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[Rune]

Nice Yurt demolition.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Give him a minute, he will once again return and tell me how I haven't addressed any of his questions/points.

 

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TE=Superfreak;876319]It is not that you have different beliefs you idiot. It is just as I stated.... YOU TELLING MUSLIMS THAT THEY DO NOT BELIEVE IN THE GOD OF ABRAHAM WHEN 1.2 BILLION OF THEM WILL TELL YOU THEY DO. That is where you are intolerant you fucking idiot. You are saying they MUST be wrong. They MUST not believe in the God of Abraham because YOU say so. THAT is where you are a bigot you fucking hack.

does islam tell christians and jews that our beliefs are wrong? islam claims god did not have a son, because they say so. they are saying i'm wrong to believe he had a son. how is it they are not "bigoted" in their beliefs?

Again you fucking idiot.... go back and read the thread. I didn't ignore that. I addressed it. Do I need to post the exact post numbers on this issue as well? Do you really need me to make you look even more foolish than you already do?

As I stated earlier... the quote:

1) was written over 1000 years ago
2) It was written by Mohammed, not ALL Muslims. Thus your question asking if ALL Muslims were bigots because of one quote was answered with a resounding NO.
3) The quote you posted stated that Jews and Christians altered the "WORD of GOD".... Meaning they wrote the story of God down incorrectly. The quote does not state that Jews and Christians ALTERED GOD himself. Nor do the Muslims claim that Jews and Christians do not believe in the God of Abraham.

4) You are clearly a bigot and a fool.

1. and it was written over 1000 years ago that god had a son.
2. it was written by the authors of the NT. and again, muhammad did not "write" it, he stated it, others wrote it. get your facts straight.
3. by saying god had a son, i have altered god in their religion. to alter the words of god is a grave sin in their religion. it is equivalent to my claim.
4. no, you are the ignorant bigot based upon your deluded reasoning.

This is the same stupid shit ditzie posts. Tell us Yurtle.... HOW do you know what it is that God told ANY of them? ALL of the accounts were written by MEN. MEN who were writing from a perspective of their own BELIEFS. Just because the STORIES are different, doesn't mean they aren't talking about the same God.

tell me superspazz, how do muslims know they are right? oh thats right, they can hold their beliefs and not be bigots, but christians are bigots for not believing the quran.

Your links, AS I STATED WHEN YOU POSTED THEM, WHICH CLEARLY YOU AGAIN IGNORED.... show differences in the STORIES men wrote about God. Funny how you keep claiming I ignored things, when all you have to do is go back and read the thread to see that I already addressed those 'points'.

the differences are alteration of WHO god is. that you can't accept that shows me that you are either unwilling to admit you're wrong or are you are extremely ignorant.

Again, your BIGOTRY leads you to proclaim Muslims do not believe in the same God, because the stories/beliefs are different. Yet you turn right around and proclaim that Jews and Christians DO believe in the same God all the while ignoring the vast differences in those two religions. Just as ditzie does

you're once again spazzing be repeating ad nauseum that i'm a bigot when you have no shown i am. they don't believe in the christian word of god. yet, you claim that is not bigoted. you claim i am bigot for not believing in allah. that is absurd. the differences between christianity and the jewish faith is dissimilar to the islamic faith. the islamic faith claimed to change the entire word of god as known by jews and christians. except for some christian beliefs, christians have no changed the jewish texts, they merely expand with the NT and uphold the jewish texts. that is a huge disparity between islam which claims the NT is not valid and that the jews changed their texts about who god is.

here is where i think you are hung up:

you believe it is not bigoted to claim one changed the word of god, but, you believe it is bigoted to state a belief that islam altered who god is. if you think about it, the beliefs are similar if not identical. one is about the word, the other is about the diety. if you change the word, you have changed who the diety is. that is what i claim, that islam changed who the diety is through the statements of muhammad and through their religious texts. as you can see, your attempt at differentiating the two falls short and makes zero sense.

 

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Nice Yurt demolition.

care to go bat and defend your hero SF? i doubt it, you're pussed out of the i.q. challenge as soon as i expected.

 

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does islam tell christians and jews that our beliefs are wrong? islam claims god did not have a son, because they say so. they are saying i'm wrong to believe he had a son. how is it they are not "bigoted" in their beliefs?

Again dear yurt... You are not a bigot for having different beliefs. you are a bigot for proclaiming their God is not the God of Abraham. THAT is a FACT. All three religions were founded on the God of Abraham. IT (for the final time) is the STORIES that are different. AGAIN (for the final time), you are a BIGOT because you proclaim Muslims do not believe in the God of Abraham because of their different views, yet you in the same breath state the Jews DO. Yet BOTH Jews AND Muslims DO NOT believe the God of Abraham had a son.

You then attempt to make excuses for why it is OK for Jews to have different beliefs despite the differences, yet do not accord the same respect to Muslims. THAT is where you are a bigot.

1. and it was written over 1000 years ago that god had a son.

Exactly... it was a story written a long time ago. AS I stated before and this is the last time.... I would NOT hold every Muslim accountable for what was written 1000 years ago. I would especially not hold them accountable for stating that Jews and Christians WROTE DOWN THE STORY WRONG, any more than I would hold every Christian accountable for some passage from the Bible.

2. it was written by the authors of the NT. and again, muhammad did not "write" it, he stated it, others wrote it. get your facts straight.

Which makes my case even stronger. It was WRITTEN BY OTHER MEN. As was the bible. Idiot.

3. by saying god had a son, i have altered god in their religion. to alter the words of god is a grave sin in their religion. it is equivalent to my claim.

Now you are just making excuses to try and escape your bigotry.

4. no, you are the ignorant bigot based upon your deluded reasoning.

Poor lil spaz....

tell me superspazz, how do muslims know they are right? oh thats right, they can hold their beliefs and not be bigots, but christians are bigots for not believing the quran.

seriously, do you READ anything that is written or do you just make dumb comments based on what you WANT me to have said???

AS I stated.... NO ONE KNOWS for SURE what GOD told ANY OF THEM. THAT is why it is called FAITH.

the differences are alteration of WHO god is. that you can't accept that shows me that you are either unwilling to admit you're wrong or are you are extremely ignorant.

NO, it did not. The Jews, Muslims and Christians ALL believe in the God of Abraham. All three state that. Your links just showed the differences in STORIES written by MEN. AS I stated before and you again fucking ignored.

you're once again spazzing be repeating ad nauseum that i'm a bigot when you have no shown i am.

Again.... the proof is in this you idiot.....

HOW can you proclaim that Muslims don't believe in the God of Abraham (based on differences in stories/beliefs) while at the same time state that the Jews DO believe in the same God (despite THEIR vast differences in beliefs/stories)???

You are not holding everyone to the same standard. THAT is bigoted.

Telling Muslims that they do not believe in the God of Abraham is bigoted. Because you are telling them what YOU think THEIR beliefs are. It is not the same thing as their saying they do not believe in the son of God. It would be the same if they told you that you do not believe in the son of God after you stating that you do.

they don't believe in the christian word of god. yet, you claim that is not bigoted. you claim i am bigot for not believing in allah. that is absurd. the differences between christianity and the jewish faith is dissimilar to the islamic faith. the islamic faith claimed to change the entire word of god as known by jews and christians.

ROFLMAO.... now your desperation is showing. They did not claim to change the entire word of God you dolt. They believe in many of the same things. Christianity and Islam share much common ground. Both trace
their roots to Abraham. Both believe in prophecy, God's messengers (apostles), revelation, scripture, the resurrection of dead, and the centrality of religious community. They have just as much in common as the Christians do to the Jews. In addition, they unlike the Jews also believe Jesus was born to the virgin Mary.

except for some christian beliefs, christians have no changed the jewish texts, they merely expand with the NT and uphold the jewish texts. that is a huge disparity between islam which claims the NT is not valid and that the jews changed their texts about who god is.

the New Testament is what to the Jews?

you believe it is not bigoted to claim one changed the word of god, but, you believe it is bigoted to state a belief that islam altered who god is. if you think about it, the beliefs are similar if not identical. one is about the word, the other is about the diety. if you change the word, you have changed who the diety is.

The above is why you continue making yourself look foolish. Saying that MAN wrote down the story wrong does not CHANGE the entity. You are saying they have the power to change the entity simply by telling the story different. THAT simply changes the STORY. It DOES NOT CHANGE WHO THE STORY IS WRITTEN ABOUT.

I go back again to the analogy of Obama. If Dung proclaims Obama is the messiah and Ditzie proclaims he is the devil..... ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT THE SAME ENTITY.... DESPITE HAVING DIFFERENT STORIES?

Answer that one simple question Yurt.

 

[poet]

Again dear yurt... You are not a bigot for having different beliefs. you are a bigot for proclaiming their God is not the God of Abraham. THAT is a FACT. All three religions were founded on the God of Abraham. IT (for the final time) is the STORIES that are different. AGAIN (for the final time), you are a BIGOT because you proclaim Muslims do not believe in the God of Abraham because of their different views, yet you in the same breath state the Jews DO. Yet BOTH Jews AND Muslims DO NOT believe the God of Abraham had a son.

You then attempt to make excuses for why it is OK for Jews to have different beliefs despite the differences, yet do not accord the same respect to Muslims. THAT is where you are a bigot.



Exactly... it was a story written a long time ago. AS I stated before and this is the last time.... I would NOT hold every Muslim accountable for what was written 1000 years ago. I would especially not hold them accountable for stating that Jews and Christians WROTE DOWN THE STORY WRONG, any more than I would hold every Christian accountable for some passage from the Bible.



Which makes my case even stronger. It was WRITTEN BY OTHER MEN. As was the bible. Idiot.



Now you are just making excuses to try and escape your bigotry.



Poor lil spaz....



seriously, do you READ anything that is written or do you just make dumb comments based on what you WANT me to have said???

AS I stated.... NO ONE KNOWS for SURE what GOD told ANY OF THEM. THAT is why it is called FAITH.



NO, it did not. The Jews, Muslims and Christians ALL believe in the God of Abraham. All three state that. Your links just showed the differences in STORIES written by MEN. AS I stated before and you again fucking ignored.




Again.... the proof is in this you idiot.....

HOW can you proclaim that Muslims don't believe in the God of Abraham (based on differences in stories/beliefs) while at the same time state that the Jews DO believe in the same God (despite THEIR vast differences in beliefs/stories)???

You are not holding everyone to the same standard. THAT is bigoted.

Telling Muslims that they do not believe in the God of Abraham is bigoted. Because you are telling them what YOU think THEIR beliefs are. It is not the same thing as their saying they do not believe in the son of God. It would be the same if they told you that you do not believe in the son of God after you stating that you do.



ROFLMAO.... now your desperation is showing. They did not claim to change the entire word of God you dolt. They believe in many of the same things. Christianity and Islam share much common ground. Both trace
their roots to Abraham. Both believe in prophecy, God's messengers (apostles), revelation, scripture, the resurrection of dead, and the centrality of religious community. They have just as much in common as the Christians do to the Jews. In addition, they unlike the Jews also believe Jesus was born to the virgin Mary.



the New Testament is what to the Jews?




The above is why you continue making yourself look foolish. Saying that MAN wrote down the story wrong does not CHANGE the entity. You are saying they have the power to change the entity simply by telling the story different. THAT simply changes the STORY. It DOES NOT CHANGE WHO THE STORY IS WRITTEN ABOUT.

I go back again to the analogy of Obama. If Dung proclaims Obama is the messiah and Ditzie proclaims he is the devil..... ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT THE SAME ENTITY.... DESPITE HAVING DIFFERENT STORIES?

Answer that one simple question Yurt.

I long ago placed Yurt on ignore. He has nothing of substance to offer.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Sorry pinhead ditzie.... but your 'logic' has been trashed.

Sorry SF, but you're full of shit and full of yourself.... which is the same thing.

LMAO... this is why people mock you ditzie... because the above is simply false. You posted scripture and told us it is the word of God and Christians have to believe the Bible in order to be Christians. I then posted scripture from the SAME book of the Bible and ASK you if Christians must also believe them. THIS is the point where you run and hide and proclaim you don't want a theological discussion.

Because when you start to debate what the Bible says and what Christians believe, it is a theological argument. I didn't do that. I didn't quote scripture or post anything about Christians having to believe any particular interpretation, in fact, I went quite out of my way to clarify this was not the case, and that Christians believe all kinds of things, that's why there are thousands of denominations within the religion. No part of the Bible that I am aware of, is interpreted by ANY Christian to mean, you can pick and choose which parts of the Bible to believe, and which parts not to believe. I simply pointed that fact out, it's not something that can be argued, really... unless you are pinhead who wants to twist and contort what was said.

The fact that you cannot see why this makes you an idiot, makes it all the more amusing for the rest of us.

Rest of us? Who is that? Looks like Yurt is taking chunks out of that ass just as I am, and most of the other geniuses have decided this thread is way over their little heads, so looks like you're pretty much on your own here. You might get a few chortles of support in the form of a smart-ass comment or two from the peanut gallery, but as for substance and fact.... you ain't got none.

Yet you cannot show one post where I am displaying my hatred for Christianity? Not one? Even though 'every post I make here drips in it'?LMAO.... seriously, you provide much amusement with stupid comments like the above. You don't hate them or their religion, you just continue to tell 1.2 Billion Muslims that their religion is a sham and a fraud. You.... Mr. tolerance himself.... swear to Allah/God.... you are the dumbest poster here.

Your very line of argument in this thread, is evidence of your revile and hatred for Christianity. When you use phrases like "got it right" ...applied to early Christians understandings of God... that in itself is an indication of the CONTEMPT you have for Christian faith... there was no "got it right" because there was never anything to "got" about it... Christians believe God spoke to Abraham, and the words are documented... there is nothing to GET about it... you either believe God spoke to Abraham and said these words, or you DON'T! It makes you a Christian follower, or not a Christian follower. There never was a "get" to it... I can make you "get" what Christianity is about, that is a personal choice you have to make, as Christianity is a religion of acceptance. I am not here to recruit you to Christianity, I don't care what you personally want to believe, that is entirely up to you. Islam came many centuries later, and made claims that what God said to Abraham was something completely different, but the Christians and Jews lied to everyone about it. The way they explained it was contradictory to historic events we know happened, but billions of Muslim faithful have been kept ignorant of, for many years, even to this day. As I pointed out... the eventual followers of Islam, were worshiping multiple Gods when Christianity was formed. The earliest Muslims were actually called "Moo-slem" because they worshiped the God of the Moon, and instructed their followers that Jews, Christians, and others, worshiped inferior Gods. Mohamed emerged, and changed Islam into an Abrahamic religious belief, with his claim (totally unsubstantiated) that he was a descendant of Abraham... before this, Abraham's God was inferior to Mooslems, remember? But with this prophet of Allah, and the tie to Abraham, along with some creative re-writing of history and unbelievable longevity of ancestral generations, the story was re-told in the Islamic form. The entire religion, from the inception... is a FRAUD! A cheap knock-off of Christianity.

And Christians formed their religion centuries after other religions and took many of the myths of those religions and turned them into new stories written in the bible.

Christians did not form their religion out of contempt for another established religious belief. Islam did.
Christians did not attempt to re-write history or change known historical dates and facts. Islam has.

A lot of stories written in both the Bible and the Koran are age old stories passed down for centuries, and are the same... just different perspectives. As I said, Islam was patterned after Christianity, a cheap knock-off, a counterfeit religion.

you want me to 'disprove' your bullshit claims that Islam was created by Mohammad to destroy Christianity/Judaism??? You forget that historical records also show centuries of aggressive intolerance from Christians towards those who did not believe in Christianity. Or are you going to pretend those FACTS didn't occur? Are you going to pretend those Christians didn't lead any wars against Muslims?

This is why you should try to read my posts thoroughly, and you will find that I have repeatedly stated that I am not debating the goodness or righteousness of Christianity. Why do you think pointing out Christianity's darker side in history, somehow nullifies the fact that Islam was established to destroy Judaism and Christianity? It's two completely separate arguments you are trying to roll into one, by turning the worm... making this a theological debate. There's no question Christians have done things through history to piss people off... else, there wouldn't be billions of Muslims, would there? Does this change historical facts? Does this justify Islam distorting history to enable their religion of hate? I think not.

Like I stated long ago... you are a bigot... just like Yurt.

Bigotry is the belief that your idea or thought is the correct one, and everyone who disagrees is wrong... (or has "seriously flawed logic.")

The point ditzie is you continue to proclaim that ISLAM is a 'fraud/sham'.... you ARE saying that they 'got it wrong'. YET ALL of those religions are based on texts written by MAN based on those MEN's INTERPRETATIONS of what God/Allah was telling them.

yet.... he doesn't think he ever posts anything that could remotely be construed as hatred of religion... noooo.... sugar won't melt in his mouth!

You tell on your agnostic self here, SF.

You have proclaimed that Jews were promised the land which we now call Israel. You have stated it was 'mandated by God' and it was done so in the Bible 'the WORD OF GOD' and was talked about in stories for 1000's of years. Thus it must be true.

LMAOooo... NOOO! I did not proclaim that Jews were promised land, that was GOD to ABRAHAM! ...circa... a long fucking time ago! I don't personally know if it is true or not, I am not debating theological point of order, just historical point of order. Supposedly, God spoke to Abraham, and the sons of Abraham brought forth the religious beliefs now associated with Judaism and Christianity, however... Islam came centuries later on a dubious claim from a adulterer and liar, that he was a descendant of Abraham, and the entire teachings were misinterpreted. He convinced a bunch of Moon Worshipers he was telling the truth, and thus was born Islam.

This is where your lack of intellect continues to hit you with a roadblock.

1) The Bible, The Quran, The Tanakh...... all were written by MEN. All were accounts from those MEN about what God told them.

Yep, and there are many more theological documents as well, we could go through all of those and what they say, but that would be a theological debate, which we aren't having here. Apparently, according to Mohamed, God told Abraham to kill all the Jews and Infidels, because that's what the Muslims believe. I find it hard to think God told Abraham this, and further harder to believe that he would send Jesus to bring a message of hope, love, charity, etc. So if I believe in Allah, the God of Islam, I can't believe in the God of Abraham, they diametrically contradict one another. This is why I said it is impossible (proven to be) that Allah and God are the same... they certainly can't be, it would completely defy logic.

2) you keep saying Mohammed 'invented Islam to destroy the Jews/Christians'... The stupidity and bigotry in this comment is what I continue to mock.

There is nothing stupid about it, or bigoted, and you've not presented a thing to contradict it. For all intents and purposes, Islam is essentially a Hate Group disguised as a Religion. No different than Mein Kempf-toting Nazis. Imagine if Hitler had won WWII... and over 2 billion Nazis were dominating the middle east and Europe? Would you be sitting here defending their ideology of killing all people who weren't blonde hair and blue eyes, saying that... well, we just have different interpretations of the same thing is all... we're the same, really.... Nazis believe in the same God.... no difference... yadda yadda? I certainly hope not, but that is what you are doing with this religion of hate, this perversion of religious belief and fraud, which is an attack on everything we understand in western civilization to be humanitarian and moral.

3) If I tell 10 people the SAME story, word for word and they relay it to another 10 people each.... out of the final 100, how many do you suppose will have the identical story as another of the 100? You seem to think that because MEN wrote the stories differently that somehow makes Islam wrong and the others right. Yet you continue to ignore the inconsistencies WITHIN the Bible. You continue to ignore the VAST differences between Christians and Jews. ...1.2 BILLION Muslims say they believe in the God of Abraham, but Ditzie proclaims they do not, so therefore it must be true. You claim they are a counterfeit religion because they copied other religions to a degree. yet you again fail to comprehend, the Christians ALSO COPIED other religions. So did the JEWS. You fail to comprehend that YOU HAVE NO PROOF THAT CHRISTIANS AND JEWS are not the ones that are incorrect. You keep proclaiming that Muslims believe a LIE... but you fail to comprehend the FACT that ALL RELIGIONS ARE BASED ON FAITH..... NOT FACT. You have NO evidence to suggest that Islam is any more/less a 'lie' than any other religion.

Again... not here to debate your perception of inconsistencies in the Bible... if you want to find a good Christian who knows the Scriptures, I am sure they will explain it all to you completely, just ask. I can't do that, I am not equipped to debate Christian theology here. Can you please try and comprehend that? I hate to keep having to repeat it, but you keep wanting to drag this into a debate on specific things Christians profess to believe, as if I am arguing Christian faith. I know even less about Judaism, but what I do know a little bit about, is history. We are seeing the resurgence of what was once the Ottoman Empire, a push for an Islamic Caliphate, which includes everything from Europe to Indonesia, and the more radical followers presume this also includes Africa and the West. This means they want everyone to obey and follow the 6th century laws of Sharia, and practice Islam... else you must die. Is this what you believe Abraham was told by God or not? Do you think centuries of Jewish and Christian followers of Abraham were lying and living a lie? That the world is supposed to be under Islamic rule? Because that is what Muslims believe, RELIGIOUSLY!

You are such a dishonest hack. YOU brought scripture into it. I responded in kind. You fucking idiot.
ROFLMAO... AGAIN DITZIE... show me one post where I am bashing Christianity..... Please... just one.
You seriously are delusional. Where did I state ANY such nonsense as the above?

Scroll up and READ... dumbshit!

 

[poet]

Sorry SF, but you're full of shit and full of yourself.... which is the same thing.



Because when you start to debate what the Bible says and what Christians believe, it is a theological argument. I didn't do that. I didn't quote scripture or post anything about Christians having to believe any particular interpretation, in fact, I went quite out of my way to clarify this was not the case, and that Christians believe all kinds of things, that's why there are thousands of denominations within the religion. No part of the Bible that I am aware of, is interpreted by ANY Christian to mean, you can pick and choose which parts of the Bible to believe, and which parts not to believe. I simply pointed that fact out, it's not something that can be argued, really... unless you are pinhead who wants to twist and contort what was said.



Rest of us? Who is that? Looks like Yurt is taking chunks out of that ass just as I am, and most of the other geniuses have decided this thread is way over their little heads, so looks like you're pretty much on your own here. You might get a few chortles of support in the form of a smart-ass comment or two from the peanut gallery, but as for substance and fact.... you ain't got none.



Your very line of argument in this thread, is evidence of your revile and hatred for Christianity. When you use phrases like "got it right" ...applied to early Christians understandings of God... that in itself is an indication of the CONTEMPT you have for Christian faith... there was no "got it right" because there was never anything to "got" about it... Christians believe God spoke to Abraham, and the words are documented... there is nothing to GET about it... you either believe God spoke to Abraham and said these words, or you DON'T! It makes you a Christian follower, or not a Christian follower. There never was a "get" to it... I can make you "get" what Christianity is about, that is a personal choice you have to make, as Christianity is a religion of acceptance. I am not here to recruit you to Christianity, I don't care what you personally want to believe, that is entirely up to you. Islam came many centuries later, and made claims that what God said to Abraham was something completely different, but the Christians and Jews lied to everyone about it. The way they explained it was contradictory to historic events we know happened, but billions of Muslim faithful have been kept ignorant of, for many years, even to this day. As I pointed out... the eventual followers of Islam, were worshiping multiple Gods when Christianity was formed. The earliest Muslims were actually called "Moo-slem" because they worshiped the God of the Moon, and instructed their followers that Jews, Christians, and others, worshiped inferior Gods. Mohamed emerged, and changed Islam into an Abrahamic religious belief, with his claim (totally unsubstantiated) that he was a descendant of Abraham... before this, Abraham's God was inferior to Mooslems, remember? But with this prophet of Allah, and the tie to Abraham, along with some creative re-writing of history and unbelievable longevity of ancestral generations, the story was re-told in the Islamic form. The entire religion, from the inception... is a FRAUD! A cheap knock-off of Christianity.



Christians did not form their religion out of contempt for another established religious belief. Islam did.
Christians did not attempt to re-write history or change known historical dates and facts. Islam has.

A lot of stories written in both the Bible and the Koran are age old stories passed down for centuries, and are the same... just different perspectives. As I said, Islam was patterned after Christianity, a cheap knock-off, a counterfeit religion.



This is why you should try to read my posts thoroughly, and you will find that I have repeatedly stated that I am not debating the goodness or righteousness of Christianity. Why do you think pointing out Christianity's darker side in history, somehow nullifies the fact that Islam was established to destroy Judaism and Christianity? It's two completely separate arguments you are trying to roll into one, by turning the worm... making this a theological debate. There's no question Christians have done things through history to piss people off... else, there wouldn't be billions of Muslims, would there? Does this change historical facts? Does this justify Islam distorting history to enable their religion of hate? I think not.



Bigotry is the belief that your idea or thought is the correct one, and everyone who disagrees is wrong... (or has "seriously flawed logic.")




yet.... he doesn't think he ever posts anything that could remotely be construed as hatred of religion... noooo.... sugar won't melt in his mouth!

You tell on your agnostic self here, SF.




LMAOooo... NOOO! I did not proclaim that Jews were promised land, that was GOD to ABRAHAM! ...circa... a long fucking time ago! I don't personally know if it is true or not, I am not debating theological point of order, just historical point of order. Supposedly, God spoke to Abraham, and the sons of Abraham brought forth the religious beliefs now associated with Judaism and Christianity, however... Islam came centuries later on a dubious claim from a adulterer and liar, that he was a descendant of Abraham, and the entire teachings were misinterpreted. He convinced a bunch of Moon Worshipers he was telling the truth, and thus was born Islam.




Yep, and there are many more theological documents as well, we could go through all of those and what they say, but that would be a theological debate, which we aren't having here. Apparently, according to Mohamed, God told Abraham to kill all the Jews and Infidels, because that's what the Muslims believe. I find it hard to think God told Abraham this, and further harder to believe that he would send Jesus to bring a message of hope, love, charity, etc. So if I believe in Allah, the God of Islam, I can't believe in the God of Abraham, they diametrically contradict one another. This is why I said it is impossible (proven to be) that Allah and God are the same... they certainly can't be, it would completely defy logic.



There is nothing stupid about it, or bigoted, and you've not presented a thing to contradict it. For all intents and purposes, Islam is essentially a Hate Group disguised as a Religion. No different than Mein Kempf-toting Nazis. Imagine if Hitler had won WWII... and over 2 billion Nazis were dominating the middle east and Europe? Would you be sitting here defending their ideology of killing all people who weren't blonde hair and blue eyes, saying that... well, we just have different interpretations of the same thing is all... we're the same, really.... Nazis believe in the same God.... no difference... yadda yadda? I certainly hope not, but that is what you are doing with this religion of hate, this perversion of religious belief and fraud, which is an attack on everything we understand in western civilization to be humanitarian and moral.




Again... not here to debate your perception of inconsistencies in the Bible... if you want to find a good Christian who knows the Scriptures, I am sure they will explain it all to you completely, just ask. I can't do that, I am not equipped to debate Christian theology here. Can you please try and comprehend that? I hate to keep having to repeat it, but you keep wanting to drag this into a debate on specific things Christians profess to believe, as if I am arguing Christian faith. I know even less about Judaism, but what I do know a little bit about, is history. We are seeing the resurgence of what was once the Ottoman Empire, a push for an Islamic Caliphate, which includes everything from Europe to Indonesia, and the more radical followers presume this also includes Africa and the West. This means they want everyone to obey and follow the 6th century laws of Sharia, and practice Islam... else you must die. Is this what you believe Abraham was told by God or not? Do you think centuries of Jewish and Christian followers of Abraham were lying and living a lie? That the world is supposed to be under Islamic rule? Because that is what Muslims believe, RELIGIOUSLY!



Scroll up and READ... dumbshit!

Such BS. And you wonder why people don't or can't take you seriously. I know I don't.

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

Again dear yurt... You are not a bigot for having different beliefs. you are a bigot for proclaiming their God is not the God of Abraham. THAT is a FACT. All three religions were founded on the God of Abraham. IT (for the final time) is the STORIES that are different. AGAIN (for the final time), you are a BIGOT because you proclaim Muslims do not believe in the God of Abraham because of their different views, yet you in the same breath state the Jews DO. Yet BOTH Jews AND Muslims DO NOT believe the God of Abraham had a son.

You then attempt to make excuses for why it is OK for Jews to have different beliefs despite the differences, yet do not accord the same respect to Muslims. THAT is where you are a bigot.



Exactly... it was a story written a long time ago. AS I stated before and this is the last time.... I would NOT hold every Muslim accountable for what was written 1000 years ago. I would especially not hold them accountable for stating that Jews and Christians WROTE DOWN THE STORY WRONG, any more than I would hold every Christian accountable for some passage from the Bible.



Which makes my case even stronger. It was WRITTEN BY OTHER MEN. As was the bible. Idiot.



Now you are just making excuses to try and escape your bigotry.



Poor lil spaz....



seriously, do you READ anything that is written or do you just make dumb comments based on what you WANT me to have said???

AS I stated.... NO ONE KNOWS for SURE what GOD told ANY OF THEM. THAT is why it is called FAITH.



NO, it did not. The Jews, Muslims and Christians ALL believe in the God of Abraham. All three state that. Your links just showed the differences in STORIES written by MEN. AS I stated before and you again fucking ignored.




Again.... the proof is in this you idiot.....

HOW can you proclaim that Muslims don't believe in the God of Abraham (based on differences in stories/beliefs) while at the same time state that the Jews DO believe in the same God (despite THEIR vast differences in beliefs/stories)???

You are not holding everyone to the same standard. THAT is bigoted.

Telling Muslims that they do not believe in the God of Abraham is bigoted. Because you are telling them what YOU think THEIR beliefs are. It is not the same thing as their saying they do not believe in the son of God. It would be the same if they told you that you do not believe in the son of God after you stating that you do.



ROFLMAO.... now your desperation is showing. They did not claim to change the entire word of God you dolt. They believe in many of the same things. Christianity and Islam share much common ground. Both trace
their roots to Abraham. Both believe in prophecy, God's messengers (apostles), revelation, scripture, the resurrection of dead, and the centrality of religious community. They have just as much in common as the Christians do to the Jews. In addition, they unlike the Jews also believe Jesus was born to the virgin Mary.



the New Testament is what to the Jews?




The above is why you continue making yourself look foolish. Saying that MAN wrote down the story wrong does not CHANGE the entity. You are saying they have the power to change the entity simply by telling the story different. THAT simply changes the STORY. It DOES NOT CHANGE WHO THE STORY IS WRITTEN ABOUT.

I go back again to the analogy of Obama. If Dung proclaims Obama is the messiah and Ditzie proclaims he is the devil..... ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT THE SAME ENTITY.... DESPITE HAVING DIFFERENT STORIES?

Answer that one simple question Yurt.

this is getting really old. once again you fucking retard, it is my BELIEF they altered god. yet you stupidly claim you're not calling me a bigot for my belief. you are really, really fucking stupid.

all you've done is use my arguments for you, against me. which fail completely, because i don't hold them to a different standard. i don't claim they are bigots for their beliefs, ONLY YOU claim i am a bigot for my different belief.

your sad attempt at an analogy fails. and really has no bearing on whether i am bigot. the overall versions of god lead me to believe that allah cannot be the same as god. your analogy is completely stupid, because dixie is not saying obama is not obama.

you are a complete retard.

carry on.

 

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"Islam is essentially a Hate Group disguised as a Religion"

Nope - no intolerance there. What a "spiritualist."

 

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Because when you start to debate what the Bible says and what Christians believe, it is a theological argument. I didn't do that. I didn't quote scripture or post anything about Christians having to believe any particular interpretation, in fact, I went quite out of my way to clarify this was not the case, and that Christians believe all kinds of things, that's why there are thousands of denominations within the religion. No part of the Bible that I am aware of, is interpreted by ANY Christian to mean, you can pick and choose which parts of the Bible to believe, and which parts not to believe. I simply pointed that fact out, it's not something that can be argued, really... unless you are pinhead who wants to twist and contort what was said.

it really is confusing being you isn't it?

Quote Originally Posted by Dixie View Post
If you don't believe in the Bible, you are not a Christian. Sorry, that's just common fucking sense.

Deuteronomy 4:2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the LORD your God that I give you.

Deuteronomy 12:32 See that you do all I command you; do not add to it or take away from it.

Proverbs 30:6 Do not add to his words, or he will rebuke you and prove you a liar.

Rev. 22:18-19 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book: If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book. And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

You simply CAN'T believe certain PARTS of the Bible and NOT believe others!

 

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The VERY NEXT POST I responded with....

So, you believe the following?

Deuteronomy 13:6If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; 7Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth; 8Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: 9But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. 10And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the LORD thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

Deuteronomy 13: 13Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known; 14Then shalt thou enquire, and make search, and ask diligently; and, behold, if it be truth, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought among you; 15Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword.

Deuteronomy 17:3And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 4And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel: 5Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

2 Chronicles 15:13That whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman.

and THEN your spin came flying out....

First 'I don't want a theological debate'

Then 'it depends on what your definition of believe in is'

 

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your sad attempt at an analogy fails. and really has no bearing on whether i am bigot. the overall versions of god lead me to believe that allah cannot be the same as god. your analogy is completely stupid, because dixie is not saying obama is not obama. .

So tell us Yurt... which RELIGION is telling anyone that God isn't God? Each of the religions is stating that he is. It is your proclamation and lame fucking reasoning as to WHY you believe 'they altered God' that makes you a bigot you moron.

 

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So tell us Yurt... which RELIGION is telling anyone that God isn't God? Each of the religions is stating that he is. It is your proclamation and lame fucking reasoning as to WHY you believe 'they altered God' that makes you a bigot you moron.

i can't believe this hasn't sunk into your brain yet. once again:

islam claims jesus is NOT the son of god. thus, they claim jesus is not god. now, follow me closely here.....christianity claims jesus is part of the trinity which make up god entire. iow, jesus was god in the flesh. islam claims that jesus was not divine and is not god.

so, in answer to your question, islam is telling everyone that god isn't god.

and again, you claim i'm not a bigot for my beliefs, yet, you once AGAIN call me a bigot for my beliefs. i can't believe you're this stupid.

 

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Your very line of argument in this thread, is evidence of your revile and hatred for Christianity. When you use phrases like "got it right" ...applied to early Christians understandings of God... that in itself is an indication of the CONTEMPT you have for Christian faith... there was no "got it right" because there was never anything to "got" about it... Christians believe God spoke to Abraham, and the words are documented... there is nothing to GET about it... you either believe God spoke to Abraham and said these words, or you DON'T! It makes you a Christian follower, or not a Christian follower. There never was a "get" to it... I can make you "get" what Christianity is about, that is a personal choice you have to make, as Christianity is a religion of acceptance. I am not here to recruit you to Christianity, I don't care what you personally want to believe, that is entirely up to you. Islam came many centuries later, and made claims that what God said to Abraham was something completely different, but the Christians and Jews lied to everyone about it. The way they explained it was contradictory to historic events we know happened, but billions of Muslim faithful have been kept ignorant of, for many years, even to this day. As I pointed out... the eventual followers of Islam, were worshiping multiple Gods when Christianity was formed. The earliest Muslims were actually called "Moo-slem" because they worshiped the God of the Moon, and instructed their followers that Jews, Christians, and others, worshiped inferior Gods. Mohamed emerged, and changed Islam into an Abrahamic religious belief, with his claim (totally unsubstantiated) that he was a descendant of Abraham... before this, Abraham's God was inferior to Mooslems, remember? But with this prophet of Allah, and the tie to Abraham, along with some creative re-writing of history and unbelievable longevity of ancestral generations, the story was re-told in the Islamic form. The entire religion, from the inception... is a FRAUD! A cheap knock-off of Christianity.

LMAO.... I was not the one who brought 'getting it right' into the discussion, nor have I stated that any one religion has it right or wrong.

YOU on the other hand have stated (and do so again above) that Islam is a fraud. Tell me Ditzie, is that not the same thing as saying they 'got it wrong'???? Fucking idiot.

Also.... yes, you commented that at the time Christianity was formed many that would become Muslim believed in Multiple gods. When you spouted that stupidity the first time (as if it gave ANY credibility to your argument) prior to Christianity being formed, many that would become Christians ALSO believed in multiple Gods. you fucking idiot.

Christians did not form their religion out of contempt for another established religious belief. Islam did.
Christians did not attempt to re-write history or change known historical dates and facts. Islam has.

Let me guess, the second I point out that Christians DID indeed attempt to re-write history... you are once again going to proclaim that you are not wanting a theological debate and you will run away.

A lot of stories written in both the Bible and the Koran are age old stories passed down for centuries, and are the same... just different perspectives. As I said, Islam was patterned after Christianity, a cheap knock-off, a counterfeit religion.

Again, you calling it counterfeit.... yeah.... you aren't a bigot.


[quoteThis is why you should try to read my posts thoroughly, and you will find that I have repeatedly stated that I am not debating the goodness or righteousness of Christianity. Why do you think pointing out Christianity's darker side in history, somehow nullifies the fact that Islam was established to destroy Judaism and Christianity? It's two completely separate arguments you are trying to roll into one, by turning the worm... making this a theological debate. There's no question Christians have done things through history to piss people off... else, there wouldn't be billions of Muslims, would there? Does this change historical facts? Does this justify Islam distorting history to enable their religion of hate? I think not.[/quote]

yet you ARE debating the 'fraud' of Islam. you ARE proclaiming that their entire religion is false... yet you then turn and state that you don't know much about Christian Scripture and even less about Judaism. How is it that you can be so sure proclaiming Islam to be a fraud when you don't even understand the other two religions ditzie?

Bigotry is the belief that your idea or thought is the correct one, and everyone who disagrees is wrong... (or has "seriously flawed logic.")

you mean like calling an entire religion a FRAUD because YOU believe it to be? That anyone who disagrees with YOUR OPINION simply is believing 'LIES'? You mean something like that?

yet.... he doesn't think he ever posts anything that could remotely be construed as hatred of religion... noooo.... sugar won't melt in his mouth!

You tell on your agnostic self here, SF.

So stating that MAN wrote the religious texts somehow means I hate religion?

Tell me ditzie... which of the texts were NOT written by MAN?

Yep, and there are many more theological documents as well, we could go through all of those and what they say, but that would be a theological debate, which we aren't having here. Apparently, according to Mohamed, God told Abraham to kill all the Jews and Infidels, because that's what the Muslims believe. I find it hard to think God told Abraham this, and further harder to believe that he would send Jesus to bring a message of hope, love, charity, etc. So if I believe in Allah, the God of Islam, I can't believe in the God of Abraham, they diametrically contradict one another. This is why I said it is impossible (proven to be) that Allah and God are the same... they certainly can't be, it would completely defy logic.

You truly are an idiot. Again.... If you think Obama is a horrible president and Dung thinks he is a great one. Does it mean that it is impossible that you are both talking about the same man?

You idiot.

There is nothing stupid about it, or bigoted, and you've not presented a thing to contradict it. For all intents and purposes, Islam is essentially a Hate Group disguised as a Religion. No different than Mein Kempf-toting Nazis. Imagine if Hitler had won WWII... and over 2 billion Nazis were dominating the middle east and Europe? Would you be sitting here defending their ideology of killing all people who weren't blonde hair and blue eyes, saying that... well, we just have different interpretations of the same thing is all... we're the same, really.... Nazis believe in the same God.... no difference... yadda yadda? I certainly hope not, but that is what you are doing with this religion of hate, this perversion of religious belief and fraud, which is an attack on everything we understand in western civilization to be humanitarian and moral.

Yep... no bigotry above... move along....

I can't do that, I am not equipped to debate Christian theology here. Can you please try and comprehend that? I hate to keep having to repeat it, but you keep wanting to drag this into a debate on specific things Christians profess to believe, as if I am arguing Christian faith. I know even less about Judaism, but what I do know a little bit about, is history.[/B]

LMAO .... so you are not equipped to debate Christian theology, you know less about Judaism.... yet you are here to TELL US ALL that Islam is a fraud. Seriously... you are fucking retarded.

 

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i can't believe this hasn't sunk into your brain yet. once again:

Judaism claims jesus is NOT the son of god. thus, they claim jesus is not god. now, follow me closely here.....christianity claims jesus is part of the trinity which make up god entire. iow, jesus was god in the flesh. Judaism claims that jesus was not divine and is not god.

so, in answer to your question, Judaism is telling everyone that god isn't god.

Re-read the above Yurt.... why do you not proclaim that the Jews believe in a different God?

Is it not fair to state the exact same thing you did about Islam ... yet replace Islam with Judaism?

 

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Re-read the above Yurt.... why do you not proclaim that the Jews believe in a different God?

Is it not fair to state the exact same thing you did about Islam ... yet replace Islam with Judaism?

why did you ignore that islam changed god? oh that's right, you don't want to admit you screwed up.

again, i don't care if YOU think it is fair. it has nothing to do with fairness. beliefs do not have to be "fair" in order to be considered bigoted or not. furthermore, i have answered you this MULTIPLE times. in fact, i just answered you again not more than 3 or so hours ago. christianity (except for some faiths) DO NOT CHANGE WHO GOD IS. <-- pay close attention to that. i don't want to have to keep repeating myself to an ignorant moron who has dug his heels in and refuses to admit he is wrong. i believe in the torah. i don't claim the torah is wrong. most christians (if any) do not believe the torah is wrong. christianity, for the most part, merely expands on the messiah. jews and christians depart primarily along the lines of who jesus is. islam significantly changed who god is. and once again superspazz, whether you think i'm right, fair or whatever, has absolutely zero bearing on whether i'm bigoted. you really show how stupid you are by claiming you're not calling me bigoted for my beliefs, but every time you claim i'm a bigot, it is SOLELY FOR MY BELIEFS.

conclusion:

SF is a moron because all he can whine about is that i'm not fair and that makes me a bigot

 

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why did you ignore that islam changed god? oh that's right, you don't want to admit you screwed up.

Because they DIDN'T you dolt. Their lack of belief that Jesus is NOT the son of God is the SAME as what the JEWS believe. Hence... it is the JEWS and MUSLIMS that believe in ONE God and not a trinity.

The point, dear little bigot, is that YOUR EXACT comments on how 'Muslims changed God' could be said about the Jews for they believe the SAME FUCKING THING.

WHY IS IT THAT YOU PROCLAIM THE MUSLIMS DON'T BELIEVE IN THE GOD OF ABRAHAM WHEN THEY BELIEVE THE SAME THING AS THE JEWS????????

That is why you are a bigot. How can they have 'changed God' if they believe the SAME thing about Jesus as the Jews with regards to whether he is the son of God??????

 

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Can this thread be moved to the War Zone?

You are welcome to remember what the title of the thread is and then CHOOSE whether or not you wish to read it.

 

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Because they DIDN'T you dolt. Their lack of belief that Jesus is NOT the son of God is the SAME as what the JEWS believe. Hence... it is the JEWS and MUSLIMS that believe in ONE God and not a trinity.

The point, dear little bigot, is that YOUR EXACT comments on how 'Muslims changed God' could be said about the Jews for they believe the SAME FUCKING THING.

WHY IS IT THAT YOU PROCLAIM THE MUSLIMS DON'T BELIEVE IN THE GOD OF ABRAHAM WHEN THEY BELIEVE THE SAME THING AS THE JEWS????????

That is why you are a bigot. How can they have 'changed God' if they believe the SAME thing about Jesus as the Jews with regards to whether he is the son of God??????

They even believe in the virgin birth of Jesus.

http://www.islam-guide.com/ch3-10.htm