Venezuala's economy ranks 62nd

Threedee said:
I just don't want to tour Europe for fear that my traveling group will get abducted, and the women sold into the sex trade while we men get sold into the torture trade.

Europe = Fucking Dangerous Place!
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Don't exaggerate the danger, Three.

That only happens to about 7 out of 10 American tourists, at the very most, and they only become victims because they don't follow the advice to wield a torch of fire when venturing outdoors.
 
charver said:
Don't exaggerate the danger, Three.

That only happens to about 7 out of 10 American tourists, at the very most, and they only become victims because they don't follow the advice to wield a torch of fire when venturing outdoors.
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Actually, its a big conspiracy we concocted on this side of the pond. Send over the dumbest of our populations and they get abducted. Then we get outraged over it and begin to posture menacingly at you lot, and chaps like Liam Neesons run around the continent blowing things up and gunning down officials while they seek out their incredibly stupid (albeit fucking hot) daughters.

War should be the inevitable outcome, if all goes well, and then we will take over control of these sex and torture traders and run them ourselves.
 
Watermark said:
For a south American state 60 isn't out of the ballpark. There are some extremely capitalistic US allies, like Colombia, that don't do any better.
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I'm sorry but facts are off-limits in this thread. In fact, anything that does not parrot the mantra of "Venezuela bad" is considered off-limits. Any regional comparison, which of course any serious analysis would consider, is considered off-limits and above the capacity of the VB crowd .. and surely it is above their capacity because NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THEM HAVE STEPPED UP TO ADDRESS IT

:)
 
Topspin said:
BAC is a fine lefty, But he is basically a high school level at economics.
That was funny as shit touting Venz above Isreal. Has he been under a rock, Isreal has some fine companies. Warren Buffet was there on a big investment mission several months ago.
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Hey Genius .. that "funny shit" was every bit as factual as what you posted.

And please give me a demonstrtaion of your amazing economic prowess and address the data on the Venezuelan economy I presented. You and your partners are real good at declaring I haven't addressed your points .. even though I have .. every one of them .. but you run like rabbits from addressing mine .. just as you ran to start this thread instead of addressing what I posted in the other thread on the exact same subject.

If in fact you are too timid or otherwise completely incapable of addressing FACTUAL information ..then I'll leave you girls to chirp away however you choose.

Of course, you will then have demonstrated exactly my point .. that you don't have the slighest fucking clue what you're talking about.

Your next post will tell the truth of this exchange.
 
BaC you opened your programmer mouth and inserted your foot so far you stompted yourself. What is your point other than they do better than other dirt poor Latin American thug regimes. I jammed your head up your uneducated ass on isreal and you ducked over and over. You don't seem to be able to argue that 17 percent don't have access to running water, only 3 percent of sewage is treated. It's a shithole and you worship the dictator. BAM
 
Superfreak said:
Again BAC... you are trying to change the subject. You are trying to say... hey they were worse off ten years ago before Chavez... fine. The point I was making is in refuting your assertation that Venezuela was currently better than Israel and then again refuting that it was better than Mexico. I then pointed out to you that they are not the best even within their region as Chile, Argentina and Mexico are all ahead of them. Because that was another of your points.

As for debating skills.... you should take a moment and read back through this thread.

I addressed the topic. Then I addressed your points... which in turn led you to continue to change your points over and over again....

You began by mocking top for not providing a link to his data. You then provided a link to data that while related, was not what toppy had said. I corrected you.

You then tried to compare total GDP to Israel. I pointed out why that was comparing apples to oranges as you need to look at that data on a per capita basis to get a direct comparison.

You then addressed cost of living adjustment to the $12k figure toppy quoted. I in turn provided you a link that showed the per capita purchasing power comparisons that did indeed show evidence to tops original post.

Once I provided you with that FACTUAL DATA... you then tried to spin your way out of it by saying... well how does Venezuela compare to Latin America (as well as some, well venezuela gives other countries aid, which has nothing to do with the topic). I then pointed to the data set that shows Mexico, Chile and Argentina are all ahead of Venezuela.

Then you pretend you dont understand my 'point'.... which either means you are ignorant or just being a complete ass. Because the point is not how much has Venezuela improved in percentages, the point was how do they do NOW... TODAY... compared to other countries that you tried to compare them to. Both Mexico and Israel do better. Period. Deal with it.

Quit trying to spin your way out of the original posts by bringing in other side discussions.
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I just don't know how to break this to you .. but .. you're an idiot my brother.

But sadly, you don't know it.

A regional and historical perspective on a nations economic course and value is something that would be considered in ANY serious analysis. You mean you didn't know that? Seriously?

In fact, it's kinda dumb not to consider it .. and what the fuck are you afraid of with considering it? If your point is Venezuela bad, then why be afraid of the facts?

You're screaming about these facts because they do not tell the story you want told. They demonstrate that since Chavez has been in power, Venezuela has steadily improved its economic status, and is vastly improved over the two decades that preceeded Chavez.

They demonstrate that from the deep recession that Chavez inherited, he has moved the country forward economically "with very rapid growth by almost any international or historical perspective."

Your argument is that Venezuela still has problems. How fucking stupid is that? The whole fucking planet has problems .. many with problems a lot bigger than Venezuela's .. like the US for instance.

Mexico is about to collapse.

Japan and Great Britain are in recession .. and so are we.

You argument is stupid.

Venezuela is 62nd. So what? What's your fucking point?

Let's see if you step up to address the historical and regional perspective.

I doubt it.

Damn, I love you guys. :)
 
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Topspin said:
BaC you opened your programmer mouth and inserted your foot so far you stompted yourself. What is your point other than they do better than other dirt poor Latin American thug regimes. I jammed your head up your uneducated ass on isreal and you ducked over and over. You don't seem to be able to argue that 17 percent don't have access to running water, only 3 percent of sewage is treated. It's a shithole and you worship the dictator. BAM
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Dude, I'm not a programmer, dummy.

I'm a DBA.

Secondly and most importantly, you're an idiot and you just proved your vast intellectual limitations by not stepping up and addressing the facts.

You didn't because you couldn't no matter how many times I've called you out.

I've made my point in this thread .. I'm cool with ignorance taking over from here.
 
blackascoal said:
:)

Good posters and debaters post links to supporting documentation and evidence that back up their claim .. that's the first thing.

Secondly, I just love, love, LOVE debating people who don't know SHIT about the world on the issue of socialism. That alone makes it worth being a socialist.

According to the CIA, Venezuela ranks 31st .. I repeat, THIRTY-FIRST in the list of countries by GDP.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)

... which puts them ahead of countries like that great democracy of Israel .. YES, motherfucking Israel .. as well as ahead of several other democracies.

No, you couldn't post this bullshit in the thread that already talks about Venezuela because you thought you had something special to dig your dirty fingernails in with. You wanted to make sure this didn't get missed.

Well ..thank you, because I'm glad it didn't get missed as well.

:cof1:
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Isn't Venezuela a democracy?
 
Dba are those who can't program. It's obvious your a techie who's clueless about economics. So the are doing better. Get back to me when they have running water and sewage treatment. You'd have done better to chose France as a socialist model not you beloved gangsta dictator. Keep ducking the isreal point by the way.
 
blackascoal said:
:)

Good posters and debaters post links to supporting documentation and evidence that back up their claim .. that's the first thing.

Secondly, I just love, love, LOVE debating people who don't know SHIT about the world on the issue of socialism. That alone makes it worth being a socialist.

According to the CIA, Venezuela ranks 31st .. I repeat, THIRTY-FIRST in the list of countries by GDP.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)

... which puts them ahead of countries like that great democracy of Israel .. YES, motherfucking Israel .. as well as ahead of several other democracies.

No, you couldn't post this bullshit in the thread that already talks about Venezuela because you thought you had something special to dig your dirty fingernails in with. You wanted to make sure this didn't get missed.

Well ..thank you, because I'm glad it didn't get missed as well.

:cof1:
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Actually GDP isn't very representative. You should compare per capita GDP in which case the USA is ranked 17th and Venezuela is ranked 54th by the CIA.
 
Superfreak said:
The point BAC, since you seem incapable of comprehending it, is that your great socialist Venezuela produces LESS per capita, has LESS buying power per capita than the US, Mexico, Israel. You know... those great democracies that YOU tried to compare Venezuela to.

Yes, I am sticking to the topic of the thread.... If you dont wish to discuss it BAC, then why are you here? If you want to discuss something else, start a thread on it.

Or stick your head in the sand again and keep chanting how great Chavez and Venezuela are.
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You're comparing apples to oranges here. Venezuela is a less developed country, obviously it won't have the same per capita GDP as the United States, Mexico, or Israel.

Also, if you're making an argument against socialism don't you think Israel is a bad example to be using?
 
Mottleydude said:
Actually GDP isn't very representative. You should compare per capita GDP in which case the USA is ranked 17th and Venezuela is ranked 54th by the CIA.
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and if you continue to look at the list of nations with strong socialist programs, i.e. those that governments subsidize their citizens income and standard of living have the highest GDP in the world.

Lichenstein #1
Qatar #2
Luxemburg #3
Norway #4
Ireland #5
Denmark #6
Switzerland #7
Iceland #8
Kuwait #9
UAB #10


All are way more liberal and socialist than the USA and all have a higher per capita GDP or course their all way smaller.

Having said that, of the large nations with over 200 million in population no nation comes close to the US in per capita GDP and only 3 others, Brazil, Russia and Malaysia are in the top 100 With the USA being the only large nation in the top 50.
 
blackascoal said:
I just don't know how to break this to you .. but .. you're an idiot my brother.

But sadly, you don't know it.

A regional and historical perspective on a nations economic course and value is something that would be considered in ANY serious analysis. You mean you didn't know that? Seriously?

In fact, it's kinda dumb not to consider it .. and what the fuck are you afraid of with considering it? If your point is Venezuela bad, then why be afraid of the facts?

You're screaming about these facts because they do not tell the story you want told. They demonstrate that since Chavez has been in power, Venezuela has steadily improved its economic status, and is vastly improved over the two decades that preceeded Chavez.

They demonstrate that from the deep recession that Chavez inherited, he has moved the country forward economically "with very rapid growth by almost any international or historical perspective."

Your argument is that Venezuela still has problems. How fucking stupid is that? The whole fucking planet has problems .. many with problems a lot bigger than Venezuela's .. like the US for instance.

Mexico is about to collapse.

Japan and Great Britain are in recession .. and so are we.

You argument is stupid.

Venezuela is 62nd. So what? What's your fucking point?

Let's see if you step up to address the historical and regional perspective.

I doubt it.

Damn, I love you guys. :)
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Yes but Chavez has done it at the expense of his nations plutocrats and the oil companies. Enough reason right there for Republicans to hate him with a passion.
 
Mottley Dow jones dropped the from the international ivestment index because of stealing investors money. Do you support those actions and think that is good for Venezuala?
 
What I get a kick out of is that ya'll are arguing as if socialism and capitalism were mutually exclusive. There's all sorts of examples in our very own nation where socialism works quite well for us. Public Education is one example. The Postal Service is another. Social Security is another, etc, etc.

Where as both systems taken to extremes have proven historically to be fuckin evil. We all know what an evil system that socialism taken to the extreme is. Communism proved it can only work at the point of a gun. Communism pales compared to laissez fair capitalism with it's peculiarly effective brand of exploitative ruthlessness. Both communism and laissez-faire capitalism are both extremes and both are evil.

But there are principles of both economic systems that work very well under a given set of conditions and it is up to a democratic nation to determine when and how to apply both, just as we do in the USA.

I'm really skeptical about the drum beating over Venezuela. Hugo Chavez is certainly no saint but he is being villianized in the USA because he broke the hegemony that the big oil companies had over Venezuelia's wealth, natural resources and political power. That, from any objective view point, which the US Government is anything but that, could not be anything but good for the nation of Venezuelia. The whole socialism bit is one great big red herring and a canard.

This is about having control over Venezuelia's oil and political power.
 
Mottleydude said:
What I get a kick out of is that ya'll are arguing as if socialism and capitalism were mutually exclusive. There's all sorts of examples in our very own nation where socialism works quite well for us. Public Education is one example. The Postal Service is another. Social Security is another, etc, etc.

Where as both systems taken to extremes have proven historically to be fuckin evil. We all know what an evil system that socialism taken to the extreme is. Communism proved it can only work at the point of a gun. Communism pales compared to laissez fair capitalism with it's peculiarly effective brand of exploitative ruthlessness. Both communism and laissez-faire capitalism are both extremes and both are evil.

But there are principles of both economic systems that work very well under a given set of conditions and it is up to a democratic nation to determine when and who to apply both, just as we do in the USA.

I'm really skeptical about the drum beating over Venezuela. Hugo Chavez is certainly no saint but he is being villianized in the USA because he broke the hegemony that the big oil companies had over Venezuelia's wealth, natural resources and political power. That, from any objective view point, which the US Government is anything but that, could not be anything but good for the nation of Venezuelia. The whole socialism bit is one great big red herring and a canard.

This is about having control over Venezuelia's oil and political power.
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Do you really think public education or the USPS are working well for us?
 
Topspin said:
Mottley Dow jones dropped the from the international ivestment index because of stealing investors money. Do you support those actions and think that is good for Venezuala?
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I don't know the whole story so I can't answer your question. Were those investors a handfull of foreign plutocrats that were running Venezuela as their personal fief? Then yes it was a good thing for Venezuela. Caveat Emptor! Venezuela is a sovereign democratic nation.

If it was a naked grab by a bunch of thugs to take property that belonged to others then the whole shit pile will eventually collapse and that would be bad news for the Venezuelan's.
 
I know your not an investor or business person. But ask one who is, being dropped from an index of foreign countries due to bad business climate is not good for venz citizens. Your false outrage at oil companies is naive and juvenille and funny.
 
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