It simply SHOULDN'T be done.
There's a simple solution. I'll provide mine and you can provide yours and coverage for anyone else you choose to fund with your money. If you can't or won't do for those you think should have it, do without.
Polls: Support for Obamacare at all-time high
- Thread starter Bill Fishlore
- Start date
It simply SHOULDN'T be done.
There's a simple solution. I'll provide mine and you can provide yours and coverage for anyone else you choose to fund with your money. If you can't or won't do for those you think should have it, do without.
Obama wasn't elected by the entire country. Trump was elected in the same manner as Obama by getting a minimum of 270 electoral votes. That means your bitch lost because she didn't that minimum.
If you think anyone that didn't have coverage should get it, why don't you prove it by providing it to them with YOUR money? That's right. It would involve you doing something rather than SAYING you care.
How can those of you that think someone that can't pay for something should have it continue to refuse to do it with YOUR money? If you care as much as you say you care, you'd provide coverage for all those that you claim can't afford it instead of constantly looking for ways for taxpayers to fund things for the freeloaders.
Bill Fishlore
New member
Taxpayers versus freeloaders
The dichotomy between taxpayers and freeloaders is a false one. Government is not a consumer purchase made with tax dollars, it is the constitutional agent of American society. Everyone pays taxes, how much and on what is decided by law, as is eligibility for coverage and benefits under ACA.
Like Social Security, ACA is based on the idea "from each according to his ability; to each according to his need." There is no pussy footing around the fact that this is a socialist concept. There are Americans who do not like the idea of socialism in any form and believe that the government should undertake no socialist activities whatsoever. This is understandable and represents one pole of popular opinion.
The United States is a constitutional democracy and one of the most important decisions made by our constitutionally elected government is the degree to which our economy is to be socialized. The citizens who believe that degree should be little to none are a small minority of the voters so they don't get to prevail.
The percent of GDP which is socialized, i.e. under government control, varies from country to country. It might surprise some of our libertarians to see how relatively narrow the gap is between the most socialized economies (Scandinavia) and the least socialized of the advanced democracies (USA, Australia). We are all within the 35% to 45% range. This is the modern welfare state (state responsible for the welfare of its citizens) and it is the product of modern technology and modern life. That's just the way it is.
The dichotomy between taxpayers and freeloaders is a false one. Government is not a consumer purchase made with tax dollars, it is the constitutional agent of American society. Everyone pays taxes, how much and on what is decided by law, as is eligibility for coverage and benefits under ACA.
Like Social Security, ACA is based on the idea "from each according to his ability; to each according to his need." There is no pussy footing around the fact that this is a socialist concept. There are Americans who do not like the idea of socialism in any form and believe that the government should undertake no socialist activities whatsoever. This is understandable and represents one pole of popular opinion.
The United States is a constitutional democracy and one of the most important decisions made by our constitutionally elected government is the degree to which our economy is to be socialized. The citizens who believe that degree should be little to none are a small minority of the voters so they don't get to prevail.
The percent of GDP which is socialized, i.e. under government control, varies from country to country. It might surprise some of our libertarians to see how relatively narrow the gap is between the most socialized economies (Scandinavia) and the least socialized of the advanced democracies (USA, Australia). We are all within the 35% to 45% range. This is the modern welfare state (state responsible for the welfare of its citizens) and it is the product of modern technology and modern life. That's just the way it is.
cancel2 2022
Canceled
Single payer is the only truly effective system.
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Even my doctor chimed in about one aspect in favor. She said that due to Obamacare, she doesn't have hardly any non paying patients anymore.
Since socialism is based on one group, those that are productive and contribute to society, being forced to provide to the other group, those that aren't productive and only take from society, those in the latter are freeloaders as long as they don't do for themselves what is it their personal responsibility to do for themselves. Since no one owes another person a damn thing, when those in the latter group start believing they are owed something, they become freeloaders. Socialism allows them to do just that.
The citizens that don't pay the very taxes from which they benefit do get to vote to continue to be freeloaders. Don't pussy foot around about it. Call them what they are. We should not take on any socialist activities as a country. If you want someone that doesn't have what you think they should have to have it, reach into your own pocket and provide it. Until then, you're as much of a piece of shit as those that demand they are owed something simply because they don't have it and can't afford it.
What's her name and the name of the practice.
Interesting that all the bleeding hearts that claim they care so much for others constantly support programs where others are forced to pay for what the believe. I thought you bleeding hearts believed in the concept of choice. I guess that only applies when women that spread their legs then don't like the results want the choice of killing their unborn babies.
Bill Fishlore
New member
Your critique of socialism rests on a false dichotomy that separates society into two distinct groups: those that are "productive and contribute to society" and those that are not. Human life isn't nearly that simple. Even the most productive individuals start off as children, a group which requires massive social investment to reach productivity and, in old age become once again dependent on others. Outside the group that is contributing at any given moment are not only kids and old folks, but people who for reason of some physical or mental disability, cannot sustain themselves. Then there is a group, larger now in our technological economy, who lack the necessary skills to be highly productive but who could produce a lot more if they had the training. The layabouts in any society, those who are scared stiff of work, are pretty easily gotten off their butts by a combination of available work and lack of a free ride for those that don't need it.
The productivity of a society depends on a number of factors, many of which are social in nature -- everything from schools and roads to old age pensions. The boogeyman layabout isn't really a major factor.
The productivity of a society depends on a number of factors, many of which are social in nature -- everything from schools and roads to old age pensions. The boogeyman layabout isn't really a major factor.
Gee! People supporting getting free stuff from the government; big shocker! Only clueless dullards think that popular opinion should be a substitute for constitutional and sane policy.
Bill Fishlore
New member
Trump has decisively switched from attack campaigning to governance. He has backed away from his key campaign targets of immigration and ACA to a much more moderate and patient set of views. This will bitterly disappoint many of his enthusiastic voters but is essential if the Republican Party is to get anywhere with its more serious issues of taxation, trade and public works.
Reagan had a similar challenge in moving away from the emotional message of the campaign to the harsh realities of back room political swap and trade. He did a pretty good job because of his superb acting skills and experience. His administration delivered almost none of the things (prayer in schools for example) that it promised the right wing but remained effective nonetheless. Trump seems to have set out on the same path. How well he can follow it will be the key metric for his administration.
Reagan had a similar challenge in moving away from the emotional message of the campaign to the harsh realities of back room political swap and trade. He did a pretty good job because of his superb acting skills and experience. His administration delivered almost none of the things (prayer in schools for example) that it promised the right wing but remained effective nonetheless. Trump seems to have set out on the same path. How well he can follow it will be the key metric for his administration.
It's a lot more simple that you think and are willing to admit. I've seen those that CLAIM to have mental and physical disabilities. They can do any damn thing they please until it involves providing for themselves. I had a neighbor growing up that claimed physical limitations due to an injury on the job kept him from doing that particular type of work. Interesting thing was he could paint houses, do various types of construction work, and cut his grass with a push mower, all of which involved a far greater physical requirement that the job for which he claimed he could no longer do. He tried that shit for a few years until the employer for which he blamed for the injury had pictures of him doing those types of things. Even the ambulance chasing attorney he had couldn't fight that lie.
There are two distinct groups. Those that earn a living and those that vote for one. We're not talking about children but adults. While the most productive adults do start out as children so do the biggest adult takers in society. It's while they're children they either learn that the one having the greatest responsibility for them is them or they are indoctrinated to think that someone owes them something and to make excuses when they don't have what another person earned. Too many people think that those who aren't a kid's parents should do for the kid what their own sorry ass parents won't do for them. I don't owe another kid a college education, food, clothing, shelter, or anything else for that matter. That is the responsibility of that kid's parents. I provide for mine and expecting others to do for theirs isn't asking them to do anything other than what I do for mine. If the kid's own parents don't think enough of their own kids to investment in them, it's not a good investment for me.
The layabouts, what I call freeloaders, don't WANT to work. The problem is they continue to get a free ride which means they don't have to work. Why would someone whose skill level will earn them less than what they can get sitting on their ass be motivated to work. They aren't yet too many idiots that support handing them something for nothing can't realize something simple as that concept.
Productivity depends on whether or not the individual has installed in them the desire to be productive. It has very little to do with society and a whole lot to do with the person. That's why I have no problem walking past someone who has no desire to be productive and letting them do without.
Only idiots like some of the fools on here think handing someone more for nothing than they could earn if they wanted to work will motivate them to work.
A bleeding heart Liberal. They are the one that claim to care then go about showing it by supporting someone else being forced to provide for whatever it is they support. To prove that, all you have to do is propose that if they support someone getting (fill in the blank) they can't afford doing it with their own money and read the responses.
What's the big deal? Obama Care is DOA...its over. You communist might as well continue to cry like someone pissed in your soup...it will do no good at this stage. If the people had wanted the social fascism of the last administration continued the election would have demonstrated it...not some last minute slinging of snot over some POLL.
The nation existed some 220+ years without it and it will continue to exist, it simply will not be existing on OP money (other peoples). Health care is not a right and the government sure as hell is not a solution to people making the wrong decisions in life. Government caused the run away prices in health care due to the insurance lobby that made simple representatives of the people....career politicians sucking at the government tit in the hog trough that is Washington DC. Now....Big Government socialism is the answer to the problem created by the same ideology? With 90 million people out of the work force another 45% living in poverty with over 40% of the population on the government dole of some type?
Not working and having others support your lifestyle is a nice living until one runs out of other peoples money. One thing is for sure....its good to have a fire wall against such communist socialism, its called the Constitution of the Untied States of America that places limits on the scope and power of a Central Government gone rogue.
The nation existed some 220+ years without it and it will continue to exist, it simply will not be existing on OP money (other peoples). Health care is not a right and the government sure as hell is not a solution to people making the wrong decisions in life. Government caused the run away prices in health care due to the insurance lobby that made simple representatives of the people....career politicians sucking at the government tit in the hog trough that is Washington DC. Now....Big Government socialism is the answer to the problem created by the same ideology? With 90 million people out of the work force another 45% living in poverty with over 40% of the population on the government dole of some type?
Not working and having others support your lifestyle is a nice living until one runs out of other peoples money. One thing is for sure....its good to have a fire wall against such communist socialism, its called the Constitution of the Untied States of America that places limits on the scope and power of a Central Government gone rogue.
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cancel2 2022
Canceled
I am far from being a bleeding heart but your healthcare system is not only unfit for purpose but is horrendously expensive as well.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/peteru...ive-ruining-american-healthcare/#24ca9ece37b9
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