Trump Arrested again!

Jarod said:
Do you think he’s guilty?
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It sure looks like it at this point, but then we have an indictment... Grand Juries hear only one side of the story, presented by the person who will later prosecute, they really want them to believe that he is the third child of Satan, and they will tell them so... LOL We all have heard the maxim that you can "indict a ham sandwich"...

I wait for a trial or a plea before I start being "sure" of things. After the trial though I have plenty of opinion where the jury got it wrong sometimes. OJ Simpson would be one of those...

Anyway, that audiotape will be the strongest evidence they have and very difficult to overcome. I look forward to either hearing how they defend against that or possibly seeing a plea agreement...

I just don't believe that Trump would plea without some serious action. It would take even more than it took for Nixon to resign, republicans walking to his door... I don't think that would be enough, he'd see it as making him the ultimate "outsider"...
 
Damocles said:
It sure looks like it at this point, but then we have an indictment... Grand Juries hear only one side of the story, presented by the person who will later prosecute, they really want them to believe that he is the third child of Satan, and they will tell them so... LOL We all have heard the maxim that you can "indict a ham sandwich"...

I wait for a trial or a plea before I start being "sure" of things. After the trial though I have plenty of opinion where the jury got it wrong sometimes. OJ Simpson would be one of those...

Anyway, that audiotape will be the strongest evidence they have and very difficult to overcome. I look forward to either hearing how they defend against that or possibly seeing a plea agreement...

I just don't believe that Trump would plea without some serious action. It would take even more than it took for Nixon to resign, republicans walking to his door... I don't think that would be enough, he'd see it as making him the ultimate "outsider"...
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Good analysis. In my opinion, there is a big difference between being legally guilty of something, and having an opinion that someone is guilty. The biggest example is O.J. Simpson, I think we all know he’s guilty even though the jury said he is not.

I’ve seen plenty of examples where is guilty person has been found not guilty. That happens more than the other way around, and I think that’s a good thing if it has to be one way or the other.
 
Jarod said:
There are people spending time in jail for receiving emails containing classified documents?
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For keeping them in an unsecured place, whether a server, or in a book, etc. even accidental exposure can net you some jail time, it is negligence, not "intent" that matters.

Some of the material, according to the FBI report, was marked classified SCI, obviously was classified, and should not have been maintained there. That is, as Comey said, "Grossly Negligent".

I watched a woman in the Navy get arrested when she accidentally walked out with SCI in the pages of a book. I know that one guy went to jail for simply taking a picture of a room inside a submarine, he didn't even share it to the world...

Anyway, yes. I think HillBillary should have been charged. She met the criteria of that law, and then some.
 
Yakuda said:
The fact is you people only care about this shit just so he doesnt run again. You dint really care about the documents. Stop the pretending. Why do you think everyone is as stupid as you?
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This has nothing to do with him running again, dumbfuck.
 
Damocles said:
For keeping them in an unsecured place, whether a server, or in a book, etc. even accidental exposure can net you some jail time, it is negligence, not "intent" that matters.

Some of the material, according to the FBI report, was marked classified SCI, obviously was classified, and should not have been maintained there. That is, as Comey said, "Grossly Negligent".

I watched a woman in the Navy get arrested when she accidentally walked out with SCI in the pages of a book. I know that one guy went to jail for simply taking a picture of a room inside a submarine, he didn't even share it to the world...

Anyway, yes. I think HillBillary should have been charged. She met the criteria of that law, and then some.
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My understanding is that the class by document sent to Hillary had the classification markings removed, so if she stored them on a server, she didn’t know they were classified. Do you think she was really up-to-date on the fact that the emails were stored and where?

I think comparing the Hillary example with what Trump is charged with is outrageously stupid.
 
Jarod said:
My understanding is that the class by document sent to Hillary had the classification markings removed, so if she stored them on a server, she didn’t know they were classified. Do you think she was really up-to-date on the fact that the emails were stored and where?

I think comparing the Hillary example with what Trump is charged with is outrageously stupid.
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Then you are misinformed. The report notes that some of it was clearly marked, others were marked in a way that folks with clearances would know. Some was SCI, and was classified at the time of sending as well as receiving, and she should have known.

There is a reason that Comey believed it was Grossly Negligent, because it was. And those two words tell me that he believed she met the criteria for prosecution, but the AG was not going to prosecute and he sold us out, just as the AG did.

Anyway, Obama's "intent" comment (which was later used by the AG as a "reason" though it was never part of the statute) was adding something to the law that didn't exist, and saying it was the reason she was not prosecuted just showed that obstruction was his intent there... IMHO.
 
Damocles said:
Then you are misinformed. The report notes that some of it was clearly marked, others were marked in a way that folks with clearances would know. Some was SCI, and was classified at the time of sending as well as receiving, and she should have known.

There is a reason that Comey believed it was Grossly Negligent, because it was. And those two words tell me that he believed she met the criteria for prosecution, but the AG was not going to prosecute and he sold us out, just as the AG did.

Anyway, Obama's "intent" comment (which was later used by the AG as a "reason" though it was never part of the statute) was adding something to the law that didn't exist, and saying it was the reason she was not prosecuted just showed that obstruction was his intent there... IMHO.
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Sorry, but I believe intent is always required in a criminal case. If someone shoved a classified document in my pocket, without me knowing it, I would not be guilty of a crime.
 
Yakuda said:
The fact is you people only care about this shit just so he doesnt run again. You dint really care about the documents. Stop the pretending. Why do you think everyone is as stupid as you?
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You know who cares about the documents? Current and former military who vote. It's the reckless way trump treated those military secrets they don't like. To say, "no one cares" is just looney tunes.

Don't take my word for it, take theirs:

https://www.military.com/daily-news...nd-shared-classified-map-indictment-says.html

"MIAMI — Former President Donald Trump described a Pentagon “plan of attack” and shared a classified map related to a military operation, according to a sweeping 37-count felony indictment related to the mishandling of classified documents that was unsealed Friday and that could instantly reshape the 2024 presidential race.

The indictment paints an unmistakably damning portrait of Trump’s treatment of sensitive information, accusing him of willfully defying Justice Department demands to return documents he had taken from the White House to Mar-a-Lago, enlisting aides in his efforts to hide the records and even telling his lawyers that we wanted to defy a subpoena for the materials stored in his estate."
 
Jarod said:
Sorry, but I believe intent is always required in a criminal case. If someone shoved a classified document in my pocket, without me knowing it, I would not be guilty of a crime.
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Again, intent is specifically not written into this law, Negligence is the criteria. It is illegal to keep it on that server, regardless of intent. She was, as Comey stated, Grossly Negligent. The report even states that they are certain this unprotected server was accessed by outside forces, thus this information was available to folks who should not have had access to it...

Anyway, here is the law she violated, adding "intent" to the law is a partisan rewrite of the code.

18 U.S.C. § 793(f)

Section 793(f) makes it a felony for any person “entrusted with… information relating to the national defense” to allow that information to be “removed from its proper place of custody” through “gross negligence.”
 
LurchAddams said:
You know who cares about the documents? Current and former military who vote. It's the reckless way trump treated those military secrets they don't like. To say, "no one cares" is just looney tunes.

Don't take my word for it, take theirs:

https://www.military.com/daily-news...nd-shared-classified-map-indictment-says.html

"MIAMI — Former President Donald Trump described a Pentagon “plan of attack” and shared a classified map related to a military operation, according to a sweeping 37-count felony indictment related to the mishandling of classified documents that was unsealed Friday and that could instantly reshape the 2024 presidential race.

The indictment paints an unmistakably damning portrait of Trump’s treatment of sensitive information, accusing him of willfully defying Justice Department demands to return documents he had taken from the White House to Mar-a-Lago, enlisting aides in his efforts to hide the records and even telling his lawyers that we wanted to defy a subpoena for the materials stored in his estate."
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This is truth. How this information is treated matters to me. Any veteran with a clearance likely will feel the same.
 
Damocles said:
I think Hillary should have been charged. Whether she is guilty or not should have been decided by a jury of her peers, not by partisanship. I also think that Brandon should be charged for taking documents home from when he was in the Senate, suddenly becoming "cooperative" decades later after you had them scattered about your home for decades isn't a good enough reason to avoid prosecution.
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trump went one step further - lying about returning them, and having them moved around to avoid detection. Had trump just returned them when asked he would not have been charged. It's the obstruction of justice and the coverup that always kills republicans. Ask Nixon.
 
Damocles said:
Again, intent is specifically not written into this law, Negligence is the criteria. It is illegal to keep it on that server, regardless of intent. She was, as Comey stated, Grossly Negligent. The report even states that they are certain this unprotected server was accessed by outside forces, thus this information was available to folks who should not have had access to it...

Anyway, here is the law she violated, adding "intent" to the law is a partisan rewrite of the code.

18 U.S.C. § 793(f)

Section 793(f) makes it a felony for any person “entrusted with… information relating to the national defense” to allow that information to be “removed from its proper place of custody” through “gross negligence.”
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It would be illegal to keep it on the server if she knew it was on the server, that would be intent to keep it on the server. She would still have to know their were classified documents there.
 
Jarod said:
It would be illegal to keep it on the server if she knew it was on the server, that would be intent to keep it on the server. She would still have to know their were classified documents there.
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She knew. You ignore that some were clearly marked. The reality is with Comey noting her Gross Negligence we have met the standard for prosecution as all aspects were met. She should have had to face a jury of her peers, and only partisanship saved her.
 
Damocles said:
She knew. You ignore that some were clearly marked. The reality is with Comey noting her Gross Negligence we have met the standard for prosecution as all aspects were met. She should have had to face a jury of her peers, and only partisanship saved her.
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If there is evidence she knew, you might be right.
 
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