JESUS IS NOT GOD DEBATE

[wiseones2cents]

didn't need a total flood....only needed to flood the part where there were people living.....if you DO believe the lists in the bible were genealogies, there had only been about 20 between Adam and Noah, so how many people could there have been.....5000?.....10,000?....the could have all lived in the same valley....

Wrong! The Bible states a global flood. Man are you getting beat up in this debate.LOL

Genesis 6:17
Behold, I, even I am bringing the flood of water upon the earth, to destroy all flesh in which is the breath of life, from under heaven; everything that is on the earth shall perish.

20 families??? Ummm there were other people on the earth, where do you think Cain and Able chose brides from? Their ribs? LOL. There was also the Nephilim(probably Vikings) having babies with women of men(probably Asiatic people).

But hey! You believe Adam and Eve were the first people even though no scientific evidence supports this. They actually support the opposite,. It's called evolution.lol

according to you and the Rev. Phelps......

According to any one that can do math.LOL Add up the years and see.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young_Earth_creationism

since there weren't two, nothing had to come first....

Ummmm but the Sumerian account states that it was The "great gods" Anu, Enlil, Ninurta, Ennugi, and Ea were sworn to secrecy about their plan to cause the flood. Not the god of the jews.lol And it was Ea who tipped Gilgamesh about the flood.

He only boarded all his own possessions including his own livestock(which is more believable then 2 of every species.lol)

so your assumptions trump the written account?....

My "assumptions" make more sense then your fairy tale beliefs. Sarah meant woman of high rank and wealthy landowners/Lords gave out land as dowry to the groom.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah

The Hebrew name Sarah indicates a woman of high rank and is translated as "princess" or "noblewoman".

and yet, here we are.....and Rome and Assyria are not....

And? Romans still exist too. Again, where was the god of the jews when they got slaughtered?lol

waiting for you....

The god of the jews has been waiting for me? lol Then his wait is over.

you'll have to check with the Rev. Phelps....my denomination teaches inerrancy, not infallibility....

If you agree that the Bible is not infallible and acknowledge mistakes, then you cannot really rely on it's historical accuracy now can you? I laugh when I hear the new word being used "inerrancy" that is after the infallibility label couldn't stick. lol

I found this interesting.

"'Inerrant' means there are no errors; 'infallible' means there can be no errors".[6] Yet he agrees that "modern theologians insist on redefining that word also, so that it actually says less than 'inerrancy. '" Lindsell (1978) states that "The very nature of inspiration renders the Bible infallible, which means that it cannot deceive us. It is inerrant in that it is not false, mistaken, or defective".

Inerrancy is as bullshit as infallibility it seems.LOL

Luke wrote to Greeks and followed the matriarchal line, Matthew to the Jews and followed the patriarchal line....both Mary and Joseph were from the tribe of Judah.....

Oh my GOD this guy is clueless!!! Did Shealtiel have two different fathers? In Chronicles Pedaiah is the father of Zerubabbel! In the other two books its Shealtiel!

And don't get me started about Jesus' bloodline(which is another discrepancy). Because the bloodline is followed by the male, making Mary's bloodline irrelevant. But since, Joseph is not the real father either, his bloodline would also be irrelevant.

yes, I understand why you and the Rev. Phelps want to make that argument....

I can school you AND Rev. Philips on Scripture.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

Wrong! The Bible states a global flood. Man are you getting beat up in this debate.LOL

Genesis 6:17
Behold, I, even I am bringing the flood of water upon the earth, to destroy all flesh in which is the breath of life, from under heaven; everything that is on the earth shall perish.

20 families??? Ummm there were other people on the earth, where do you think Cain and Able chose brides from? Their ribs? LOL. There was also the Nephilim(probably Vikings) having babies with women of men(probably Asiatic people).

But hey! You believe Adam and Eve were the first people even though no scientific evidence supports this. They actually support the opposite,. It's called evolution.lol

sorry dude, but if you're going to insist on a totally literal interpretation of the Bible you're stuck with twenty generations.....how many people can there be twenty generations after two adults?.....

According to any one that can do math.LOL Add up the years and see.

you and Usscher....invalid assumptions....

Ummmm but the Sumerian account states that it was The "great gods" Anu, Enlil, Ninurta, Ennugi, and Ea were sworn to secrecy about their plan to cause the flood. Not the god of the jews.lol And it was Ea who tipped Gilgamesh about the flood.

so some of the great grandchildren weren't paying attention around the campfires....

My "assumptions" make more sense then your fairy tale beliefs.

none of the ones you've shared on this thread make any sense whatsoever....

And? Romans still exist too.

someone should tell Giorgio Napolitano he's an imposter.....

If you agree that the Bible is not infallible and acknowledge mistakes, then you cannot really rely on it's historical accuracy now can you? I laugh when I hear the new word being used "inerrancy" that is after the infallibility label couldn't stick. lol

inerrancy is a new word for you?.....its been around since before you were born....however, your biggest problem is that you don't realize your interpretations aren't infallible or inerrant.....

 

[J Craft]

This issue was resolved by better theological minds than I have read here, no mean insult intended.

COUNCIL OF NICAEA: DEBATING JESUS’
http://ho-logos.blogspot.com/2009/03/deity-of-christ-rc-sproul.html

 

[Sun Devil]

Really? how about we discuss those, what are they?

Matthew 11:25

"At that time Jesus said, "I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to infants. 26"Yes, Father, for this way was well-pleasing in Your sight.…"


Luke 10:21

"At that time Jesus, full of joy through the Holy Spirit, said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this is what you were pleased to do."

Luke 10:22

""All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows who the Son is except the Father, and no one knows who the Father is except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him."

Luke 22:42

"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."


John 11:41


"So they took away the stone. Then Jesus looked up and said, "Father, I thank you that you have heard me."

John 12:27


"Now my soul is troubled, and what shall I say? 'Father, save me from this hour'? No, it was for this very reason I came to this hour."

Sounds pretty clear Jesus was subordinate to God. After all what person on equal footing with God asks for help or acknowledges someone who has dominion over everything?

 

[Sun Devil]

This issue was resolved by better theological minds than I have read here, no mean insult intended.

COUNCIL OF NICAEA: DEBATING JESUS’
http://ho-logos.blogspot.com/2009/03/deity-of-christ-rc-sproul.html

The council of Nicea was a sham. If they didn't provide the answers that Constantine wanted they were either exiled or killed.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

The council of Nicea was a sham.

all the heretics feel that way......

 

[J Craft]

The council of Nicea was a sham. If they didn't provide the answers that Constantine wanted they were either exiled or killed.

Who was present at Nicea that Constantine had put to death? Who that was present did he have exiled? Better yet, who was present and what view(s)did each hold?

 

[wiseones2cents]

sorry dude, but if you're going to insist on a totally literal interpretation of the Bible you're stuck with twenty generations.....how many people can there be twenty generations after two adults?.....

OH OH! Someone is ignoring the big elephant in the room! You said it wasn't global and the Bible states it was global. ROTFLOL!!! You believe in the fairy tale story that doesn't make sense!

Again, where did Cain and Abel gain wives from neighboring villages? How about the Nephilim that the Bible states were making babies with the locals?lolThere were all kinds of other people around and evolution will back it up!

YOUR the one that believes in literal interpretation! I believe it's all mythology! If you think Adam and Eve were the first humans ever made? Evolution TOTALLY disproves that. Basically the Bible is about ONE certain bloodline of a family. And this line obviously had an ancestral lord, they received this lineage from!

you and Usscher....invalid assumptions....

Your in denial! LOL

Lets see how smart you are. What year did the flood occur and what year did Noah presumably walk the earth(This will be fun)!

so some of the great grandchildren weren't paying attention around the campfires....

Ummm since the Gilgamesh tale came first that would mean that the second version was exaggerated and full of shit. That would be the Old Testament version. LOL How's your faith?lol

none of the ones you've shared on this thread make any sense whatsoever....

Are you saying the Bible is correct and you deny that the earth is millions of years old and evolution?

someone should tell Giorgio Napolitano he's an imposter.....

Remnants of the Roman people are everywhere. The empire fell but not the people!

inerrancy is a new word for you?.....its been around since before you were born....however, your biggest problem is that you don't realize your interpretations aren't infallible or inerrant.....

I've debated on Christian apologetic sights for years. Just now people are starting to switch from Infallibility to inerrancy. Though they all have a different meaning of what inerrancy means. Infallibility, inerrancy, both are a bunch of crap words made for fools like you!

P.S. He wont give up folks! Even though he knows in his heart he is losing, and it will just get worse from here on in.lol

 

[PostmodernProphet]

YOUR the one that believes in literal interpretation!

another incorrect assessment......you have many.....

Lets see how smart you are. What year did the flood occur and what year did Noah presumably walk the earth(This will be fun)!

based on DNA studies, likely sometime between 100,000 and 200,000 years ago.....

Ummm since the Gilgamesh tale came first that would mean that the second version was exaggerated and full of shit. That would be the Old Testament version. LOL How's your faith?lol

??....no....the OT version dates from the same event....the Jews were simply more accurate.....

Are you saying the Bible is correct and you deny that the earth is millions of years old and evolution?

the Bible is correct, the earth is millions of years old and blue butterflies evolved from brown butterflies.....

Remnants of the Roman people are everywhere. The empire fell but not the people!

and we were talking about the empire.....and unless the people are from a city, they are not Romans.......

I've debated on Christian apologetic sights for years.

I'm surprised you haven't quit from embarrassment yet....

Just now people are starting to switch from Infallibility to inerrancy.

and yet I've been familiar with the term since I was a young man.....and that's been a looong time....

P.S. He wont give up folks! Even though he knows in his heart he is losing, and it will just get worse from here on in.lol

dude you have a long way to go....the longest argument I've ever had with an atheist went over 500 pages.....I expect he still has night terrors......

 

[wiseones2cents]

another incorrect assessment......you have many.....

Your the one that insisted there were only a few people around at the time of the flood! lol

based on DNA studies, likely sometime between 100,000 and 200,000 years ago.....

DNA studies of who? Noah? ROTFLOL HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can you back that up with a link? You know civilization dates back maybe 7000 years don't you? Do you also know that kind of boat building technology is even less then that?

??....no....the OT version dates from the same event....the Jews were simply more accurate.....

LOL BULLSHIT!! How could they be more accurate if they were written later on?lol Epic of Gilgamesh dates back about 1800 to 2500 BC! More like the OT version is bullshit and exaggerated! That's why most scholars say it never happened!

It is common for Conquerors to absorb local mythology and mix it in with theirs.

the Bible is correct, the earth is millions of years old and blue butterflies evolved from brown butterflies.....

WRONG! The Bible states the earth and the first man was created about 7000 years ago! Though evolution tells us the homo-sapiens has been around for MUCH longer then this!

and we were talking about the empire.....and unless the people are from a city, they are not Romans.......

I will ask you again you idiot(you are deflecting)! Where was the god of the jews when they got their ass handed to them by the Romans and Nazi Germany??

I'm surprised you haven't quit from embarrassment yet....

Embarrassment? I school preachers and scholars on Scripture. You? I could dance circles around. It should be you that is embarrassed by your replies. Anyone watching sees you are a brainwashed idiot!

and yet I've been familiar with the term since I was a young man.....and that's been a looong time....

On the evangelical boards it's something knew!

dude you have a long way to go....the longest argument I've ever had with an atheist went over 500 pages.....I expect he still has night terrors......

He probably shook his head and said what an idiot I am dealing with.lol I doubt he lost sleep over you. I'm already making you look stupid and only after how much pages? You are unable to support your delusions. And the fact that I have to correct you on Bible Scripture numerous times, tells me, you don't know enough about the Bible to debate scripture. All you have is your opinions which are unsupported delusions.lol

 

[PostmodernProphet]

Your the one that insisted there were only a few people around at the time of the flood! lol

I merely pointed out you were being inconsistent.....you insist on a totally literal interpretation of the passage but refuse to accept the consequences of that type of interpretation.....

DNA studies of who? Noah? ROTFLOL HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can you back that up with a link? You know civilization dates back maybe 7000 years don't you? Do you also know that kind of boat building technology is even less then that?

DNA studies of the human race......and why do you believe civilization only dates back 7000 years?......what kind of boat building technology are you referring to.....a type demanded by a totally literal interpretation?...

LOL BULLSHIT!! How could they be more accurate if they were written later on?lol Epic of Gilgamesh dates back about 1800 to 2500 BC! More like the OT version is bullshit and exaggerated! That's why most scholars say it never happened!

1) there is no reason to believe the Epic of Gilgamesh is older, 2) there is no reason to assume something that WAS written earlier is more accurate....would a manuscript written in the 1400s saying the world was flat be more accurate than a document written in 1950 which said it was not?.......

It is common for Conquerors to absorb local mythology and mix it in with theirs.

so you are arguing that when the Assyrians conquered the Israelites they absorbed their mythology and mixed it in with theirs?.....or were you arguing that the Israelites conquered the Assyrians?......

The Bible states the earth and the first man was created about 7000 years ago!

except for the fact that it doesn't.....

I will ask you again you idiot(you are deflecting)! Where was the god of the jews when they got their ass handed to them by the Romans and Nazi Germany??

????.....the same place he was when he created the earth....sorry, I didn't realize you actually needed an answer......

Embarrassment? I school preachers and scholars on Scripture. You? I could dance circles around. It should be you that is embarrassed by your replies. Anyone watching sees you are a brainwashed idiot!

start dancing.....so far you've been stumbling over your own feet....

On the evangelical boards it's something knew!

lol.....evangelical boards are something new.....

And the fact that I have to correct you on Bible Scripture numerous times, tells me, you don't know enough about the Bible to debate scripture. All you have is your opinions which are unsupported delusions.lol

lol.....and yet, my "unsupported delusions" are the opinions of all Christianity and your opinions are only your own.......

 

[wiseones2cents]

I merely pointed out you were being inconsistent.....you insist on a totally literal interpretation of the passage but refuse to accept the consequences of that type of interpretation.....

I merely pointed out YOUR contradictions. I don't insist on literal interpretations. YOU do. You insisted there were only 237 animal species, I'm still waiting for you to back that up! lol You claimed it was a regional flood, not the global flood as your inerrant Bible clearly states. If your Bible exaggerated about that, it could have exaggerated about lots of things.

I want you to admit right now the Bible is historically inaccurate! Adam and Eve were not the first two people and the world was not created 7000 years ago and no global flood occurred!

DNA studies of the human race......and why do you believe civilization only dates back 7000 years?......what kind of boat building technology are you referring to.....a type demanded by a totally literal interpretation?...

How can that bee if Scientists say no flood occurred? How can they get DNA samples to prove something that they never say occurred?lol 7000 years ago, the boats couldn't fit two people and a goat. Let alone two of each animal.lol

1) there is no reason to believe the Epic of Gilgamesh is older, 2) there is no reason to assume something that WAS written earlier is more accurate....would a manuscript written in the 1400s saying the world was flat be more accurate than a document written in 1950 which said it was not?.......

Carbon dating says it is older! The Epic of Gilgamesh is of Sumerian origin. They are a NON-Semitic people. The story was later adopted by the Akkadians, who were a Semitic people! Basically they stole it.lol

so you are arguing that when the Assyrians conquered the Israelites they absorbed their mythology and mixed it in with theirs?.....or were you arguing that the Israelites conquered the Assyrians?......

Israelis never conquered the Assyrians. Romans mixed in Christianity with their pagan beliefs. And pagans later introduced pagan beliefs to Christianity. Like Christmas trees and the holiday of Easter(eostre)

except for the fact that it doesn't.....

Add the years of the patriarchs up! It does!!!LOL Your in denial. Want me to post all the ages for you? And add them up? Could your Bible be errant? LOL

????.....the same place he was when he created the earth....sorry, I didn't realize you actually needed an answer......

Why didn't he save his chosen people? Or was it gods will they were massacred?

start dancing.....so far you've been stumbling over your own feet....

Only in your brainwashed mind.lol

lol.....and yet, my "unsupported delusions" are the opinions of all Christianity and your opinions are only your own.......

I use Scripture and science to counter your delusions. You use your stupidity.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

I merely pointed out YOUR contradictions. I don't insist on literal interpretations. YOU do. You insisted there were only 237 animal species, I'm still waiting for you to back that up! lol You claimed it was a regional flood, not the global flood as your inerrant Bible clearly states. If your Bible exaggerated about that, it could have exaggerated about lots of things.

except, obviously I do not insist on literal interpretations.....I didn't "insist" on 237 species....I picked a random number, as you did when you claimed it was millions.....

I want you to admit right now the Bible is historically inaccurate! Adam and Eve were not the first two people and the world was not created 7000 years ago and no global flood occurred!

why would I say it was inaccurate......Adam and Eve are the names attributed to the first two people......whoever the first two people were, they were Adam and Eve......the Bible does not say the world was created 7000 years ago and the Bible does not insist upon a global flood.....I will admit the Bible does not say what you claim it does.....will that suffice?....

How can that bee if Scientists say no flood occurred? How can they get DNA samples to prove something that they never say occurred?lol 7000 years ago, the boats couldn't fit two people and a goat. Let alone two of each animal.lol

first you need to get over your silly 7000 years fixation.....second, they took DNA samples of a wide variety of people living today and determined when their common ancestor would have lived....I'm sure you're familiar with the study and just pretending you are not.....

Carbon dating says it is older! The Epic of Gilgamesh is of Sumerian origin. They are a NON-Semitic people. The story was later adopted by the Akkadians, who were a Semitic people! Basically they stole it.lol

??....how do you carbon date a story?.....

Israelis never conquered the Assyrians. Romans mixed in Christianity with their pagan beliefs. And pagans later introduced pagan beliefs to Christianity. Like Christmas trees and the holiday of Easter(eostre)

and this relates to our discussion, how?....

Add the years of the patriarchs up! It does!!!LOL Your in denial. Want me to post all the ages for you? And add them up? Could your Bible be errant? LOL

if you assume you are referring to a historical record instead of a revelation of the means to salvation, you might have a half-assed argument of sorts.....

Why didn't he save his chosen people?

he has.....

I use Scripture and science to counter your delusions.

you use neither very well....

 

[wiseones2cents]

Who was present at Nicea that Constantine had put to death? Who that was present did he have exiled? Better yet, who was present and what view(s)did each hold?

If I recall didn't they hurry up the date so that one of the key Arians failed to attend?

 

[wiseones2cents]

except, obviously I do not insist on literal interpretations.....I didn't "insist" on 237 species....I picked a random number, as you did when you claimed it was millions.....

Yawn. This guy is wasting my time. I ASKED YOU HOW DID NOAH GET 2 OF EVERYANIMAL ON THE ARK! Answer the question!!! And I already made you look stupid when you said it was regional but your inerrant Bible stated it was global.lol

why would I say it was inaccurate......Adam and Eve are the names attributed to the first two people......whoever the first two people were, they were Adam and Eve......the Bible does not say the world was created 7000 years ago and the Bible does not insist upon a global flood.....I will admit the Bible does not say what you claim it does.....will that suffice?....

I just showed above it's inaccurate. It speaks of a global flood and there is no evidence of that. Also the Adam and Eve myth has been debunked by something called EVOLUTION! Have you heard of it? If you add up all the ages of Adam till now? The Bible indeed does say it's around 7000 years old. The Bible is historically incorrect on many counts. The partying of the red sea sounds like a exaggerated version of when they crossed the Jordan.

first you need to get over your silly 7000 years fixation.....second, they took DNA samples of a wide variety of people living today and determined when their common ancestor would have lived....I'm sure you're familiar with the study and just pretending you are not.....

First? Add up all the years of the Patriarchs! Even though two DIFFERENT genealogies are given between 1 Chronicles and Gospel of Luke. CLEARLY pointing to its ERRORS!

From Adam(and creation) to the flood there is 1656 years. Again when was Noah around? About 400 years later? Abraham was born. Read the book of Genesis and add them up. I will supply the numbers if you like and start another thread.

I'm familiar with no DNA study that acknowledges a global flood or an extermination of all life.

??....how do you carbon date a story?.....

The text! And the Sumerian "story" predates the Bible, and was written by a NON SEMITIC PEOPLE! Meaning the original story is NOT Jewish.

and this relates to our discussion, how?....

Showing that many cultures shared/stole myths.

if you assume you are referring to a historical record instead of a revelation of the means to salvation, you might have a half-assed argument of sorts.....

Do I sense a cop-out? Let me know? I will take the time, start a new thread and add them up for you! Someone has to snap you out of your delusions!

he has.....

ummmm no he didn't. The jews were slaughtered many times. Was Hitler doing GOD's will?

The god of the jews was a tribal warlord. Whom they had a covenant/alliance with. Probably via marriage. When they were attacked by other tribes, they would call to the warlord for help and he would arrive and avenge them. When the warlord died and a new warlord came, the jews were no longer saved by anyone. They were actually outcast. Fortunately for them, they were well educated in commerce and were found useful by the new authority. They used their influence to try to regain authority many times........

Daniel was the right hand man of the Babylonian warlord Nebuchadnezzar. Where he interpreted the Babylonian's Prophetic dream for Profit, ummmm I mean prophet.lol Same thing with Joseph and the Pharoah!

you use neither very well....

Actually Scripture has backed what I have been saying all along. Your lack or scriptural knowledge and science is obvious. tell us again how it was a regional flood. LOL!!!

Look all over this thread how many times I shut you up, with my Scriptural knowledge.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

Yawn. This guy is wasting my time. I ASKED YOU HOW DID NOAH GET 2 OF EVERYANIMAL ON THE ARK! Answer the question!!! And I already made you look stupid when you said it was regional but your inerrant Bible stated it was global.lol

how many did he have to bring....obviously it would be no problem bringing 237 species of animal on board (not that I think it was necessary, as the purpose of the flood was to eliminate the disobedient humans, not to kill aardvarks)......

I just showed above it's inaccurate. It speaks of a global flood and there is no evidence of that.

you've shown me your opinion....I don't consider it binding...

Also the Adam and Eve myth has been debunked by something called EVOLUTION! Have you heard of it?

do you believe evolution proves that human beings evolved from single celled organisms?......the first step of that process would obviously be the evolution of a single celled organism into a multicelled organism......that should be a piece of cake compared to the process of evolving into the complexity of a human being.....a bit problematic though, as science has never demonstrated that its ever happened......how then do you think science has "debunked" the concept of a first man and first woman (not to mention that even if they evolved, there had to be a first of both)......

If you add up all the ages of Adam till now? The Bible indeed does say it's around 7000 years old.

when was Adam born?....

From Adam(and creation) to the flood there is 1656 years.

I've pointed this out before.....if you're going to insist on a literal interpretation of Genesis you're stuck with the simple fact that there wouldn't have been very many people around to drown.......why a global flood?......would a bathtub have been sufficient?.....

I'm familiar with no DNA study that acknowledges a global flood or an extermination of all life.

however, you ARE familiar with a DNA study that indicates all of humanity stemmed from a single woman who lived somewhere in Africa 100k to 200k years ago....

The text!

so you are saying the key is the oldest surviving manuscript?.......
by the way, I believe the oldest surviving copy of the Gilgamesh tales dates from around 700BC......

Showing that many cultures shared/stole myths.

or that their ancestors shared an experience.....

ummmm no he didn't. The jews were slaughtered many times.

and yet, while we no longer have Assyrians or Babylonians, we have Jews.....and they have their own nation in the same place they started....

The god of the jews was a tribal warlord.

interesting fantasy, with far less documentation than that found in scripture....actually, without any documentation at all....

with my Scriptural knowledge.

lol....

 

[wiseones2cents]

how many did he have to bring....obviously it would be no problem bringing 237 species of animal on board (not that I think it was necessary, as the purpose of the flood was to eliminate the disobedient humans, not to kill aardvarks)......

ALL OF THEM NO?? Which totals a lot more then 237 species. Yet, the Bible states ALL living things were killed. Including aardvarks.

you've shown me your opinion....I don't consider it binding...

Your source of proof is a PROVEN historically inaccurate book.lol Had a global flood(which you stated was regional) had occurred? The earth would have been scorched by huge salt deposits. Large regional floods is not only more possibly. It is very likely, but that is not what the Bible states, and I already showed you that.

Therefore science backs my opinion. Your opinion is backed by an PROVEN historically inaccurate book.

do you believe evolution proves that human beings evolved from single celled organisms?......the first step of that process would obviously be the evolution of a single celled organism into a multicelled organism......that should be a piece of cake compared to the process of evolving into the complexity of a human being.....a bit problematic though, as science has never demonstrated that its ever happened......how then do you think science has "debunked" the concept of a first man and first woman (not to mention that even if they evolved, there had to be a first of both)......

Everything evolved out of micro organisms. Whether single or multi celled. The complexity of the homo-sapiens is millions or years in the making. Something your puny mind is unable to grasp. Unlike your Bible mythology of Adam and Eve mysteriously appearing 7000 years ago. Evolution is scientifically supported. lol And the lie that Adam was immortal is another myth. He was born mortal.

Basically what happened was there was a race of humanoid beings that bred with another race of humanoid beings. Saying lets make them in our image. Interracial breeding.

when was Adam born?....

Approximately 7000 years ago. Yet scientists say that the homo-sapien dates back millions of years.

I've pointed this out before.....if you're going to insist on a literal interpretation of Genesis you're stuck with the simple fact that there wouldn't have been very many people around to drown.......why a global flood?......would a bathtub have been sufficient?.....

Literal?? LOL!! Are you saying the age figures shouldn't be taken literally you idiot???? Why a global flood? Ask the god of the jews! lol That's what your inerrant Bible states.lol I'm sure there were MANY people around, and if they died of a flood, even a regional flood, it was not a "god" that did it. It's called NATURE! People were so superstitious back then they though earthquakes happened when GOD was mad.LOL

however, you ARE familiar with a DNA study that indicates all of humanity stemmed from a single woman who lived somewhere in Africa 100k to 200k years ago....

I looked it up. This still does not support your delusions of Adam and Eve for many obvious reasons.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/evolution/female-ancestor.htm

The study's lead author, Rebecca Cann, called her colleagues' and her choice to use Eve as the name "a playful misnomer," and pointed out that the study wasn't implying that the Mitochondrial Eve wasn't the first -- or only -- woman on Earth during the time she lived [source: Cann]. Instead, this woman is simply the most recent person to whom all people can trace their genealogy. In other words, there were many women who came before her and many women who came after, but her life is the point from which all modern branches on humanity's family tree grew.

so you are saying the key is the oldest surviving manuscript?.......
by the way, I believe the oldest surviving copy of the Gilgamesh tales dates from around 700BC......

The original script is non-semetic, which means it wasn't jewish folklore.

What you believe and the truth are two different things. The best intact copies date back to 700 B.C.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_literature

Early Bronze Age: 3rd millennium BC (approximate dates shown) The earliest written literature dates from about 2600 BC (classical Sumerian).[1] The earliest literary author known by name is Enheduanna, dating to ca. the 24th century BC. Certain literary texts are difficult to date, such as the Egyptian Book of the Dead which was recorded in the Papyrus of Ani around 1240 BC, but other versions of the book probably date from about the 18th century BC.
2600 Sumerian texts from Abu Salabikh, including the Instructions of Shuruppak and the Kesh temple hymn
2400 Egyptian Pyramid Texts, including the Cannibal Hymn
2400 Sumerian Code of Urukagina [2]
2400 Egyptian Palermo stone
2350 Egyptian The Maxims of Ptahhotep
2270 Sumerian Enheduanna's Hymns
2250-2000 Sumerian Earliest stories in the Epic of Gilgamesh [3][4]
2100 Sumerian Curse of Agade
2100 Sumerian Debate between Bird and Fish
2050 Sumerian Code of Ur-Nammu
2000 Egyptian Coffin Texts
2000 Sumerian Lament for Ur
2000 Sumerian Enmerkar and the Lord of Aratta

or that their ancestors shared an experience.....

Prove it. Why would Sumerians who did not have contact with semitic people at the time, adopt semitic legends? Also the code of Ur-Nammu is also Sumerian and predates the Mosaic laws. I guess the god of the jews visited the Sumerians first.lol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Ur-Nammu

and yet, while we no longer have Assyrians or Babylonians, we have Jews.....and they have their own nation in the same place they started....

You tried that silly analogy and I pointed out Romans still exist to do. Actually so do Assyrians. Man I enjoy making you look stupid!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assyrians_in_Iraq

Still doesn't explain why god of the jews allowed so many jews to get slaughtered.

interesting fantasy, with far less documentation than that found in scripture....actually, without any documentation at all....

Actually I can easily prove it. But I know it will fall on deaf ears. Up for the challenge? I will start a new thread.

lol....

So far I posted Scripture that contradicts your scriptural beliefs which means, you don't know Scripture, therefore you are laughing at your own ignorance(or stupidity).lol

 

[PostmodernProphet]

ALL OF THEM NO?? Which totals a lot more then 237 species. Yet, the Bible states ALL living things were killed. Including aardvarks.

how many then, 239?....341?....

but that is not what the Bible states, and I already showed you that.

you've told me many things that the Bible does not state....

Everything evolved out of micro organisms. Whether single or multi celled.

got any evidence showing a single celled organism evolving into a multicelled organism?.....if you think they evolved into something as complex as a human being, demonstrating something as simple as that little step should be easy for science to duplicate.....

Basically what happened was there was a race of humanoid beings that bred with another race of humanoid beings. Saying lets make them in our image. Interracial breeding.

so instead of evolution you believe its due to interacial marriage?......

Approximately 7000 years ago.

and you have proof of this?.....tell me this, did Genesis 3 happen the day after Genesis 2 or was it a few weeks.....

Literal?? LOL!! Are you saying the age figures shouldn't be taken literally you idiot???? Why a global flood? Ask the god of the jews! lol That's what your inerrant Bible states.lol I'm sure there were MANY people around, and if they died of a flood, even a regional flood, it was not a "god" that did it. It's called NATURE! People were so superstitious back then they though earthquakes happened when GOD was mad.LOL

actually yes....I do no share your belief in biblical literalism.....

I looked it up. This still does not support your delusions of Adam and Eve for many obvious reasons.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/evolution/female-ancestor.htm

The study's lead author, Rebecca Cann, called her colleagues' and her choice to use Eve as the name "a playful misnomer," and pointed out that the study wasn't implying that the Mitochondrial Eve wasn't the first -- or only -- woman on Earth during the time she lived [source: Cann]. Instead, this woman is simply the most recent person to whom all people can trace their genealogy. In other words, there were many women who came before her and many women who came after, but her life is the point from which all modern branches on humanity's family tree grew.

if none of us share the DNA of those other women what difference does it make to us that they all drowned?.....

The original script is non-semetic, which means it wasn't jewish folklore.

omigorsh, you have the original script?.....that must be worth a fortune....

What you believe and the truth are two different things. The best intact copies date back to 700 B.C.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_literature

Early Bronze Age: 3rd millennium BC (approximate dates shown) The earliest written literature dates from about 2600 BC (classical Sumerian).[1] The earliest literary author known by name is Enheduanna, dating to ca. the 24th century BC. Certain literary texts are difficult to date, such as the Egyptian Book of the Dead which was recorded in the Papyrus of Ani around 1240 BC, but other versions of the book probably date from about the 18th century BC.
2600 Sumerian texts from Abu Salabikh, including the Instructions of Shuruppak and the Kesh temple hymn
2400 Egyptian Pyramid Texts, including the Cannibal Hymn
2400 Sumerian Code of Urukagina [2]
2400 Egyptian Palermo stone
2350 Egyptian The Maxims of Ptahhotep
2270 Sumerian Enheduanna's Hymns
2250-2000 Sumerian Earliest stories in the Epic of Gilgamesh [3][4]
2100 Sumerian Curse of Agade
2100 Sumerian Debate between Bird and Fish
2050 Sumerian Code of Ur-Nammu
2000 Egyptian Coffin Texts
2000 Sumerian Lament for Ur
2000 Sumerian Enmerkar and the Lord of Aratta

are you familiar with the timing of the flood story being inserted into the Gilgamesh lore?......

Prove it. Why would Sumerians who did not have contact with semitic people at the time, adopt semitic legends?

they weren't.....there were relating the legends dealing with one of their ancestors....named Noah.....

Also the code of Ur-Nammu is also Sumerian and predates the Mosaic laws. I guess the god of the jews visited the Sumerians first.lol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Ur-Nammu

One mina ( 1/60 of a talent ) was made equal to 60 shekels ( 1 shekel = 11 grams ) . Among the surviving laws are these:

1. If a man commits a murder, that man must be killed.
2. If a man commits a robbery, he will be killed.
3. If a man commits a kidnapping, he is to be imprisoned and pay 15 shekels of silver.
4. If a slave marries a slave, and that slave is set free, he does not leave the household.
5. If a slave marries a native (i.e. free) person, he/she is to hand the firstborn son over to his owner.
6. If a man violates the right of another and deflowers the virgin wife of a young man, they shall kill that male.
7. If the wife of a man followed after another man and he slept with her, they shall slay that woman, but that male shall be set free. (§4 in some translations)
8. If a man proceeded by force, and deflowered the virgin female slave of another man, that man must pay five shekels of silver. (5)
9. If a man divorces his first-time wife, he shall pay her one mina of silver. (6)
10. If it is a (former) widow whom he divorces, he shall pay her half a mina of silver. (7)
11. If the man had slept with the widow without there having been any marriage contract, he need not pay any silver. (8)
13. If a man is accused of sorcery he must undergo ordeal by water; if he is proven innocent, his accuser must pay 3 shekels. (10)
14. If a man accused the wife of a man of adultery, and the river ordeal proved her innocent, then the man who had accused her must pay one-third of a mina of silver. (11)
15. If a prospective son-in-law enters the house of his prospective father-in-law, but his father-in-law later gives his daughter to another man, the father-in-law shall return to the rejected son-in-law twofold the amount of bridal presents he had brought. (12)
17. If a slave escapes from the city limits, and someone returns him, the owner shall pay two shekels to the one who returned him. (14)
18. If a man knocks out the eye of another man, he shall weigh out ½ a mina of silver. (15)
19. If a man has cut off another man’s foot, he is to pay ten shekels. (16)
20. If a man, in the course of a scuffle, smashed the limb of another man with a club, he shall pay one mina of silver. (17)
21. If someone severed the nose of another man with a copper knife, he must pay two-thirds of a mina of silver. (18)
22. If a man knocks out a tooth of another man, he shall pay two shekels of silver. (19)
24. [text destroyed...] If he does not have a slave, he is to pay 10 shekels of silver. If he does not have silver, he is to give another thing that belongs to him. (21)
25. If a man’s slave-woman, comparing herself to her mistress, speaks insolently to her, her mouth shall be scoured with 1 quart of salt. (22)
28. If a man appeared as a witness, and was shown to be a perjurer, he must pay fifteen shekels of silver. (25)
29. If a man appears as a witness, but withdraws his oath, he must make payment, to the extent of the value in litigation of the case. (26)
30. If a man stealthily cultivates the field of another man and he raises a complaint, this is however to be rejected, and this man will lose his expenses. (27)
31. If a man flooded the field of a man with water, he shall measure out three kur of barley per iku of field. (28)
32. If a man had let an arable field to a(nother) man for cultivation, but he did not cultivate it, turning it into wasteland, he shall measure out three kur of barley per iku of field. (29)

gosh, just like the Ten Commandments!......lol....

You tried that silly analogy and I pointed out Romans still exist to do. Actually so do Assyrians. Man I enjoy making you look stupid!!!

sorry, no Roman Empire, no Assyrian Empire, no Bablyonian Empire....you seem to have missed when you tried to make me look stupid....

Still doesn't explain why god of the jews allowed so many jews to get slaughtered.

did you remind him he owed you an explanation?....I suppose you could accept what he said in the book of Jeremiah as an explanation of why he let them go into captivity.....

Actually I can easily prove it. But I know it will fall on deaf ears. Up for the challenge? I will start a new thread.

this one isn't enough of an embarrassment for you?....

So far I posted Scripture that contradicts your scriptural beliefs which means, you don't know Scripture, therefore you are laughing at your own ignorance(or stupidity).lol

no, so far you've posted a lot of bullshit in which your opinion of scripture contradicts what Christianity has been teaching for 2000 years.....apparently you think you're better at it......

 

[J Craft]

If I recall didn't they hurry up the date so that one of the key Arians failed to attend?

No.

 

[wiseones2cents]

Matthew 11:25

"At that time Jesus said, "I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to infants. 26"Yes, Father, for this way was well-pleasing in Your sight.…"


Luke 10:21

"At that time Jesus, full of joy through the Holy Spirit, said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this is what you were pleased to do."

Luke 10:22

""All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows who the Son is except the Father, and no one knows who the Father is except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him."

Luke 22:42

"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."


John 11:41


"So they took away the stone. Then Jesus looked up and said, "Father, I thank you that you have heard me."

John 12:27


"Now my soul is troubled, and what shall I say? 'Father, save me from this hour'? No, it was for this very reason I came to this hour."

Sounds pretty clear Jesus was subordinate to God. After all what person on equal footing with God asks for help or acknowledges someone who has dominion over everything?

Exactly.

Matthew 24:36
“But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone.

They don't understand that the trinity is a pagan doctrine. 3 emperors equals one.