We're a pro-choice nation

TOP said:
Every day...too many years of getting up early sets that auto alarm...lol..I love early morning...I get so much done...
(And, of course, real serious swimmers...and golfers... are early birds...;))

Have a beautiful day...celebrate this amazing country we live in and take a moment to honor the men and women who made sacrifices to make that possible...
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Indeed.

Too many years working strange hours.

I enjoy the solitude and quiet early morning hours. Most of the far left loons are slugs who sleep late.

Gratitude to my father and brother who served in the world wars and all who have served. Great sacrifices made for this once great country.

Hopefully, this country now realizes what the far left Democratic Socialist loons have done to America and will change course in 2024.
 
Earl said:
Indeed.

Too many years working strange hours.

I enjoy the solitude and quiet early morning hours. Most of the far left loons are slugs who sleep late.

Gratitude to my father and brother who served in the world wars and all who have served. Great sacrifices made for this once great country.

Hopefully, this country now realizes what the far left Democratic Socialist loons have done to America and will change course in 2024.
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I am out of bed by 4:00 every morning.

I served my country...a member of the Strategic Air Command during the late 1950's. Apparently YOU did not.

The loons are on the right...although calling that degenerate trash "loons" is almost a compliment by subtraction.

As for 2024...we'll see if you are correct, as you were in 2020...that a huge Red Tsunami will cause great positive change. How pathetic it must be for the likes of you to be predicting that laughable nonsense once again.

hysterical-laughter.gif
 
Frank Apisa said:
Medicale, huh?

Fucking moron.

You did not show science. You showed some supposed physicians...who allow a conservative bias to bleat what their masters want them to bleat. Even the article you sited acknowledges that the question of when the clump of cells becomes a living human is debatable.

The vast majority of abortions happen when there is nothing more than a clump of cells present.
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No those are scientists and they showed their credentials. Science says human life begins at conception. Not Democrats
 
ptif219 said:
No those are scientists and they showed their credentials. Science says human life begins at conception. Not Democrats
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Science does not say anything. Scientists do. Some scientists are like you...ignorant. They want to assert that from the moment of conception, there is a living human being.

There isn't.

The fact that a human life begins as a zygote is not the same as saying that a zygote is a living human. A zygote is not a living human.

There is debate about when a growing clump of cells becomes a living human being. That was even mentioned in the article you cited. Some people say it does not happen until the clump exits into the world; some say it happens with ensoulment. Scientists do not answer that question...in fact, the question may not be answerable. But until born, the growing clump should not have more rights than the woman in whose body it is being carried.

You are now free to crawl back under your favorite rock.
 
Upon conception, the egg and sperm fuse to become a Human cell zygote...a unique individual that will continue to grow during development...and will eventually be born...but will not change over the course of a normal pregnancy...A zygote becomes an embryo which become a fetus, and then a newborn...The only difference is the stage of development... all are stages of a child before and after birth...Biologists are pretty firm as to when life begins...Everyday Americans choose to believe what makes them most comfortable....https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/366...tutions,5577) affirmed the fertilization view.
 
TOP said:
Upon conception, the egg and sperm fuse to become a Human cell zygote...a unique individual that will continue to grow during development...and will eventually be born...but will not change over the course of a normal pregnancy...A zygote becomes an embryo which become a fetus, and then a newborn...The only difference is the stage of development... all are stages of a child before and after birth...Biologists are pretty firm as to when life begins...Everyday Americans choose to believe what makes them most comfortable....https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/366...tutions,5577) affirmed the fertilization view.
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Path of least resistance. Beware power of suggesting now has always been eternity because genetics eternally separates each fertilized cell ever added to any life form native to this atmosphere.
 
TOP said:
Upon conception, the egg and sperm fuse to become a Human cell zygote...a unique individual that will continue to grow during development...and will eventually be born...but will not change over the course of a normal pregnancy...A zygote becomes an embryo which become a fetus, and then a newborn...The only difference is the stage of development... all are stages of a child before and after birth...Biologists are pretty firm as to when life begins...Everyday Americans choose to believe what makes them most comfortable....https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/366...tutions,5577) affirmed the fertilization view.
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Indeed, TOP.

Biologists are also pretty firm as to the fact that there are two (2) and only two genders.
 
TOP said:
Upon conception, the egg and sperm fuse to become a Human cell zygote...a unique individual that will continue to grow during development...and will eventually be born...but will not change over the course of a normal pregnancy...A zygote becomes an embryo which become a fetus, and then a newborn...The only difference is the stage of development... all are stages of a child before and after birth...Biologists are pretty firm as to when life begins...Everyday Americans choose to believe what makes them most comfortable....https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/366...tutions,5577) affirmed the fertilization view.
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A zygote is not a living human.

If you dispute that...let's hear it.
 
TOP said:
Yes...living...
https://www.princeton.edu/~prolife/...sion of the sperm,member of the human species.
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Dianne N. Irving wrote that paper while teaching at Catholic University of America. She had, in her position there, a vested interest in assessing the issue in a way consistent with Catholicism. The notion that a zygote is a living human...is as absurd as the notion that an acorn is an oak tree...or that an omelet is a chicken dinner.

Let's see something from a more objective source.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Dianne N. Irving wrote that paper while teaching at Catholic University of America. She had, in her position there, a vested interest in assessing the issue in a way consistent with Catholicism. The notion that a zygote is a living human...is as absurd as the notion that an acorn is an oak tree...or that an omelet is a chicken dinner.

Let's see something from a more objective source.
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You ask a question and I gave you an answer.. a pregnancy at any stage is quite different than an acorn or an egg for an omelette... I can personally vouch for that...
 
TOP said:
You ask a question and I gave you an answer.. a pregnancy at any stage is quite different than an acorn or an egg for an omelette... I can personally vouch for that...
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Yeah, a pregnancy at any stage is quite different from an acorn or an omelet...

...but the simile holds without regard to that.

YOU are saying that a zygote is a living human...and I am saying that is like saying an acorn is an oak tree...or an omelet is a chicken dinner.

And I can personally vouch for the fact that neither of those is so. Which points to what any person with a functioning brain realizes: A ZYGOTE IS NOT A LIVING HUMAN.

EVERYONE alive right now was a zygote at one time.

Not every (human) zygote gets to become a living human. Some are aborted...and some are expelled as a result of natural miscarriage. They never become a living human.

By the way, TOP...since you are so sure they were living humans while still just zygotes...you did count them as dependents on your tax returns...right?
 
Frank Apisa said:
Yeah, a pregnancy at any stage is quite different from an acorn or an omelet...

...but the simile holds without regard to that.

YOU are saying that a zygote is a living human...and I am saying that is like saying an acorn is an oak tree...or an omelet is a chicken dinner.

And I can personally vouch for the fact that neither of those is so. Which points to what any person with a functioning brain realizes: A ZYGOTE IS NOT A LIVING HUMAN.

EVERYONE alive right now was a zygote at one time.

Not every (human) zygote gets to become a living human. Some are aborted...and some are expelled as a result of natural miscarriage. They never become a living human.

By the way, TOP...since you are so sure they were living humans while still just zygotes...you did count them as dependents on your tax returns...right?
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I'm saying that what is developing at any stage is an unborn child... and you are correct some do not survive... a miscarriage is the loss of a child ask anyone who's had a miscarriage... you raise a good point...the little boy or little girl developing is dependent on the mother so we should have gotten some kind of Child Care Credit...;) a growing baby is not the same as an acorn or a chicken egg...
 
TOP said:
I'm saying that what is developing at any stage is an unborn child... and you are correct some do not survive... a miscarriage is the loss of a child ask anyone who's had a miscarriage... you raise a good point...the little boy or little girl developing is dependent on the mother so we should have gotten some kind of Child Care Credit...;) a growing baby is not the same as an acorn or a chicken egg...
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This is self-evident except to 86 year old, far left Democratic Socialist loons.

Acorns and chicken eggs are not and never will be, humans.
 
Earl said:
This is self-evident except to 86 year old, far left Democratic Socialist loons.

Acorns and chicken eggs are not and never will be, humans.
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You are correct acorns and chickens are not and never will be human..
I don't consider Frank to be a "loon", necessarily...
We've already agreed to disagree... I just want to continue trying to make him see my point... it's a decision about a little more than a clump of cells ..or digging up an acorn or scrambling a chicken egg..
 
TOP said:
I'm saying that what is developing at any stage is an unborn child...
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And you are wrong, because it isn't. But it is okay to be wrong.

and you are correct some do not survive... a miscarriage is the loss of a child ask anyone who's had a miscarriage... you raise a good point...the little boy or little girl developing is dependent on the mother so we should have gotten some kind of Child Care Credit...;) a growing baby is not the same as an acorn or a chicken egg...
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Once again, you are correct that a growing baby...or a clump of cells that are not yet a baby...are not the same as an acorn or a chicken egg. I have never claimed they are...and in fact have acknowledged they are not.

BUT CLAIMING THAT A ZYGOTE IS A LIVING HUMAN...IS AS ABSURD AS ASSERTING THAT AN ACORN IS AN OAK TREE...OR AN OMELET IS A CHICKEN DINNER.

You are still not acknowledging that.

Okay. Doing what you are doing is helping my position...that of wanting a woman to have control of her own body.
 
Earl said:
This is self-evident except to 86 year old, far left Democratic Socialist loons.
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I am not a Democrat...nor a socialist. I am far left...but not a loon. Loons are, for the most part, Republicans. Just as I am not a Democrat...I also am not a Repbublican.

Acorns and chicken eggs are not and never will be, humans.
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Correct. And nobody here is suggesting they ever will be.

BUT...CLAIMING THAT A ZYGOTE IS A LIVING HUMAN...IS AS ABSURD AS ASSERTING THAT AN ACORN IS AN OAK TREE...OR AN OMELET IS A CHICKEN DINNER.
 
Frank Apisa said:
And you are wrong, because it isn't. But it is okay to be wrong.



Once again, you are correct that a growing baby...or a clump of cells that are not yet a baby...are not the same as an acorn or a chicken egg. I have never claimed they are...and in fact have acknowledged they are not.

BUT CLAIMING THAT A ZYGOTE IS A LIVING HUMAN...IS AS ABSURD AS ASSERTING THAT AN ACORN IS AN OAK TREE...OR AN OMELET IS A CHICKEN DINNER.

You are still not acknowledging that.

Okay. Doing what you are doing is helping my position...that of wanting a woman to have control of her own body.
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We're just going to have to continue to agree to disagree.. but I'm not wrong...;)

I do want a woman to have control of her own body... and do everything possible so that she doesn't have to make a decision to have an abortion... which ultimately is a decision to end a life that is growing inside her... she didn't swallow an acorn or an omelet... the decision to have an abortion is no longer just making a decision about her own body there is another developing body involved... that's just a fact... there is.
..from conception... let's urge women to be in control so that they don't have to make such a difficult decision... and I think you would agree that it's a very difficult decision...
 
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TOP said:
We're just going to have to continue to agree to disagree.. but I'm not wrong...;)

I do want a woman to have control of her own body... and do everything possible so that she doesn't have to make a decision to have an abortion... which ultimately is a decision to end a life that is growing inside her... she didn't swallow an acorn or an omelet... the decision to have an abortion is no longer just making a decision about her own body there is another developing body involved... that's just a fact... there is.
..from conception... let's urge women to be in control so that they don't have to make such a difficult decision... and I think you would agree that it's a very difficult decision...
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You are wrong.

And if a pregnant woman decides she wants to end the pregnancy occurring in her own body...she should be able to do so without breaking any laws requiring that she not do it...and she should be able to do it safely with the help of a doctor and hospital if necessary.
 
Also...CLAIMING THAT A ZYGOTE IS A LIVING HUMAN...IS AS ABSURD AS ASSERTING THAT AN ACORN IS AN OAK TREE...OR AN OMELET IS A CHICKEN DINNER.
 
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