Most Gazans didn't support Hamas attacking

volsrock said:
If most Germans didn't support the Nazis in 1943 should that have kept us from bombing the shit out of it... And killing every Nazi we could?
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You have the kind of fanatical nationalist rightwing psychology that you would have loved the Dresden and Tokyo fire bombings if you were born half a century earlier.

Jumping into your time machine to time travel back 80 years to find something to complain about doesn't cut the mustard.

Human values and ethics change over time. Slavery was abolished in 1865 and women got the right to vote in 1920.

In hindsight, fire bombing civilians was wrong and served no valid strategic military purpose.


In the year 2023, your dream of carpet bombing all of Gaza into a smouldering pile of ash is reprehensible, and I trust the IDF to have more sense than you about it.
 
Althea said:
It doesn't make sense to us. This is a statement from a Hamas official during a recent interview.


"The Israelis are known to love life. We, on the other hand, sacrifice ourselves. We consider our dead to be martyrs. The thing any Palestinian desires the most is to be martyred for the sake of Allah, defending his land," he continued. "We have been preparing for this for two years. We have local factories for everything. We have rockets with ranges of 250 kilometers, 160 kilometers, 80 kilometers, 45 kilometers and 10 kilometers."



I'm quite sure the majority of Palestinians do not wish to be included in this group.
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Thanks. Of course the killers and beheaders only sacrificed those they killed and beheaded, then ran away.

But maybe you’re suggesting that after enduring Israel for 75 years they had enough and decided to taunt their own annihilation.
 
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martin said:
Thanks. Of course the killers and beheaders only sacrificed those they killed and beheaded, then ran away.

But maybe you’re suggesting that after enduring Israel for 75 years they had enough and decided to taunt their own annihilation.
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I started a thread about the interview. It got buried under myriad Israel threads.

Hamas knows that they will be wiped out, but they hope to start a war that drags many nations into the fight.

Ironically, if Hamas would stop with the terrorist actions, Palestine would get most of the world to back some sort of solution that ends the tyranny.
 
Althea said:
I started a thread about the interview. It got buried under myriad Israel threads.

Hamas knows that they will be wiped out, but they hope to start a war that drags many nations into the fight.

Ironically, if Hamas would stop with the terrorist actions, Palestine would get most of the world to back some sort of solution that ends the tyranny.
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Interesting that you admit Palestinian terrorism is producing negative results. Kudos! :thup:
 
domer76 said:
You asked a very stupid question.

Looks like you have more in common with Trumpers than I do.
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In your liberal-minded opinion.

Disagreed on the Trumper comparison, but I'm content for others to decide for themselves who is siding with the assholes and who is trying to be reasonable. :)
 
T. A. Gardner said:
More to the point, the Gazans could be working to improve their living conditions and lives rather than spending energy and wealth on waging perpetual--and ineffectual--war on Israel...
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They're radical Islam's favorite people; they're poorly educated and fed weapons.

What is your experience with training people or animals, Terry?

Taxpayers paid for a lot of my training. :D
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Wrong. White Phosphorus is allowed under the Geneva Convention and UN rules on warfare as a smoke agent. However, at this point, there is no evidence Israel is actually using WP against Gaza. There are claims by hand wringing radical Leftist and pro-Palestinian groups that they are, but there is no solid evidence of it presented.
It really wouldn't make much sense in any case. High explosive shells and bombs are far, far more effective against mostly concrete buildings in a dense urban environment.
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I misspoke a little bit. Israel has used white phosphorus in the past, not even attempting to discriminate between civilians and military targets and found to be in violation of International Humanitarian Law. They are doing the same thing here.
 
Doc Dutch said:
In your liberal-minded opinion.

Disagreed on the Trumper comparison, but I'm content for others to decide for themselves who is siding with the assholes and who is trying to be reasonable. :)
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I am siding with the Gaza civilians who have been living in an outdoor prison, many for their entire lives, under occupied rule by an oppressive apartheid government, Israel.
 
Doc Dutch said:
They're radical Islam's favorite people; they're poorly educated and fed weapons.

What is your experience with training people or animals, Terry?

Taxpayers paid for a lot of my training. :D
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With Arabs, it's that most, what you might call the rank and file, aren't generally all that bright, have poor educational backgrounds, and have spent their lives learning and growing up expecting others to think for them and tell them what to do.

A friend of mine who was (now retired) a Chief in EOD (sort of like SEALS only they go looking for bombs) related a story of how he was on a training mission with their Saudi counterparts where the Americans were teamed with a Saudi. They were to jump from a helicopter into the gulf, swim about two miles to an abandoned oil platform and then go through exercises 'taking' it.
The guy he got was like the 5th son in an important (not royalty) family and that was put in this unit because of his family's connections. My friend, found out the guy couldn't swim after they hit the water. He had to drag the half-drowned Saudi to the platform and then do their part of the mission on his own.

I've seen where they are completely flummoxed by not having some simple part to fix something and have no real idea how to improvise effectively in maintenance situations. They also tend to be sloppy workmen. That's direct personal observation.

The leadership tends to see the rank and file as little more than cattle to be treated like something you stepped in.
 
domer76 said:
They used it in 2008-2009 over populated areas just like this, killing and injuring civilians, and were found to be in violation of International Humanitarian Law.
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Then v. now. Or, are you blaming them for past sins and claiming without proof they are still doing those sins?
 
Cypress said:
You have the kind of fanatical nationalist rightwing psychology that you would have loved the Dresden and Tokyo fire bombings if you were born half a century earlier.

Jumping into your time machine to time travel back 80 years to find something to complain about doesn't cut the mustard.

Human values and ethics change over time. Slavery was abolished in 1865 and women got the right to vote in 1920.

In hindsight, fire bombing civilians was wrong and served no valid strategic military purpose.


In the year 2023, your dream of carpet bombing all of Gaza into a smouldering pile of ash is reprehensible, and I trust the IDF to have more sense than you about it.
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Tokyo had a lot of small shops making guns etc in peoples homes and dresden had a lot of factories. By burning the cities we were attacking their war time production. Attacking Tokyo may have saved my father and many other soldiers lives. They were loading ships with artillery in the Philippines where my father was when the US dropped the nukes and ended the war. They were going to use those artillery pieces to attack Japan. My father was assigned to one of the ships.

Hamas is firing rockets from peoples homes and from apartment buildings.
 
domer76 said:
I am siding with the Gaza civilians who have been living in an outdoor prison, many for their entire lives, under occupied rule by an oppressive apartheid government, Israel.
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Right.
The folks who gleefully danced on their streets when the twin towers were taken down.
Side with them and make yourself known.
 
domer76 said:
I am siding with the Gaza civilians who have been living in an outdoor prison, many for their entire lives, under occupied rule by an oppressive apartheid government, Israel.
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The consistent and enduring Palestinian rejection of any and all peace initiatives with Israel, most recently the “Deal of the Century,” calls into question the commitment of the Palestinian leadership not only to peace but to the very welfare and safety of the Palestinian people.

Taking into account all the peace initiatives proposed to end the conflict between the Jews and the Palestinian Arabs over the last 83 years, we must consider the possibility that the Palestinians—or at least their leaders—do not want to establish their own state.

Their sight is currently set on the big prize—the entire state of Israel—and they are playing for time. In the meantime, they plan to continue to subsist on monies donated by the Arabs and the Europeans. Many of the Arab states have grown disenchanted with this enterprise, and their assistance, particularly from the Saudis, has been discontinued in recent years.


In November 1947, the same Mufti refused to adopt the UN partition plan that offered to establish two states, one Jewish, the other Arab. The Mufti rejected a two-state solution until the day he died, a choice ordinary Palestinians may well regret. Had he agreed to the UN plan, they would have gained a much larger area than what is on offer today.



https://besacenter.org/palestinian-rejectionism/
 
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