Women Need To Carry Guns When Going Out Alone.

Oneuli said:
I wouldn't be surprised if occasionally the sight of an openly carried handgun deterred an act of violence. I also wouldn't be surprised if the sight of an openly carried handgun had even more often encouraged an act of violence. Guns are valuable consumer items, and they have especially enhanced value to criminals if they can get their hands on one without creating a record of ownership. So, an isolated woman openly carrying a handgun might be attractive as a target for crime by some who wouldn't even bother with her if she wasn't carrying that big temptation on her. It's a bit like carrying a new iPhone in your hand -- a lot of shady people are going to see it and want it, and if you don't have a lot of physical strength, there's not much you'll be able to do to keep them from taking it.
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this ideology alone tells me that you think so very little of people, especially women, that they are probably physically inferior and most likely emotionally inferior to those with criminal intent, as if you don't believe that law abiding quiet little civilians can stand up to criminals. am I right?
 
Quote Originally Posted by domer76
"You're less than relatively defenseless with that gun. Having it places you at greater risk from being harmed by it rather than protected by it."

"BULL $#@!!!!!!!!! why do cops have them, dumb$#@!?
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If guns imparted immortality wouldn't Annie Oakley still be with us?

There is opinion.
And there is statistical certitude.

Most of the stats I've read of it indicate having a gun in the home renders one less safe, not more safe.

BUT !!

Similar stats. also indicate having a swimming pool is more dangerous than having a gun. So we rolls the dice, and we takes our chances.

Current score:
d7: 1
SY: 0 & two style points deducted for potty-mouth, therefore an adjusted score of negative 2.

Have a nice day.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
so do you, or don't you, believe that the US government will use tanks, jets, bombers, and nukes against americans on american soil in the event of a tyrannical more or rebellion?
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I have no idea. OTOH, I saw what they used in Ferguson (we lived about 20 minutes away when the "unrest" was going on) against demonstrating citizens. And those were just cops.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
BULL SHIT!!!!!!!! why do cops have them, dumbfuck?
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Really? Dumberthanayew, I tell ya', I don't think you can top out the Stupid Meter any better than your "vehicles cannot be necessary" laugher, but you sure are trying hard to do so.

Why do cops have guns? REALLY? :lolup::rofl2:
 
domer76 said:
Really? Dumberthanayew, I tell ya', I don't think you can top out the Stupid Meter any better than your "vehicles cannot be necessary" laugher, but you sure are trying hard to do so.

Why do cops have guns? REALLY? :lolup::rofl2:
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i see you doing alot of 'laughing', but you don't seem to be able to answer a single question, why is that you dumbass?

it's because you don't fucking know anything. ANYTHING, dumbass piece of white fucking trash.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
i see you doing alot of 'laughing', but you don't seem to be able to answer a single question, why is that you dumbass?

it's because you don't fucking know anything. ANYTHING, dumbass piece of white fucking trash.
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You actually need an answer to “Why do cops carry guns”?

Stop, man! Yer killin’ me! :lolup::rofl2:
 
sear said:
Firearms / gun carry - mode of carry:

Condition 0 - A cartridge in the chamber, the hammer cocked, and the safety off.
Condition 1 - Also called "cocked and locked", this means that a round is in the chamber, the hammer is cocked, and the manual thumb safety is on.
Condition 2 - A round is in the chamber, the hammer is uncocked.
Condition 3 - There is no round in the chamber, the hammer is uncocked but a fully loaded magazine is inserted in the mag well.
Condition 4 - The chamber is empty, the hammer is uncocked and there is no magazine inserted in the mag well: source - Thorsen
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Just as further information, revolvers tend to be a bit different. Effectively, you've always got one in the chamber, if the revolver is fully loaded, and revolvers often don't even come with a safety. For safety, they rely on the fact you have to exert a lot of force and pull the trigger a long way to fire when in double-action mode. So, you basically have four states:

There's a round in the chamber that's lines up for firing, and it's cocked for single-action firing
There's a round in the chamber that's lines up for firing, but isn't cocked
There's no round in the chamber that's lines up for firing, but rounds in other chambers that can be rotated into place by pulling the trigger repeatedly
There are no rounds in any chambers
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
One thing self-defense classes always teach is the situational awareness that you mentioned, and also appearing focused on your environment and surroundings, alert and watchful. Predators look for distracted prey -- someone jogging with headphones on, oblivious to everything. Someone digging through their purse or looking at their phone, or walking with their head down and not looking around, in their own little world. If you're doing these things, having a gun in your purse or pocket isn't going to be of much use if you are suddenly assaulted from behind by someone you were unaware of.
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Do your chances of survival increase or decrease during an attack if you are armed - only common sense answer if you will.

One or the other please with all due respect.
 
Oneuli said:
Just as further information, revolvers tend to be a bit different. Effectively, you've always got one in the chamber, if the revolver is fully loaded, and revolvers often don't even come with a safety. For safety, they rely on the fact you have to exert a lot of force and pull the trigger a long way to fire when in double-action mode. So, you basically have four states:

There's a round in the chamber that's lines up for firing, and it's cocked for single-action firing
There's a round in the chamber that's lines up for firing, but isn't cocked
There's no round in the chamber that's lines up for firing, but rounds in other chambers that can be rotated into place by pulling the trigger repeatedly
There are no rounds in any chambers
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I'm still not sure how a gun will protect you even if you carry it around loaded, if an attacker surprises you from behind. At best you might be able to use it to help someone else being attacked, but it would be difficult to retrieve it out of your purse, pocket, or holster if *you* are grabbed from behind. Seems to me that knowing and practicing self defense moves would be more useful. If you can break the hold and get away, *then* you might have time to retrieve your firearm.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
are you one of those that would rather be raped than have a gun used in your rescue?
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No, why, are you?

i hear this alot, but if that is truly the case, then why do we let cops have weapons if the bad guys are always going to draw on them first??
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Police are in a very different position than the general public. The guns aren't there particularly for the scenarios where the police are walking along, minding their own business, and someone jumps them. They'll be no better off than the rest of us when someone has a drop on them that way. Instead, the guns are useful for scenarios where police are responding to a known crime, so that they can be ready with their firearms. For a vigilante, they'd have a similar value. For example, if I'm out jogging and hear someone else being raped, and I've got a gun, I can intervene to stop it that way.... though I could probably do just as well to call 911 and announce that's what I've done.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
this ideology alone tells me that you think so very little of people, especially women, that they are probably physically inferior and most likely emotionally inferior to those with criminal intent
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The average woman is, indeed, physically weaker than the average criminal, since the large majority of criminals are relatively young men, and the large majority of relatively young men are stronger than the average woman. That's just a physiological fact. As for emotional inferiority, I'd say that those with criminal intent are, by definition, emotionally inferior to their victims.

On the topic of standing up against criminals, I'm all for it. But clutching a magical firearm to give you courage isn't necessarily the most effective way to do so. Gun control, for example, is arguably more effective.... making it harder for criminals to get their hands on guns is a way of standing up to them, and it seems to work, statistically.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
I'm still not sure how a gun will protect you even if you carry it around loaded, if an attacker surprises you from behind. At best you might be able to use it to help someone else being attacked, but it would be difficult to retrieve it out of your purse, pocket, or holster if *you* are grabbed from behind. Seems to me that knowing and practicing self defense moves would be more useful. If you can break the hold and get away, *then* you might have time to retrieve your firearm.
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Exactly. If someone else has the jump on you, even a loaded and cocked pistol with the safety off isn't going to help, unless the attacker is unarmed and weaker than you, such that you can realistically hope to get out of the grasp, create some distance, and then pull the firearm. Firearms are useful in situations where you have the initiative, but those don't come up often where you're the target of a violent crime.
 
philly rabbit said:
Do your chances of survival increase or decrease during an attack if you are armed - only common sense answer if you will.

One or the other please with all due respect.
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That'll depend on the details of the attack. In some cases, your chances of surviving will increase -- for example, if the attacker is determined to murder you and has the means to make that outcome likely. Then, even if your chance of retrieving a gun and using it in defense are very low, low chances of survival are better than none. If, on the other hand, the attacker is planning something less than murder, your chances of surviving the attack may well go down if you have a gun -- for example, the attacker has a gun, too, only intends to steal from you, but then when he sees your gun he panics and shoots you. Or he doesn't have a gun, but when you pull yours he grabs at it, the two of you are in a life-and-death struggle, and he overpowers you and discharges the gun into you. Both kinds of scenarios exist. The latter are more common, which is part of why carrying a gun increases your chances of being shot and killed:

https://www.newscientist.com/articl...un-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed/
 
reagansghost said:
The only positive stat I've seen regarding handguns.....https://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/09/upshot/gun-deaths-are-mostly-suicides.html


Gun Deaths Are Mostly Suicides

When Americans think about deaths from guns, we tend to focus on homicides. But the problem of gun suicide is inescapable: More than 60 percent of people in this country who die from guns die by suicide.

Darwin's Law strikes again
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The presence of a gun makes suicide far more likely. Think about people's mental states as a graph, running between ecstasy and suicidal depression. Most people spend most of the time with their indicator somewhere in the middle, but we all have occasionally dips towards depression. Even relatively mentally healthy people may have, at some point in their lives, a short dip to the "suicidal depression" level. Under ordinary circumstances, if you're beneath that threshold for a few seconds or even a few minutes, you're not going to kill yourself. You may, for example, take a long walk to a high bridge, with thoughts of throwing yourself off it, and that bit of exercise, fresh air, and sunlight may be all that's needed to boost your mood the little bit needed to get you back over the threshold. Similarly, maybe some good Samaritan sees you climbing over the edge of the bridge and stops you, and that gesture of kindness is all it takes to move you that little bit between suicidal depression and non-suicidal. Or maybe you take a bunch of pills to kill yourself, and while you're waiting to die you start thinking about your loved ones and reconsider and call for an ambulance, and not only do you live but you then get the help to recover fully. Guns change all that. If you have a loaded gun nearby, you need to be below that "suicidal depression" line for the three seconds it takes to grab the gun, aim, and pull the trigger, and it's all over.
 
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Oneuli said:
The presence of a gun makes suicide far more likely. Think about people's mental states as a graph, running between ecstasy and suicidal depression. Most people spend most of the time when their indicator somewhere in the middle, but we all have occasionally dips towards depression. Even relatively mentally healthy people may have, at some point in their lives, a short dip to the "suicidal depression" level. Under ordinary circumstances, if you're beneath that threshold for a few seconds or even a few minutes, you're not going to kill yourself. You may, for example, take a long walk to a high bridge, with thoughts of throwing yourself off it, and that bit of exercise, fresh air, and sunlight may be all that's needed to boost your mood the little bit needed to get you back over the threshold. Similarly, maybe some good Samaritan sees you climbing over the edge of the bridge and stops you, and that gesture of kindness is all it takes to move you that little bit between suicidal depression and non-suicidal. Or maybe you take a bunch of pills to kill yourself, and while you're waiting to die you start thinking about your loved ones and reconsider and call for an ambulance, and not only do you live but you then get the help to recover fully. Guns change all that. If you have a loaded gun nearby, you need to be below that "suicidal depression" line for the three seconds it takes to grab the gun, aim, and pull the trigger, and it's all over.
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well put, and studies back it up.....

A 2008 study by Miller and David Hemenway, HICRC director and author of the book Private Guns, Public Health, found that rates of firearm suicides in states with the highest rates of gun ownership are 3.7 times higher for men and 7.9 times higher for women, compared with states with the lowest gun ownership—though the rates of non-firearm suicides are about the same. A gun in the home raises the suicide risk for everyone: gun owner, spouse and children alike.

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/magazine/magazine_article/guns-suicide/
 
Oneuli said:
The presence of a gun makes suicide far more likely. Think about people's mental states as a graph, running between ecstasy and suicidal depression. Most people spend most of the time when their indicator somewhere in the middle, but we all have occasionally dips towards depression. Even relatively mentally healthy people may have, at some point in their lives, a short dip to the "suicidal depression" level. Under ordinary circumstances, if you're beneath that threshold for a few seconds or even a few minutes, you're not going to kill yourself. You may, for example, take a long walk to a high bridge, with thoughts of throwing yourself off it, and that bit of exercise, fresh air, and sunlight may be all that's needed to boost your mood the little bit needed to get you back over the threshold. Similarly, maybe some good Samaritan sees you climbing over the edge of the bridge and stops you, and that gesture of kindness is all it takes to move you that little bit between suicidal depression and non-suicidal. Or maybe you take a bunch of pills to kill yourself, and while you're waiting to die you start thinking about your loved ones and reconsider and call for an ambulance, and not only do you live but you then get the help to recover fully. Guns change all that. If you have a loaded gun nearby, you need to be below that "suicidal depression" line for the three seconds it takes to grab the gun, aim, and pull the trigger, and it's all over.
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Well said. The likelihood of death becomes even higher if the suicidal person is a teenager, with all the rollercoaster emotions and unrestrained impulses that come at that age. The only two people I've known personally who committed suicide were both in their mid-teens, and both used their dad's hand gun and performed the act while the family was gone. The first person, a young girl, was the most tragic. She had fallen for some older online jerk who raped her when they met in person, then rejected her. Thinking she was horrible, used, and dirty, she shot herself but didn't immediately die. She called her parents and 911, and begged them not to let her die. There was nothing they could do to save her with that much damage. She was our neighbor and my younger girls' playmate when they were growing up. The other young person was my oldest daughter's brother-in-law who shot himself because he failed a class and was going to have to go to summer school.
 
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