Romney is doomed!

Superfreak said:
Are you fucking kidding? Google Gulf of tonkin if you are so unbelievably uninformed about how VietNam escalated.
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1) I am not saying it was not a lie.

2) Who told that lie? Where is the quote? (I can give you several Bush quotes that were absolute lies in his direct charge to war)

3) Our involvement in Vietnam was an incremental thing that was pushed some by the gulf of Tonkin, but was not the direct result.

4) Blame for Vietnam is spread over a broad base of people and over a long period of time, mostly the Johnson Administration but clearly not as directly as Iraq can be blamed on Bush.

5) Waaahhh, they did it to, back in 1970, does not make what Bush did any better.
 
Jarod said:
1) I am not saying it was not a lie.
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A lie told by the administration that sent FAR more Americans to die than in Iraq. Yet you said Iraq was FAR worse.

2) Who told that lie? Where is the quote? (I can give you several Bush quotes that were absolute lies in his direct charge to war)
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Do provide the direct quotes to Bush. As for the Gulf of Tonkin.... as I said.... look it up. Johnson used the incident to further his desire to escalate the war even after Kennedy had started pulling back on the level of troops. They manufactured a crisis to escalate the war. Period.

3) Our involvement in Vietnam was an incremental thing that was pushed some by the gulf of Tonkin, but was not the direct result.
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It was absolutely a direct result Jarod. Kennedy was pulling back the level of troops. Johnson wanted to escalate. Vietnam escalated under Johnson. Period.

4) Blame for Vietnam is spread over a broad base of people and over a long period of time, mostly the Johnson Administration but clearly not as directly as Iraq can be blamed on Bush.
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It most certainly CAN be brought back to Johnson. He is the one that escalated the war. Prior to that Ike and Kennedy were trying the 'containment' strategy similar to the one that Bush I and Clinton were trying on Iraq. Nixon had to clean up after Johnson. Obviously Nixon didn't do a good job in that regard, nor was he presented with as clean a situation as Obama.

5) Waaahhh, they did it to, back in 1970, does not make what Bush did any better.
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No one said it did. YOU stated that Iraq was FAR WORSE than Viet Nam. I simply corrected you on that.
 
Bush said that "there IS no doubt that Saddam has weapons of mass destruction". That statement conveys absolute certainty. That was a lie. There always were caveats and qualifiers in the intelligence summaries that conveyed varying degrees of doubt as to the absolute certainty of Saddam's stockpiles. Team Bush - Cheney, actually - stated that Saddam's agents had met with Muhammed Atta prior to 9/11 in Prague. That was ALSO a lie. It was, however, the confluence of those two lies that Bush used to frighten America into supporting his war of choice on Iraq. Saddam was in cahoots with Al Qaeda, the guys who perpetrated 9/11 and Saddam had WMD's. That meant that Saddam could give those WMD's to OBL and he could use them against us AT ANY MINUTE!!!!!!! YIKES!!!!!!! Be afraid. Be very afraid. Not presidential leadership, but MISleadership.
 
Part of the promise of Perry's candidacy was that he would be a natural match for the Obama era Republican Party base, which is no longer satisfied just hearing the right rhetoric from its leaders -- it wants to believe that they mean it. This is why Romney was -- and still is -- so vulnerable.



The words are there, but so are memories of his Massachusetts healthcare law and the array of moderate positions he took during the first decade of his political career.


It turns out, though, that Perry has his share of potentially disqualifying ideological baggage too.




http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2011/09/23/rick_perry_backlash/
 
LOL.... While Christie would certainly shake things up, Romney is very capable of winning the general. His problem lies in the primary.
 
Superfreak said:
LOL.... While Christie would certainly shake things up, Romney is very capable of winning the general. His problem lies in the primary.
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You mean all the people who wouldn't pick him in the primary would vote for him in the general? Lesser of two evils?
 
Return of Dune said:
You mean all the people who wouldn't pick him in the primary would vote for him in the general? Lesser of two evils?
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The "Any White Guy" GOP strategy espoused openly by Webbway and on the QT by many Republicans.


I don't see the Religious Right voting for a Mormon.


Perry is their boy.
 
Return of Dune said:
You mean all the people who wouldn't pick him in the primary would vote for him in the general? Lesser of two evils?
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If he can escape the primary, the Tea Party members would likely be less motivated to vote, but those that did would choose Romney over Obama. Romney would also draw from moderate/disenfranchised Dem voters and he would likely do well with Independents vs. Obama (if the economy remains bad.... which given ineptitude of leadership in DC in both parties, plays to Romney's favor)
 
Superfreak said:
If he can escape the primary, the Tea Party members would likely be less motivated to vote, but those that did would choose Romney over Obama. Romney would also draw from moderate/disenfranchised Dem voters and he would likely do well with Independents vs. Obama (if the economy remains bad.... which given ineptitude of leadership in DC in both parties, plays to Romney's favor)
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Too bad the Tea-tards won't vote for Mittzie the Mass Mormon because of his religion and Romneycare.


Perry is your boy. Deal with it.
 
Superfreak said:
If he can escape the primary, the Tea Party members would likely be less motivated to vote, but those that did would choose Romney over Obama. Romney would also draw from moderate/disenfranchised Dem voters and he would likely do well with Independents vs. Obama (if the economy remains bad.... which given ineptitude of leadership in DC in both parties, plays to Romney's favor)
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Hate to disagree, but no moderates are going to vote for Romney.

Here is a nice Romney factoid; At the time he created RomneyCare (as the Gov. of Mass) he was in controll of $40 billion worth of Mass healthcare companies through his venture capital firm Bain Capital.

Talk about a conflict of interest! Made a law that every one of his constituents must become a customer.
 
Return of Dune said:
Hate to disagree, but no moderates are going to vote for Romney.

Here is a nice Romney factoid; At the time he created RomneyCare (as the Gov. of Mass) he was in controll of $40 billion worth of Mass healthcare companies through his venture capital firm Bain Capital.

Talk about a conflict of interest! Made a law that every one of his constituents must become a customer.
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Moderates would instead vote for Obama over Romney? I don't think so. Obviously only a direct match up would tell us for sure, but given Obama's own health care fiasco I doubt he could beat Romney in a bad economic environment. Add in Obama's other positions and I think Romney will be the choice of moderates between the two.
 
Superfreak said:
Moderates would instead vote for Obama over Romney? I don't think so. Obviously only a direct match up would tell us for sure, but given Obama's own health care fiasco I doubt he could beat Romney in a bad economic environment. Add in Obama's other positions and I think Romney will be the choice of moderates between the two.
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Got any polling data to support that prediction?


I doubt Romney can win the nomination, due to the radicalization of the GOP by the right and the prejudice against Mormons many conservatives harbor.


You'll get Perry, and you'll like it.
 
Superfreak said:
Moderates would instead vote for Obama over Romney? I don't think so. Obviously only a direct match up would tell us for sure, but given Obama's own health care fiasco I doubt he could beat Romney in a bad economic environment. Add in Obama's other positions and I think Romney will be the choice of moderates between the two.
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You mean National RomneyCare? Sorry, not much for you there. Furthermore, moderates most certainly are in favor of National RomneyCare, except most wish it had gone further, to a single payer system.

Second, Obama is extremely center, Romney is not.

Finaly, Romney is the definition of flip-floppers and we all know how much ignorant rednecks hate flip-floppers.
 
The other candidates in the race are currently attracting a collective 30.6 percent of the primary vote.


Michele Bachmann (8.2 percent) and Ron Paul (7.8 percent) combine for a sizable 16 percent.


Presuming that the prospects for those two candidates decline, their voters will sooner or later be up for grabs.


How likely is Mitt Romney to get the Bachmann vote?


The Paul vote?


My guess is not very.



http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-26/rick-perry-s-hidden-strength-the-ticker.html
 
Return of Dune said:
You mean National RomneyCare? Sorry, not much for you there. Furthermore, moderates most certainly are in favor of National RomneyCare, except most wish it had gone further, to a single payer system.
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You are the one that said moderates wouldn't vote for Romney because of RomneyCare, yet Obama care is WORSE. So why would they vote for Obama over Romney with regards to this issue? Moderates do NOT like this new health care bill. The surveys show people in general favor health care reform, but they do not like Obamacare.

Second, Obama is extremely center, Romney is not.
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ROFLMAO... yeah, that is why Obama is polling SO well with Independents and moderates right now. Obama is WAY to the left of center in this country. While he is not as far left as the far left would like, he is nowhere near the center.

Romney is a successful businessman and not a right wing nutter that moderates hate. While he is certainly to the right, he is much closer to center than Obama.

Finaly, Romney is the definition of flip-floppers and we all know how much ignorant rednecks hate flip-floppers.
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Again... if the choice is between Romney and Obama, who do you think those 'rednecks' are going to vote for? as I stated, Romney's problem is getting by the primaries.
 
Why is SuperFreakazoid so reluctant to embrace the Perryness?
 
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