Bai Lan
Let It Rot
politalker is a loon.
Ways That Socialsm Can Be Better Than Capitalism
- Thread starter PoliTalker
- Start date
politalker is a loon.
PoliTalker
Diversity Makes Greatness
Hello T. A. Gardner,
Maybe socialist dictators do that, but we don't see that in Norway or numerous other countries that have a mix of capitalism and socialism. The quality of our government depends on the active engagement of a well-informed populace. What we need to do is educate everyone better and impart upon them the importance of being well-informed and monitoring our government. Our government works for us. We are the boss. We need to do our job. Any government failure is a failure of We, The People, to do our job.
Why would a government of the people, by the people, and for the people, rip off the people? That makes no sense. The government has no goal of extracting as much wealth as possible from unsuspecting citizens to be gathered into the hands of a few very rich people. That's what corrupt people do. If we want our government to perform better, then we have to do a better job of routing out corruption.
There are watchdogs in government, as you said. Of course with government we have that. Just listen to yourself. We are already a capitalist/socialist society. If our government is doing nefarious things we have the pathway to correct that. It is an ongoing job. There is no reason to make up false narratives that we have to chose between capitalism or socialism. That's BS propaganda.
That's why we have our Constitution with checks and balances. Sure, it's not perfect but nothing is. The best we can do is to have our Constitution, trust it, and protect it. That will prevent us from becoming the socialist dictatorship you are afraid of.
That is France's problem, not ours. It proves nothing. France has a big advantage over America. In America, people fear the government. In France, the government fears the people.
When government goes awry it is because of corruption and bad leadership. The citizens need to do more monitoring of government to prevent that.
Well that's a pretty big stretch to try to claim that is typical of the government. It is more typical of a government led by Trump.
There is a lot more to that story than you're presenting. Capitalism caused a big mess and walked away. The river was already devoid of fish when the government began to try to clean it up. A for-profit company the government hired made a mistake and caused a spill of waste water which had accumulated after decades of capitalist operations. The government took the position that it was responsible, and began the process of deciding to what extent. The site could have been covered as a superfund site, and thus be able to help out locals affected, but locals initially fought that. The locals were afraid such a classification would harm tourism, basically one of the only things to bring wealth into the community that capitalism walked away from when the easy profits were done. After it became big news, they accepted the classification. That meant there could be compensation.
The resultant lawsuits have dragged on until Trump's EPA director was installed. Now, the EPA under Trump wants to dismiss all responsibility and not pay. Is anyone surprised.
And all of this has nothing to do with the fallacy that we have to choose between a capitalist government and a socialist one. We do not. We will never have to make that choice. We do not have a for-profit government. Our tax levels do not even pay for the government. Our government is supposed to serve the people. Wherever that has been mismanaged the culprit is always greedy capitalists and corruption.
Maybe socialist dictators do that, but we don't see that in Norway or numerous other countries that have a mix of capitalism and socialism. The quality of our government depends on the active engagement of a well-informed populace. What we need to do is educate everyone better and impart upon them the importance of being well-informed and monitoring our government. Our government works for us. We are the boss. We need to do our job. Any government failure is a failure of We, The People, to do our job.
Why would a government of the people, by the people, and for the people, rip off the people? That makes no sense. The government has no goal of extracting as much wealth as possible from unsuspecting citizens to be gathered into the hands of a few very rich people. That's what corrupt people do. If we want our government to perform better, then we have to do a better job of routing out corruption.
There are watchdogs in government, as you said. Of course with government we have that. Just listen to yourself. We are already a capitalist/socialist society. If our government is doing nefarious things we have the pathway to correct that. It is an ongoing job. There is no reason to make up false narratives that we have to chose between capitalism or socialism. That's BS propaganda.
That's why we have our Constitution with checks and balances. Sure, it's not perfect but nothing is. The best we can do is to have our Constitution, trust it, and protect it. That will prevent us from becoming the socialist dictatorship you are afraid of.
That is France's problem, not ours. It proves nothing. France has a big advantage over America. In America, people fear the government. In France, the government fears the people.
When government goes awry it is because of corruption and bad leadership. The citizens need to do more monitoring of government to prevent that.
Well that's a pretty big stretch to try to claim that is typical of the government. It is more typical of a government led by Trump.
There is a lot more to that story than you're presenting. Capitalism caused a big mess and walked away. The river was already devoid of fish when the government began to try to clean it up. A for-profit company the government hired made a mistake and caused a spill of waste water which had accumulated after decades of capitalist operations. The government took the position that it was responsible, and began the process of deciding to what extent. The site could have been covered as a superfund site, and thus be able to help out locals affected, but locals initially fought that. The locals were afraid such a classification would harm tourism, basically one of the only things to bring wealth into the community that capitalism walked away from when the easy profits were done. After it became big news, they accepted the classification. That meant there could be compensation.
The resultant lawsuits have dragged on until Trump's EPA director was installed. Now, the EPA under Trump wants to dismiss all responsibility and not pay. Is anyone surprised.
And all of this has nothing to do with the fallacy that we have to choose between a capitalist government and a socialist one. We do not. We will never have to make that choice. We do not have a for-profit government. Our tax levels do not even pay for the government. Our government is supposed to serve the people. Wherever that has been mismanaged the culprit is always greedy capitalists and corruption.
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Eagle_Eye
Well-known member
I don't know about you but I'm not a mind reader! May I remind you, you lefties you included have held up Europe as a socialist utopia for years! How about you answering your own question and while your at it prove me wrong.
American conservatism is immoral. One of the most immoral political position ever. And it continues its immoral path because it is peopled by morons.
Those are government services, not socialism. Socialism is public ownership of the means of production and distribution (oil companies, ship building, utilities, manufacturing)
Medicare is not socialism because it involves an entire system of privately owned and operated hospitals, doctors, nurses, medical supply manufacturers, drug companies, insurance companies. NASA primarily operates by private companies.
If a government owned business manufactures tire wipes and charcoal starter and you buy it are you being ripped off by socialism? Or, are you just a dumb consumer?
The U. S. already has the Office of Consumer Affairs, Federal Trade Commission, U. S. Product Safety Commission, Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, National Highway Safety Administration and consumer protection offices in every state. If these "socialist" agencies aren't protecting us from tire wipes then more agencies will not do so.
China manufactures both tire wipes and charcoal starter.
Yakuda
Verified User
Prove to loud mouth moron. I showed why socialism is immoral. You on the other hand, like always, just shoots shut out of your ass. So prove it you fun gobbling piece if shit.
I accept your tacit admission that Republicans have, in fact, a long history of calling countries like Denmark, France, Germany, Sweden socialist.
By the standard metrics you are using to measure socialism, Norway is more socialist than Venezuela or communist China.
Yakuda
Verified User
You aren't playing stupid are you?
TexanManWithPlans
Verified User
The top 10% have taken the wealth from the bottom 90%.
If that is true, and assuming conservatives were not lying their flabby asses off, explain why conservatives routinely and almost universally call called Obamacare or any universal single payer national health insurance proposal, socialist.
Ahhh...you want me to "prove" that American conservatism is immoral!!!
Nah. I'd rather let you jerkoffs prove it yourself...which people like you do with almost every post.
Yakuda
Verified User
Ahhh...you want me to "prove" that American conservatism is immoral!!!
Nah. I'd rather let you jerkoffs prove it yourself...which people like you do with almost every post.
So you can't prove it. So youre just a loud mouth pussy. We already knew that
PoliTalker
Diversity Makes Greatness
Hello Flash,
I am not proposing that the government should manufacture anything.
In the case if misleading marketing there is a lot which can be done to alert the public to the situation. If people are dumb enough to pay more for things because they won't listen to warnings that it is a rip-off, then there is no helping them.
Capitalism is going to try to trick people out of their money. Nothing is going to stop that. Government can and does try to reduce it. We need more of that.
A smarter nation is a greater nation.
I am not proposing that the government should manufacture anything.
In the case if misleading marketing there is a lot which can be done to alert the public to the situation. If people are dumb enough to pay more for things because they won't listen to warnings that it is a rip-off, then there is no helping them.
Capitalism is going to try to trick people out of their money. Nothing is going to stop that. Government can and does try to reduce it. We need more of that.
A smarter nation is a greater nation.
You and Republicans are accountable for the words that come out of your mouth.
I have exaxtly zero percent doubt you have an internet history of calling Europeans socialists, just like most other Republicans.
You called Obamacare Marxist and Europeans socialists because it gets a giggle from fellow Deplorables. But you frantically try to backtrack from it when somebody points out Denmark is a nice place to live.
PoliTalker
Diversity Makes Greatness
Hello Cypress,
It is socialist when they want to put it down and use it as an example of their fictional 'socialism bad' narrative.
It is not socialist when the example disproves their myths.
Musical socialism.
Words change. Merriam-Webster:
"gay adjective
\ ˈgā
\
Definition of gay
1a : of, relating to, or characterized by sexual or romantic attraction to people of one's same sex gay men a gay woman in her 40s —often used to refer to men onlygay and lesbian members of the community
b : of, relating to, or intended for people who are gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender, etc. the gay rights movement a gay bar
2a : happily excited : merry in a gay mood
b : keenly alive and exuberant : having or inducing high spirits a bird's gay spring song
3a : bright, lively gay sunny meadows
b : brilliant in color"
Up until the 1980's the #2 definition was the main usage of the term.
Then, the word changed.
'Socialism' has multiple meanings.
Conservatives like to play games with which one they are using for the purpose of their needs to reinforce their myths about socialism.
You're doing a great job of pointing that out.
It is socialist when they want to put it down and use it as an example of their fictional 'socialism bad' narrative.
It is not socialist when the example disproves their myths.
Musical socialism.
Words change. Merriam-Webster:
"gay adjective
\ ˈgā
\
Definition of gay
1a : of, relating to, or characterized by sexual or romantic attraction to people of one's same sex gay men a gay woman in her 40s —often used to refer to men onlygay and lesbian members of the community
b : of, relating to, or intended for people who are gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender, etc. the gay rights movement a gay bar
2a : happily excited : merry in a gay mood
b : keenly alive and exuberant : having or inducing high spirits a bird's gay spring song
3a : bright, lively gay sunny meadows
b : brilliant in color"
Up until the 1980's the #2 definition was the main usage of the term.
Then, the word changed.
'Socialism' has multiple meanings.
Conservatives like to play games with which one they are using for the purpose of their needs to reinforce their myths about socialism.
You're doing a great job of pointing that out.
PoliTalker
Diversity Makes Greatness
Hello Michael_Panetta,
And continue to.
Until we do something about it.
Conservatives want us to roll over and pretend it's either not happening, or that it doesn't matter.
And continue to.
Until we do something about it.
Conservatives want us to roll over and pretend it's either not happening, or that it doesn't matter.
He's not playing. He's stupid.
What the fuck are you going to do. The first time I hurt your tender feelings, you ran into IA hiding.
Because socialism has a negative connotation to many/most Americans and they are trying to stick any negative label on them. Like many try to stick Republicans with fascist/Nazi descriptions.
It is called politics and you try to destroy the enemy.
Unfortunately, both liberals and conservatives today have distorted the meaning of socialism and use to describe government social welfare programs or any government services (like the posts in this thread.)
If all government services are socialism then there is nothing to distinguish between capitalistic and socialistic economic systems.
Eagle_Eye
Well-known member
Nice attempt at weaseling out of admitting you are totally wrong. As to your asinine attempt at saving face, but by all metrics you are FOS.