cawacko
Well-known member
Some in Congress vote with their principles most vote how they best feel they can get re-elected.
So who was right on the Iraq War? Liberals vs. Conservatives.
- Thread starter Amadeus
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Some in Congress vote with their principles most vote how they best feel they can get re-elected.
cawacko
Well-known member
Did anything in her platform indicate she would be any less hawkish that before?
I looked at her record "On the Issues."
- Work with allies around the world to fight homegrown terror. (Sep 2016)
- Continue anti-ISIS actions in Libya, with Europe & Arabs. (Feb 2016)
- No US troops as occupying force in Iraq. (Oct 2016)
- Iraq war VOTE was my mistake; Iraq WAR was Bush's mistake. (Sep 2016)
Exactly. And bush and his toadies made people think they'd be unpatriotic terrorist supporters if they didn't vote for/support the war.
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Then there's one of two things: 1. She couldn't learn from her mistake or 2. She's lying. No other possibilities with her
encouragement for the Libya fiasco.
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So you finally acknowledge I'm a liberal. Because I never, ever supported Iraq even with the false intel.
That's not the way the world works, and I think you know it.
Noted liberal senator George McGovern voted for the Tonkin Gulf resolution, before later realizing the Vietnam War was a catastrophic blunder. By 1972, the Democratic Party base was largely anti-Vietnam War. And you know what? I don't think anybody made a credible claim that Democrats were hypocritical to vote for McGovern based on the Tonkin Gulf vote of eight years earlier.
Redemption and learning from a mistake is a real thing Cawacko. The problem is, I have never heard you, and almost none of your Republlcan leaders, explicitly say that the Iraq War was a catastrophic, foolish, and unnecessary disaster of epic proportions. So, while Hillary may have learned a lesson, I have seen no evidence that you or the GOP more broadly learned any lessons from the Iraq War Disaster.
Hillary Clinton on War & Peace
Continue anti-ISIS actions in Libya, with Europe & Arabs. (Feb 2016)
http://www.ontheissues.org/Hillary_Clinton.htm#War_+_Peace
OMG..
Continue anti-ISIS actions in Libya, with Europe & Arabs. (Feb 2016)
http://www.ontheissues.org/Hillary_Clinton.htm#War_+_Peace
OMG..
Hillary Clinton on War & Peace
Continue anti-ISIS actions in Libya, with Europe & Arabs. (Feb 2016)
http://www.ontheissues.org/Hillary_Clinton.htm#War_+_Peace
OMG..
We aren't supposed to work against ISIS? I'd be happy to stay away from all that but I'm in the minority.
Hillary Clinton is the person most responsible in the world for ISIS being in Libya..do i need to explain??? OMG
cawacko
Well-known member
You spent a number of years not posting on this board. You are free to go back and look at comments I made on Iraq.
Like I said in a previous post, I listened to a lot of KPFA free speech radio before the election and these very left wing people (Bernie supporters). They went through thoroughly Hillary's foreign policy experience and votes as both a Senator and S.O.S. and nothing she did as S.O.S. changed regarding her hawkishness.
trump campaigned on getting rid of ISIS and he tried to blame it on Hillary but the fact checkers say no.
Politifact
"Hillary Clinton invented ISIS with her stupid policies. She is responsible for ISIS."
— Donald Trump on Sunday, July 17th, 2016 in an interview on 60 Minutes
Donald Trump wrongly blames Hillary Clinton for creation of ISIS
Donald Trump and his vice presidential candidate Mike Pence gave their first joint interview to 60 Minutes and used the show to point the finger at Hillary Clinton for ISIS. Trump told CBS’s Lesley Stahl that the United States will have to declare war against ISIS -- and he vowed to do it with very few troops on the ground to wipe out ISIS.
"Hillary Clinton invented ISIS with her stupid policies," Trump said in an interview that aired July 17. "She is responsible for ISIS."
Trump has made this claim repeatedly. It’s wrong, and we’ll explain why.
The roots of ISIS
Trump was referring to Clinton’s actions related to Iraq, Libya and Syria, said Trump spokesman Stephen Miller, who referred us to a previous Trump speech on the topic.
The sources of ISIS are complex and interconnected, said John Pike, an expert on defense and director of GlobalSecurity.org, a website that provides information on defense.
"She may ‘share some of the blame’ but there is more than enough share to go around. She was in no sense the singular author of the thing," Pike said.
For starters, the terrorist group’s roots pre-date Obama’s presidency and Clinton’s role as secretary of state.
OMG.
the bolded above is 100% pure horse hockey .
Many sources shoot down that Hillary WAS the author (enabler) of the Libyan war 2011.
Here is a couple pertinent. Gates called her the 51%voice that swayed Obama
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/na...bya-that-still-haunts/?utm_term=.f4e62f7136e7
after consultations with British and Arab allies and a leader of the Libyan opposition all demanding action, Clinton joined a White House meeting of President Obama’s National Security Council by phone and forcefully urged the president to take military action.
Clinton’s decision to shed her initial reluctance and strongly back a military operation in Libya was one of the most significant — and risky — of her career.
Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates, national security adviser Thomas E. Donilon and others were against military action, contending that the United States had no clear national interests at stake and that operations could last far longer and cost more lives than anyone anticipated.
But Clinton joined U.N. Ambassador Susan E. Rice and White House adviser Samantha Power in pressing Obama to back a U.S.- and NATO-led military campaign, arguing that the United States could not let Gaddafi butcher his citizens.
Obama sided with Clinton’s argument, and three days later, on March 17, the U.N. Security Council passed a U.S.-backed resolution authorizing “all necessary measures” to protect Libyan civilians.
Clinton heard the Libya news, she gathered her top aides, along with other officials with expertise in Libya, at the State Department.
Over the next four weeks, Clinton received emails with advice from friends including her former aide Anne-Marie Slaughter, former Clinton administration adviser Sidney Blumenthal and former British prime minister Tony Blair,
Clinton was skeptical that a no-fly zone would be an effective deterrent to Gaddafi, since it would ground his planes but not stop his tanks and troops.
The decision ultimately belonged to Obama, but Clinton was the one who had been measuring the moods of allies, especially in Arab nations leery of U.S. interventions in the Muslim world. The former White House official interviewed said Obama placed high value on the opinion of his secretary of state.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/na...bya-that-still-haunts/?utm_term=.f4e62f7136e7
this from her own State Dept!
From: Jake Sullivan [mailtc
Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2011 7:40 PM
To: Mills, Cheryl D; Nuland, Victoria
Subject: tick tock on libya
this is basically off the top of my head, with a few consultations of my notes. but it shows S'Clinton leadership/ownership/stewardship of this country's libya policy from start to finish.
let me know what you think. toria, who else might be able to add to this?
Secretary Clinton's leadership on Libya HRC has been a critical voice on Libya in administration deliberations, at NATO, and in contact group meetings — as well as the public face of the U.S. effort in Libya. She was instrumental in securing the the authorization, building the coalition, and tightening the noose around Qadhafi and his regime
https://wikileaks.org/clinton-emails/emailid/23898
I have the NYTimes if more is needed.
Clinton was most responsible -more than any other person for the rise of ISIS in Libya
Once Qadaffi was killed, the country fragmented. Here is ISIS killing Egyptian captive on a beach in Libya
From: Jake Sullivan [mailtc
Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2011 7:40 PM
To: Mills, Cheryl D; Nuland, Victoria
Subject: tick tock on libya
this is basically off the top of my head, with a few consultations of my notes. but it shows S'Clinton leadership/ownership/stewardship of this country's libya policy from start to finish.
let me know what you think. toria, who else might be able to add to this?
Secretary Clinton's leadership on Libya HRC has been a critical voice on Libya in administration deliberations, at NATO, and in contact group meetings — as well as the public face of the U.S. effort in Libya. She was instrumental in securing the the authorization, building the coalition, and tightening the noose around Qadhafi and his regime
https://wikileaks.org/clinton-emails/emailid/23898
I have the NYTimes if more is needed.
Clinton was most responsible -more than any other person for the rise of ISIS in Libya
Once Qadaffi was killed, the country fragmented. Here is ISIS killing Egyptian captive on a beach in Libya
it was not a "repubs against dems" thing. it was a antichrist spirit/ worldbank masters thing. the "global "establishment" which the "Amadeus" character serves has caused most all unlawful bloodshed since 1948. as long as you dumb assholes continue to see the world political "establishment" like a damned ball game [team a against team b] your emotions will render you unable to use the God given ability of deductive reasoning and will remain stupid blind partisans of "established" politics. dummies ..... ps : trump campaigned on a lot of reasonable, sensible, lawful, just and right things; things which the constitution declares as things worth shedding blood for. trump now knows, i hope; and all sensible people know that in order for the things he campaigned on to be fulfilled; a lot of bloodshed of traitors must occur. therefore... see signature... if trump does not "get it" ... see signature... either way,everything is on schedule as The Lord said.
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With all due respect anatta, I know you hate and despise her so I prefer to read a variety of opinions on what she's done and whether she is or isn't a war monger.
'K, gomie.
i am glad that you agree 100%. i would aprpreciate it if you include "yes sir' next time ['K mr. gomie, YES SIR, mr. gomie.]
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with due respect back, because I DO know you read a lot as I do -this is a "slam dunk" ( as Tenent once said about Iraq)
That last source is from HER OWN STATE DEPT. .here's another from NYTimes
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/hillary-clinton-libya.html?_r=0
Hillary Clinton,
‘Smart Power’
and a
Dictator’s Fall
The president was wary.The secretary of state was persuasive.
But the ouster of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafileft Libya a failed state and a terrorist haven.
By JO BECKER and SCOTT SHANE
FEB. 27, 2016
cawacko
Well-known member
TTQ64 has wished death on all who she believes to be on the political right. So when she says WW, FDR and LBJ are all in the political right what does that say about their supporters?