Russia lays down 4 conditions for peace

[Legion]

Everyone wants only to dump on Putin which gets no one anywhere other than feeling good about himself.

That's the whole point of being "woke".

I'm surprised that you refused to jump on the bandwagon. Maybe I've misjudged you.

 

[Legion]

To Putin it is simple. Agree to give me everything I wanted at the start, and I will quit blowing up your cities and killing your people. Except, he started this war on his own. So he may just use Ukraine as a base and keep going. He is not trustworthy and he does not care if he kills citizens.

Did he tell you that himself?

 

[Legion]

Then how is it going to end? Nothing would happen other than the peace agreement itself until Russia withdraws. The rest would be overseen by the UN including the conduct of the province elections.

There isn't any such treaty provision that I'm aware of, and the UN is as worthless as its moribund predecessor the League of Nations, AFAIK.

 

[Matt Dillon]

When you have your own country, you can make those kinds of decisions.

I know one thing learned from the internet: Russians always try to cheat at everything, no matter what. Don't trust them further than they can be thrown.

 

[Nordberg]

Mcdonald's closed all their restaurants in Russia. So they instituted a no fry zone.

 

[Legion]

I know one thing learned from the internet: Russians always try to cheat at everything, no matter what. Don't trust them further than they can be thrown.

Is that so?

Maybe your Internet didn't know that a lot of Russians are really Ukrainians.

 

[Legion]

Mcdonald's closed all their restaurants in Russia. So they instituted a no fry zone.

 

[Matt Dillon]

Is that so?

Maybe your Internet didn't know that a lot of Russians are really Ukrainians.

I know that Russians always try to cheat.

 

[Legion]

I know that Russians always try to cheat.

I guess you'd better sic Santa Claus and the Hamburglar on 'em, then.

 

[Matt Dillon]

I guess you'd better sic Santa Claus and the Hamburglar on 'em, then.

Eat a bag of dicks.

 

[martin]

There isn't any such treaty provision that I'm aware of, and the UN is as worthless as its moribund predecessor the League of Nations, AFAIK.

Doesn't need to be a provision. The sides only need to agree to it, or if not the UN then another party they can agree on to act as a neutral go between.

 

[Legion]

Doesn't need to be a provision. The sides only need to agree to it, or if not the UN then another party they can agree on to act as a neutral go between.

That worked so well for Ethiopia.

https://www.ena.et/en/?p=29348

And Czechoslovakia. And Poland.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_betrayal

 

[Legion]

Eat a bag of dicks.

Is that what the tooth fairy, the Easter bunny, and Sauron will supposedly make Putin do after he dies?

 

[martin]

That worked so well for Ethiopia.

https://www.ena.et/en/?p=29348

And Czechoslovakia. And Poland.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_betrayal

Might not work here either but what's the alternative other than to forego any attempt at self determination? If the majority of the population is foolish enough to prefer being part of Russia over part of Ukraine that should be demonstrated rather than accepting the so called "breakaway" status at face value.

 

[Legion]

Might not work here either but what's the alternative other than to forego any attempt at self determination? If the majority of the population is foolish enough to prefer being part of Russia over part of Ukraine that should be demonstrated rather than accepting the so called "breakaway" status at face value.

There's a proverb I'm thinking of. Guess what it is.

 

[Geeko Sportivo]

Without Zelinsky there won't be an agreement anyway. The question in this thread is what specifically is wrong with each of the four demands. So far I haven't seen an answer. Everyone wants only to dump on Putin which gets no one anywhere other than feeling good about himself.

Let me put it to you this way! Demands is the problem right up front.

No country, including Russia, has no right to issue DEMANDS on any other nation! Got it?

NOW I REALLY FEEL GOOD BECAUSE I KNOW GOD DAMN WELL I AM RIGHT ABOUT THIS! GOT IT?

Can you imagine Putin thinking he can make demands on the United States?

And let me tell you something else, since the United States declared war already on Terrorists a couple of decades ago- WE HAVE A STRICT POLICY TO NOT NEGOTIATE WITH TERRORISTS.

AND THE UNITED STATES NOW DECLARES RUSSIA A TERRORIST STATE! GOT IT?

So it is up to the Ukraine as to whether they want to negotiate or meet the demands of a terrorist state- BUT WE WON'T NEGOTIATE FOR THEM! GOT IT?

SO it don't matter what I or anyone else here thinks about Putin's DEMANDS!

 

[Geeko Sportivo]

Fair enough.

But one should NEVER trust ANY politician.
So, like it or not, they run things and they are the ones you have to negotiate with if you want to get things done.

And right now?
The top priority is stopping the killing/destruction.
Even if that means signing a treaty that cannot be trusted.

I don't agree with you that you can't trust any politician!

I know many honest and earnest politicians who I hold in the highest regard! Sorry you don't agree!

What Putin did is make demands, and if they are not met, he is will continue to kill and destroy the Ukraine!

If Putin wanted to negotiate, he would have done so, long before the first shot was fired.

DEMANDS ARE NOT NEGOTIATIONS!

 

[Legion]

I know many honest and earnest politicians who I hold in the highest regard!

Name them.

 

[Legion]

NOW I REALLY FEEL GOOD! GOT IT?

That's the whole point of virtue signaling.

 

[martin]

Let me put it to you this way! Demands is the problem right up front.

No country, including Russia, has no right to issue DEMANDS on any other nation! Got it?

NOW I REALLY FEEL GOOD BECAUSE I KNOW GOD DAMN WELL I AM RIGHT ABOUT THIS! GOT IT?

Can you imagine Putin thinking he can make demands on the United States?

And let me tell you something else, since the United States declared war already on Terrorists a couple of decades ago- WE HAVE A STRICT POLICY TO NOT NEGOTIATE WITH TERRORISTS.

AND THE UNITED STATES NOW DECLARES RUSSIA A TERRORIST STATE! GOT IT?

So it is up to the Ukraine as to whether they want to negotiate or meet the demands of a terrorist state- BUT WE WON'T NEGOTIATE FOR THEM! GOT IT?

SO it don't matter what I or anyone else here thinks about Putin's DEMANDS!

If it doesn't matter why are you sounding off about it. Seems to matter to you. The point is whether you call them demands or conditions or areas of discussion they are a possible way out. Why not explore that way?
Why not consider the four points and decide, one by one, if they are reasonable or not reasonable. That is all this thread is about. Instead we have 14 pages of posturing and evasion.