Some educators who lost jobs over Charlie Kirk comments are now suing

[Poor Richard Saunders]

If said by the authority figure of a first or second grade teacher, said to a vulnerable, looking for friendship and emotional security seeking student, causing the kid to become, upset, indoctrinated, and radicalized...

Yes!

Context and Interposition of Roles matters allot.

As a Adult to Adult in a known Satirical Conversation, No problem.

Between Avatars on a rough and tumble political forum, Expected.

As a Parent to Child, or Adult-Teacher to Child-Student, Huge Problem.

Teachers, Coaches, School Councilors, Priests, Cops, Mayors... all have sensitive, responsible and potentially destructive roles. There is much less freedom of speech available to people who choose to work in such positions.

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It was posted to her private Facebook page only accessible to people she has listed as friends.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

That wasn't all she said....

Really? What else did she say? She didn't even "say" that line. She posted it to her private Facebook.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

That's a really interesting question. It doesn't call for violence so that should be protected speech. At the same time you get into the office culture and public image perspective of how it's received.

So it's not a legal debate because that's legal speech, rather its about do we want employers deciding if speech outside the workplace can cost someone their job.

And yet she was threatened by RWers and a campaign got her fired for those words.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

The reason that this statement, given by a teacher, to a child-student, should cause the teacher to be fired, is in part, the same reason that the CIA experiments into mind control, in the MKUltra projects, were illegal, and unacceptable.

MKUltra - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Think it through!

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LOL. Making up facts about the case shows you to be the one providing propaganda here. Does this mean we should demand you get fired from your job?

 

[cawacko]

And yet she was threatened by RWers and a campaign got her fired for those words.

Yes, that was the outcome. My question was more about the culture side. We often hear ‘free speech has consequences,’ meaning you can legally say things but you may still have to face the consequences.

Should people lose their jobs over things they say outside of work, even if legal? Should that be case by case?

 

[Hume]

Should people lose their jobs over things they say outside of work, even if legal?

No.

 

[Lionfish]

Some educators who lost their jobs over comments they made in the wake of conservative activist Charlie Kirk's slaying have filed lawsuits claiming their free speech rights were violated.

The school and university employees who have filed suits are some of the dozens of workers across a slew of fields fired or suspended from their jobs or subject to other consequences for their controversial comments, according to a USA TODAY count of news reports and statements. The count includes at least 50 educators.

At least three are fighting back in court, according to reporting by the USA TODAY Network. They include a teacher in Iowa who compared Kirk to a Nazi; a South Carolina teacher's assistant who posted a Kirk quote and said she disagreed with him but called the death a "tragedy"; and an employee of an Indiana university who said Kirk's death was wrong and condemned some of his beliefs.

Kirk, the 31-year-old co-founder of the conservative youth-focused organization Turning Point USA and a close ally of President Donald Trump, was killed on Sept. 10 while speaking at an event at Utah Valley University in Orem, Utah. Shooting suspect Tyler Robinson has been charged with his murder and accused of firing a single shot with a rifle from a rooftop.

The killing sparked a tense national debate over partisan rhetoric and politically motivated violence, with many conservatives calling for the firing of otherwise non-public figures who celebrated Kirk's death or spoke ill of him in some way.

The three educators – all employed by public school districts and a public university – are protected by the constitutional right to free speech, they argued in separate lawsuits filed in September. A suit filed by former Oskaloosa High School teacher Matthew Kargol in Iowa argued the school district "wielded state power to punish a citizen for expressing his opinion on political issues," reported the Des Moines Register, part of the USA TODAY Network.

"Their actions strike at the heart of the First Amendment and chill the exercise of constitutional rights," Kargol's complaint said.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/educators-lost-jobs-over-charlie-151404158.html

MOURNING THE LOSS OF FREE SPEECH​

View attachment 60949

Fuck you asshole. You supported the assassination of your president so, fuck you!

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

Yes, that was the outcome. My question was more about the culture side. We often hear ‘free speech has consequences,’ meaning you can legally say things but you may still have to face the consequences.

What was so bad about what she posted that merits her being fired?
“If you think Charlie Kirk was a wonderful person, we can’t be friends.”
Can you be fired because you say you won't be friends with someone?

Should people lose their jobs over things they say outside of work, even if legal? Should that be case by case?

You are setting up for every RWer in the country to be fired come Jan of 2029 if you say this is OK.

 

[cawacko]

What was so bad about what she posted that merits her being fired?
“If you think Charlie Kirk was a wonderful person, we can’t be friends.”
Can you be fired because you say you won't be friends with someone?


You are setting up for every RWer in the country to be fired come Jan of 2029 if you say this is OK.

My question wasn’t partisan and it wasn’t about right or left. It’s about culture. It’s how schools or businesses react to public pressure and who yells the loudest. It’s also how people inside a workplace react when a co-worker says something outside of work.

 

[Damocles]

Who told the children that?

Someone didn't read the OP article, that is one of the examples within the story, it even gives a link.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

My question wasn’t partisan and it wasn’t about right or left. It’s about culture. It’s how schools or businesses react to public pressure and who yells the loudest. It’s also how people inside a workplace react when a co-worker says something outside of work.

A school is a government institution. It isn't a business. Government institutions are supposed to follow the Constitution, not public pressure.

 

[Into the Night]

Some educators who lost their jobs over comments they made in the wake of conservative activist Charlie Kirk's slaying have filed lawsuits claiming their free speech rights were violated.

A job is not speech, so THAT argument falls apart before it even gets started.
The 1st amendment does not apply to schools and colleges, so THAT argument falls apart before it even gets started.

The Democrats, that want to censor people, are whining about 'free speech' now. Hypocrites.

The school and university employees who have filed suits are some of the dozens of workers across a slew of fields fired or suspended from their jobs or subject to other consequences for their controversial comments, according to a USA TODAY count of news reports and statements. The count includes at least 50 educators.

Fuck around and find out. I'd fire these bastards too, if I had any working for me (I don't hire 'em to begin with!).

 

[Into the Night]

You aren't free from consequences. What dont you assholes understand? Free speech rights only protect you from the govt punishing you for your speech not your employer. Wake the fuck up idiots

Not quite.

First, there IS NO FREE SPEECH. You are responsible for your slander and libel. You are responsible fomenting riots.
The 1st amendment applies ONLY to Congress (and the rest of the federal government). No federal law can be passed curtailing speech.
The 1st amendment does NOT apply to the States, or to an employer, or to a business, or to any person in a home or apartment.

 

[Into the Night]

Wow. Just wow. It seems you are so far into the cult you don't realize that state run schools are not simply an employer.

They are simply an employer. The 1st amendment does not apply to an employer or to any State.

 

[Into the Night]

Thanks for ignoring your stupidity. Maybe if the government had educated you, you might not be quite so stupid. Government run schools are as much a part of the government as ICE officers.

Wrong government, fool.
State governments are NOT the federal government.
A job is not speech.

 

[Into the Night]

Should this statement get someone fired?

“If you think Charlie Kirk was a wonderful person, we can’t be friends.”

It can.

 

[Into the Night]

A school is a government institution.

Not necessarily, and it doesn't matter. State schools are part of STATE government. The 1st amendment does NOT apply.

It isn't a business.

It is a business. A job is not speech.

Government institutions are supposed to follow the Constitution, not public pressure.

DON'T TRY TO HIDE BEHIND THE CONSTITUTION YOU DESPISE!

 

[Into the Night]

Just because you can achieve an outcome by using speech, does not mean that you have 1st amendment "Right" to cause such an outcome.

It's simpler than that.

A job is not speech.

Shouting "Fire" in a crowded theatre is not a free speech right.

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This old song again?

Shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theatre might just save some lives.
Or, it could cause a needless panic, and you are liable for the damages.

 

[Into the Night]

Yes, that was the outcome. My question was more about the culture side. We often hear ‘free speech has consequences,’ meaning you can legally say things but you may still have to face the consequences.

Should people lose their jobs over things they say outside of work, even if legal? Should that be case by case?

They indeed CAN lose their jobs. You can even get sued for it! Blabbering company secrets, for example.

 

[Into the Night]

What was so bad about what she posted that merits her being fired?
“If you think Charlie Kirk was a wonderful person, we can’t be friends.”
Can you be fired because you say you won't be friends with someone?


You are setting up for every RWer in the country to be fired come Jan of 2029 if you say this is OK.

What makes you think you have any say after Jan 2029?

I run my own business. I don't even WANT to work for a Democrat.