Rep. Abigail Spanberger (VA-D) - Never use the words 'socialist' or 'socialism'

[Matt Dillon]

The Republican party waged a civil war on itself, the battle for the soul of the GOP beginning in the mid-90s. The result was the Party of Trump.

Now the Democratic party is in the beginning stages of a civil war of its own. Like inside the GOP, it's a battle between moderates and extremists. The extremists won in the Republican civil war. Who will win the Democratic civil war?

During a three hour Democratic caucus call Rep. Spanberger said “We need to not ever use the word ‘socialist’ or ‘socialism’ ever again. . . . We lost good members because of that.....If we are classifying Tuesday as a success . . . we will get fucking torn apart in 2022.”

I agree with Spanberger.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...dae5ca-1f6e-11eb-90dd-abd0f7086a91_story.html
An angry dispute erupted among House Democrats on Thursday, with centrist members blasting their liberal colleagues during a private conference call for pushing far-left views that cost the party seats in Tuesday’s election that they had worked hard to win two years ago.

Follow the latest on Election 2020
The bitter exchange, which lasted more than three hours as members sniped back and forth over tactics and ideology, reflected the extent to which the 2020 campaign exposed simmering tensions in the party even as its presidential nominee, Joe Biden, stands on the brink of achieving their biggest goal of the year — ousting President Trump.

Party leaders had expressed certainty that Trump’s divisiveness and mishandling of the pandemic would help them expand their majority with wins in GOP-held districts — and yet they lost at least a half-dozen seats and failed to retake the Senate. The explanation laid out by centrists, according to multiple people who were on the call and spoke on the condition of anonymity, is that Republicans were easily able to paint them all as socialists and radical leftists who endorse far-left positions such as defunding the police....

The commies will win The Democray Party Civil War.

America will win because it will lessen the number of Democrats by a large margin as more people flee the Democrats..

 

[blackascoal]

Isn't this the point that's being made? The majority of the nation is centrist. AOC will never be in danger in her district, but calling for 'defunding the police', (even though that catchphrase isn't accurate) is what cost other House members their seats in close races even though it wasn't their policy position.

Messaging sucked. Obama/Biden set up a task force on community policing that trump immediately did away with, opting to instruct his Justice Dept. to crack down on protesters. THAT should have been the messaging


If the ploy is to push a far Left progressive agenda as that of House Democrats, then we'll be watching another 4 years of Republican control after the mid terms.

Much respect for you sister, but if centrists keep attacking the actual liberal base, we’ll all be watching another 4 years of republican control anyway. Centrists believe that pushing for a livable wage is a far left position. Should the real left kiss the centrist ring before crafting their own agenda? This is a conversation that should be had within the party. How much longer do you think progressives should wait for centrists to figure out that there is no Democratic Party without the energized participation of th left?

 

[Matt Dillon]

E: The Commie Red Guard dipshits.

 

[Althea]

Translation: They don't agree with Democrats so fuck'em.

The fact remains 73M+ Americans voted for Trump. Why? The people who claim it's because they are stupid are proving their own stupidity. The people who don't care why 73M+ Americans voted Republican are not going to change anything.

They didn't vote 'republican'. They voted trump. As Cinnabar's piece illustrated.

They do agree with Democrats. They're just too stupid to vote for them.

 

[Matt Dillon]

The Republican party waged a civil war on itself, the battle for the soul of the GOP beginning in the mid-90s. The result was the Party of Trump.

Now the Democratic party is in the beginning stages of a civil war of its own. Like inside the GOP, it's a battle between moderates and extremists. The extremists won in the Republican civil war. Who will win the Democratic civil war?

During a three hour Democratic caucus call Rep. Spanberger said “We need to not ever use the word ‘socialist’ or ‘socialism’ ever again. . . . We lost good members because of that.....If we are classifying Tuesday as a success . . . we will get fucking torn apart in 2022.”

I agree with Spanberger.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...dae5ca-1f6e-11eb-90dd-abd0f7086a91_story.html
An angry dispute erupted among House Democrats on Thursday, with centrist members blasting their liberal colleagues during a private conference call for pushing far-left views that cost the party seats in Tuesday’s election that they had worked hard to win two years ago.

Follow the latest on Election 2020
The bitter exchange, which lasted more than three hours as members sniped back and forth over tactics and ideology, reflected the extent to which the 2020 campaign exposed simmering tensions in the party even as its presidential nominee, Joe Biden, stands on the brink of achieving their biggest goal of the year — ousting President Trump.

Party leaders had expressed certainty that Trump’s divisiveness and mishandling of the pandemic would help them expand their majority with wins in GOP-held districts — and yet they lost at least a half-dozen seats and failed to retake the Senate. The explanation laid out by centrists, according to multiple people who were on the call and spoke on the condition of anonymity, is that Republicans were easily able to paint them all as socialists and radical leftists who endorse far-left positions such as defunding the police....

 

[Althea]

The disturbing thing is that Biden already said he would veto Med4All if it came across his desk so how different is that from his GOP counterparts? This is one of the reasons right here of why I only voted for Biden just to get rid of Trump. We have a huge problem in the USA.

That's like saying 'I'd do a press conference with Santa if he comes to the White House.' M4all is not going to come across his desk, because funding is going to take years to figure out. What he is actually in favor of is laying the groundwork via a public option.

The problem we have in the USA was started by Gingrich, amplified by the Teabaggers, and is now here forever. Nothing is going to change for the better.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

They didn't vote 'republican'. They voted trump. As Cinnabar's piece illustrated.

They do agree with Democrats. They're just too stupid to vote for them.

I'd like to see an analysis, but I'd put money most of them voted straight Republican tickets just like most Democrats.

There ya' go again, claiming over 73M Americans are stupid.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

It's the 21st century. If Biden doesn't get both Georgia senators, he'll accomplish next to nothing. The question is "will he scream from the rooftops, or pull an Obama and try to act with class and dignity while it's getting rammed up his ass"

Biden's got one thing that Obama didn't...he doesn't have to worry about being 'uppity' in the eyes of the scumbags.

There's always 2022 but usually the incumbent party takes a hit in the midterms.

 

[Althea]

70 million people voted for Trump. It's easy to dismiss them as 'fools' or 'racists'. I think that is a mistake. I'd like to analyze what motivated them.

I think we came to a pretty good place w/respect to this issue. We've already parsed the different reasons that different Republicans voted for him. We're going to get plenty of data during slow news cycles next year. Imagine that? A slow news cycle? There won't be many surprises w/respect to each trump demographic.

I disagree. 1.. Obama was charismatic, like a JFK. 2. And Obama had a Progressive Agenda.

Whereas I was generalizing about a low bar being set, Obama governed as a moderate once he was elected. He was intelligent enough to take pride in the nation, and attempt compromise. He was delusional in thinking that Republicans would ever take 'yes' for an answer. He tried to hand them their pet issues on a silver platter, and they swatted it all away.

He had them over a barrel when Bush's tax cuts expired. In the 11th hour, he traded (kept) low taxes for an end to civil unions for gay people. He later ended DADT.


Nice quote tags!

 

[Althea]

There's always 2022 but usually the incumbent party takes a hit in the midterms.

Correct. Due to complacency. With trumpkins back under their rocks, Dems need to drag voters out. I don't see trump's media circus urging people to vote. He only cares about himself.

 

[Cinnabar]

That's like saying 'I'd do a press conference with Santa if he comes to the White House.' M4all is not going to come across his desk, because funding is going to take years to figure out. What he is actually in favor of is laying the groundwork via a public option.

The problem we have in the USA was started by Gingrich, amplified by the Teabaggers, and is now here forever. Nothing is going to change for the better.

Every civilized nation has figured out how to not rely upon a rapacious for profit health insurance industrial complex while providing healthcare for their citizenry so shame on the USA if what you say is accurate. Years? Oh for Chrissake! We can't have it because the party is beholden to the industry and that's the bottom line. If Biden thought it would never come up, why would he even have to bother to negate signing it?

The majority of the American people bipartisanly support Med4All but are denied the benefit because of money and greed. We do not have a representative government. The corporate lobbyists are writing policy.

 

[Althea]

I'd like to see an analysis, but I'd put money most of them voted straight Republican tickets just like most Democrats.

Biden's win negates that claim. Maybe not in the Midwest, but in many Red states.

There ya' go again, claiming over 73M Americans are stupid.

Your claim, not mine. There aren't 73 million Americans in the Midwest who voted. Many were interviewed after trump starved them with his tariffs. They were devastated, but said they'd still vote for trump.

The definition of stupid.

 

[blackascoal]

Every civilized nation has figured out how to not rely upon a rapacious for profit health insurance industrial complex while providing healthcare for their citizenry so shame on the USA if what you say is accurate. Years? Oh for Chrissake! We can't have it because the party is beholden to the industry and that's the bottom line. If Biden thought it would never come up, why would he even have to bother to negate signing it?

The majority of the American people bipartisanly support Med4All but are denied the benefit because of money and greed. We do not have a representative government. The corporate lobbyists are writing policy.

APPLAUSE

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Correct. Due to complacency. With trumpkins back under their rocks, Dems need to drag voters out. I don't see trump's media circus urging people to vote. He only cares about himself.

Do you really think Democrats can muster even more voters in 2022 than in 2020? Complacency is on both sides.

Trump won't ever give a shit about anything except himself. He'll use Trump TV to bitch, whine and moan about the dastardly Democrats stealing the election. Only fucking morons will believe him.

 

[Jack]

I think we came to a pretty good place w/respect to this issue. We've already parsed the different reasons that different Republicans voted for him. We're going to get plenty of data during slow news cycles next year. Imagine that? A slow news cycle? There won't be many surprises w/respect to each trump demographic.



Whereas I was generalizing about a low bar being set, Obama governed as a moderate once he was elected. He was intelligent enough to take pride in the nation, and attempt compromise. He was delusional in thinking that Republicans would ever take 'yes' for an answer. He tried to hand them their pet issues on a silver platter, and they swatted it all away.

He had them over a barrel when Bush's tax cuts expired. In the 11th hour, he traded (kept) low taxes for an end to civil unions for gay people. He later ended DADT.


Nice quote tags!

I think we came to a pretty good place w/respect to this issue. We've already parsed the different reasons that different Republicans voted for him.

Yeah. It was kinda' personal for me, I expected a Blue Wave, and when it was close, I was STUNNED. I couldn't believe 70 million voted for this guy. I'm still trying to process this.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Biden's win negates that claim. Maybe not in the Midwest, but in many Red states.

Your claim, not mine. There aren't 73 million Americans in the Midwest who voted. Many were interviewed after trump starved them with his tariffs. They were devastated, but said they'd still vote for trump.

The definition of stupid.

How so? Are you denying 73M Americans voted for Trump? Do you think they voted for Trump then voted for Democrat Senators and Reps?

So who are the 73M+ Americans who voted for Trump?

 

[Althea]

Every civilized nation has figured out how to not rely upon a rapacious for profit health insurance industrial complex while providing healthcare for their citizenry so shame on the USA if what you say is accurate. Years? Oh for Chrissake! We can't have it because the party is beholden to the industry and that's the bottom line. If Biden thought it would never come up, why would he even have to bother to negate signing it?

The majority of the American people bipartisanly support Med4All but are denied the benefit because of money and greed. We do not have a representative government. The corporate lobbyists are writing policy.

OK...there's a whole lot in there. I thought you were upset with Biden for saying he'd sign M4A? Why else would you say that you didn't vote for him, as opposed to voting against trump?

Nobody who wants M4 understands it. If you were honest, and told people that their income taxes would go up another 20%, they might rethink it. Of course, most people who want it don't pay much in taxes.

I'm only playing devil's advocate here, so don't get agitated. If we cut back on our bloated military budget, we could afford M4.

BUT...millions of Americans get 'free' healthcare from their employers. At least they think they do. You aren't going to wrestle that from them without a fight. All of Bernie's savings in his proposal came from one thing...negotiated drug prices. All of it. Why do you need M4 to achieve that? What's wrong with letting people keep private insurance, and giving the for profit companies actual competition with low cost insurance via a public option? At least as a first step. If ACA were EVER allowed to exist as designed, we'd have much lower costs by now. But it wasn't. In fact, last year the SC awarded insurance companies millions of dollars that they were owed when the House illegally defunded the risk corridors.


One thing I never realized before an in depth analysis, is that all of Medicare's billing infrastructure is taken care of by private insurers. That's why they can boast a very low overhead.

 

[Althea]

How so? Are you denying 73M Americans voted for Trump? Do you think they voted for Trump then voted for Democrat Senators and Reps?

So who are the 73M+ Americans who voted for Trump?

I'm denying that 73 million voted for him in the Midwest. Your claim was that I said every trump voter is stupid. This thread is replete with discussion about Republican voters.

You said that everyone votes straight ticket. Not this time. Biden won in states that rejected House/Senate Dems. How does that happen with straight ticket voting?

LOL...if this were a different board, you would claim 'because of fraud!!!!!'

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Yeah. It was kinda' personal for me, I expected a Blue Wave, and when it was close, I was STUNNED. I couldn't believe 70 million voted for this guy. I'm still trying to process this.

IMO, it's not about Trump; it's about the "D" and the "R" after the candidate's names. Democrats and Trumpeteers alike think the other side are idiots and that's as deep as they want to dive into it. Sad. Can't fix problems if most people don't give a shit about solving them.

 

[Althea]

Yeah. It was kinda' personal for me, I expected a Blue Wave, and when it was close, I was STUNNED. I couldn't believe 70 million voted for this guy. I'm still trying to process this.

I didn't believe in the polling, but I never do. Never have. You can ask Anatta next time you see him. I expected a better result in the Senate, but when the protests continued to turn into riots, and the Progs. were sounding off about the police, I knew it was going to be bad.

When early voting was so strong, I knew that both sides were voting. I was pleasantly surprised by Arizona/Georgia, but this was clearly an anti trump statement. We're screwed if we don't get Georgia Senate seats.

The Right was working overtime with propaganda. I think the claim of stacking the Supreme Court (Ironic as that's exactly what McConnell did), defunding police, and general Socialism claims cost us the Senate and House seats.

I'm hoping that Abrams can drag voters out in Ga. in January. It's going to come down to which party feels that their future depends on those seats. I don't have much faith in voters.