that route, but look around you... do you mean a different variety of hell?
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
So, if Bush didn't need to lie us into a war, then why the hell did he need to sway public opinion with his great exaggerations?
You know, I really think Bush has always made the mistake of thinking he could appeal to your liberal hearts, not realizing they are fake. He honestly thought you would have some compassion for the oppressed people of Iraq being murdered and dumped into mass graves by the Butcher of Baghdad.
Exaggerations? What? Like "mushroom clouds"? Hey sister, it ain't over with yet... rumor has it, the nukes are already in this country. I wish I could say it's going to be satisfying watching you eat your words, but it won't be. We are in for some deep shit ahead, and mark my words, America ain't ready for it.
You know, I really think Bush has always made the mistake of thinking he could appeal to your liberal hearts, not realizing they are fake. He honestly thought you would have some compassion for the oppressed people of Iraq being murdered and dumped into mass graves by the Butcher of Baghdad.
Exaggerations? What? Like "mushroom clouds"? Hey sister, it ain't over with yet... rumor has it, the nukes are already in this country. I wish I could say it's going to be satisfying watching you eat your words, but it won't be. We are in for some deep shit ahead, and mark my words, America ain't ready for it.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
because Bush wanted to invade Iraq AND have his party increase seats in the mid term elections AND he wanted to get reelected
So he told, what he knew was a lie, understanding that it would most certainly be discovered and his party would lose control of Congress and he would likely be impeached? Bush is more stupid that you've made him out to be!
Again, Bush had no reason to lie. He had enormous approval ratings after 9/11, and if he had taken unilateral action against Iraq in the wake of 9/11, he would have gotten away with it, without so much as a whimper from Tom Daschle. Clinton ordered military strikes on Iraq without approval from Congress, or the UN, or any fucking body else! PRESIDENTS CAN DO THAT!
So he told, what he knew was a lie, understanding that it would most certainly be discovered and his party would lose control of Congress and he would likely be impeached? Bush is more stupid that you've made him out to be!
Again, Bush had no reason to lie. He had enormous approval ratings after 9/11, and if he had taken unilateral action against Iraq in the wake of 9/11, he would have gotten away with it, without so much as a whimper from Tom Daschle. Clinton ordered military strikes on Iraq without approval from Congress, or the UN, or any fucking body else! PRESIDENTS CAN DO THAT!
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
No one is doubting the fact that George Bush could have invaded Mongolia with the 82nd Airborne for no other reason that he wanted to capture a bunch of chefs skilled in the preparation of mongolian barbeque..... that is certainly within his powers as commander in chief.
GREAT! You agree with the point! There was no tenable reason for Bush to concoct a lie to send the military into Iraq! THANKS!
Yes, if Bush wanted to capture Mongolians to do a barbecue in Crawford, he wouldn't have to make up some elaborate story about the Mongolians being connected to terror or having dangerous weapons, he wouldn't have to convince Tony Blair to go along with it, he wouldn't spend 14 months jumping through hoops at the UN, trying to convince them of his lies, knowing full well, the lies would eventually be discovered... this would be stupid beyond belief, when all he would have to do is give the executive order. Now... you argue, he would not get re-elected and his Congress would suffer, but... would this be less or more than the inevitable discovery of the lies would cause?
Again, we are back to the point... Bush had no reason to lie.
GREAT! You agree with the point! There was no tenable reason for Bush to concoct a lie to send the military into Iraq! THANKS!
Yes, if Bush wanted to capture Mongolians to do a barbecue in Crawford, he wouldn't have to make up some elaborate story about the Mongolians being connected to terror or having dangerous weapons, he wouldn't have to convince Tony Blair to go along with it, he wouldn't spend 14 months jumping through hoops at the UN, trying to convince them of his lies, knowing full well, the lies would eventually be discovered... this would be stupid beyond belief, when all he would have to do is give the executive order. Now... you argue, he would not get re-elected and his Congress would suffer, but... would this be less or more than the inevitable discovery of the lies would cause?
Again, we are back to the point... Bush had no reason to lie.
maineman
Banned
talking with you begins to resemble running around in circles with a moron. I'm out of this one...
I like Dix, I think he is a true advocate for his cause, whatever it might be. Unlike me, who will sometimes begin posting as a Devil's Advocate...
Each of the people have their good points that make the site interesting.
maineman
Banned
spoken like a true politician