"Don't go to college, go to a trade school"

LV426 said:
Yeah, thanks to tax cuts and Conservative policies always failing.

But forgiving $400B in student loans removes $400B of debt from the books. It doesn't add anything more to the debt.




Not how government budgets work, jackass.
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$400 to one Trillion of debt that will have to be paid for by welders, truck drivers, carpenters, nurse aids, waitresses, mailmen, store clerks, maids etc. They will be paying the OBLIGATIONS for Doctors, Lawyers, Bankers, Engineers, Professors, etc.
 
LV426 said:
1. It stimulates the economy by giving ~50M more to spend in the consumer market, which is 70% of the economy but drives 100% of the growth
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where does erasing some student debt give 50 million more in to the consumer market?

LV426 said:
2. It doesn't add any more to the debt because that money has already been spent.
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you're a moron if you believe that the federal government isn't going to try and get that money back from somewhere else.

LV426 said:
3. Forgiving the debt moves it off our books and reduces the total debt.
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no, it doesn't. It's quite apparent that your degree isn't in an economics field.

LV426 said:
4. A sizeable portion, perhaps even a plurality of Pell Grant recipients, is owed by borrowers of color, so there is also a social justice component to this as well.
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social justice is just reverse racism, racist

LV426 said:
5. The economy gains nothing by having people make student loan payments, but it gains quite a lot if instead of paying loans, those people spend in the consumer market, start a family, and/or buy a house
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once again, showing your complete lack of education regarding economics

LV426 said:
6. Removing the debt obligation frees borrowers to start their own businesses since they can get loans because of their good credit scores that aren't marred by ridiculous student loan payments.
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basically, you're just creating a special class of citizens, giving them a boon while keeping others who were more honorable, ethical, and moral a middle finger.............more class warfare, yay you.
 
ExpressLane said:
$400 to one Trillion of debt that will have to be paid for by welders, truck drivers, carpenters, nurse aids, waitresses, mailmen, store clerks, maids etc. T
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The money has already been spent so you're not paying anything if the debt is forgiven.

Forgiving student debt literally removes it from the national debt.

So the national debt is $400B lighter.

So I suppose you oppose debt reduction, which makes sense since you exploded the debt with useless tax cuts.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
where does erasing some student debt give 50 million more in to the consumer market?
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50M more PEOPLE.

15M of those 50M people will have their debt completely forgiven, which means 15M people will have, on average, $393 more dollars to spend in the consumer market every month.

35M of those 50M people will have up to $10K/$20K of their student debt forgiven (depending on Pell Grant status), but more importantly, payments are capped to 5% of the income and don't accrue interest so long as payments are being made on time.

Again, these are all net benefits to the economy.

The alternative is for those people to continue making debt payments instead of buying shit in the consumer market which spurs innovation and creates jobs.
 
LV426 said:
From tax revenues, you stupid fucking idiot.

You don't pay a single thing when someone else's student loan has been forgiven.

But you do pay when you have to bail out farmer trash because the tariffs they supported destroyed their dumb businesses.
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it's confirmed, you are an economics and civics moron...........you should just shut up instead of embarrassing yourself further
 
SmarterthanYou said:
you're a moron if you believe that the federal government isn't going to try and get that money back from somewhere else.
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You don't seem to understand how debt works.

If debt is forgiven, then it doesn't exist anymore.

So then there's no need to "get that money back from somewhere else" because the debt obligation has been released.

So if there's no debt obligation, then what does that mean for the debt that was forgiven?

This is where college would have really helped you understand things like this.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
no, it doesn't. It's quite apparent that your degree isn't in an economics field
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Yes, it does you fucking idiot because that is how write offs work.

If you forgive a debt, then that means the obligation no longer exists which means the debt no longer exists.

This isn't that complicated.
 
LV426 said:
50M more PEOPLE.

15M of those 50M people will have their debt completely forgiven, which means 15M people will have, on average, $393 more dollars to spend in the consumer market every month.

35M of those 50M people will have up to $10K/$20K of their student debt forgiven (depending on Pell Grant status), but more importantly, payments are capped to 5% of the income and don't accrue interest so long as payments are being made on time.

Again, these are all net benefits to the economy.

The alternative is for those people to continue making debt payments instead of buying shit in the consumer market which spurs innovation and creates jobs.
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so, in fact, those people could have paid off their student loans, you just wanted to buy their votes by easing their self assumed debt. got it.
 
LV426 said:
Yes, it does you fucking idiot because that is how write offs work.

If you forgive a debt, then that means the obligation no longer exists which means the debt no longer exists.

This isn't that complicated.
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the government is not a corporation, you fucking idiot. you have zero fucking clue about government and economics. your college FAILED you.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
basically, you're just creating a special class of citizens, giving them a boon while keeping others who were more honorable, ethical, and moral a middle finger.............more class warfare, yay you.
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No, what we're doing is stimulating the economy by removing debt obligations that prevent citizens from doing things like starting a family, starting a business, or buying a house.

And now you're making a purely emotional argument against student loan forgiveness.

So just like I said at the top, there is no legitimate argument against student debt forgiveness that isn't based in emotions.

If you don't think it's fair that people got their debt forgiven, then go to your shithead boss and ask for a raise.

Why don't you do that? Instead of getting mad at people whose debt was forgiven, get mad at your boss for not paying you your worth.

Because it sounds to me like you are resentful of people who have college degrees and thus, earn more money than you and have higher lifetime earning potential than you.

So instead of screeching about the unfairness of it because someone else benefitted, go screech to your boss about the unfair wage they're paying you.

Or don't and be a little bitchass about it.
 
The reason Vo Tech degrees--such as they are, and usually either a certificate or associates--is because there are lots of schools out there teaching trades that sound cool but aren't in demand or pay poorly. Examples:

Boat and motorcycle mechanic-- low demand
Beauty and hair dressing-- low pay
Animal grooming-- low pay
Medical technicians-- highly repetitive work, like taking blood samples, with little room to move up
Graphic artist-- low pay, low demand
Culinary arts-- low pay

Etcetera...
 
LV426 said:
No, what we're doing is stimulating the economy by removing debt obligations that prevent citizens from doing things like starting a family, starting a business, or buying a house.

And now you're making a purely emotional argument against student loan forgiveness.

So just like I said at the top, there is no legitimate argument against student debt forgiveness that isn't based in emotions.

If you don't think it's fair that people got their debt forgiven, then go to your shithead boss and ask for a raise.

Why don't you do that? Instead of getting mad at people whose debt was forgiven, get mad at your boss for not paying you your worth.

Because it sounds to me like you are resentful of people who have college degrees and thus, earn more money than you and have higher lifetime earning potential than you.

So instead of screeching about the unfairness of it because someone else benefitted, go screech to your boss about the unfair wage they're paying you.

Or don't and be a little bitchass about it.
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you want class warfare. you want special population groups. we get it, you're an idiot.
 
LV426 said:
Will need to see this source because:

Tradesmen salary for this skilled occupation annually averaged ​$54,200​, or ​$26.06​ an hour. The best paid 10 percent could earn ​$87,410​ or more annually, while the lowest paid 10 percent earned ​$31,200​ or less.
https://work.chron.com/typical-wage-tradesman-9225.html

National Average $49,758/year
https://www.ziprecruiter.com/Jobs/Union-Tradesman
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The moron doesn't understand the term 'average', even after I pointed that out.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
it's confirmed, you are an economics and civics moron...........you should just shut up instead of embarrassing yourself further
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What's clear is that you're far too emotional and out of control to talk about this subject.

You can't make an economic argument against it, because you would have already if you could. So your argument against it is centered on your perceived "unfairness", but the real unfairness isn't someone's loan being forgiven, it's your boss paying you a shit wage and pitting you against the working class.

Unless you don't think you're worthy a higher wage...which you absolutely may not think you are.

So do you think you're worthy of a raise?

If other people had their debt forgiven, but you didn't have any debt to forgive, why not ask your boss for a raise?

What is stopping you from doing that?

What is stopping you from saying to your boss, "since my coworker had his debt forgiven but I had no debt to forgive, I think it's only fair that I get a raise."?

The job market favors workers right now, so you have leverage.

The real question is whether or not you're brave enough to use it.
 
Cypress said:
Very few people get rich being a welder or an oceanographer.

Not everyone has the inclination to attend and graduate college, and there's nothing wrong with that. We need an economy that works for them too. My mother said the world needs bus drivers too, and its a shame a lot of our manufacturing base was outsourced to low wage countries.
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It was common to jump right into a well paying factory job just after high school.

Then it seemed like a great idea to offshore labor in order to increase profits.

Up here, when the place was a famous vacation destination, everyone worked the hotels in the summer and made plenty of money. No need for college. Those days are gone too.
 
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