This Is the Most Wanted Car in America (and It’s Not Even Close).

[Into the Night]

How long do you really believe Tesla will have a monopoly on E-cars?

Remember the "Great Manure Crisis of 1894"? It was solved by the automobile. In this case, combined with AI piloting cars, people in 20-30 years won't need to own cars; they'll just order one with their smart phone like an Uber or Lyft. It'll be cities first. No more looking for parking. LOL

Compare the cost of your own car, maintenance, fuel, insurance, etc and how much it's actually used? At what point would it be cheaper to rent?

TANSTAAFL. Nothing changes about the maintenance costs of a car just because it's rented.

 

[Into the Night]

If there is no monopoly, the standard capitalism rules will apply.

Understood about "public transit". What I'm talking about is AI Uber-like cars even in small towns or nearby areas. Sure business or isolated location would need to own their vehicles, but the idea of "a car in every garage" will fade away as an unnecessary expense. There's no reason that trucks or vehicles with trailers couldn't be rented too. If you need a large truck daily, then private ownership may be a better option. Overall though, most people will turn their garages into dens, playrooms, guest rooms or some other use of the space than to keep a vehicle.

That's not capitalism, Sock. That's fascism.

 

[Into the Night]

Not true, Einstein.

EVs are much more efficient than ICE cars. The energy goes straight from the battery to the motor. There is no conversion, no explosions of the gas inside the cylinders (which create enormous heat that must be dissipated).
EVs convert over 77% of the electrical energy from the grid to power at the wheels. Conventional gasoline vehicles only convert about 12%–30% of the energy stored in gasoline to power at the wheels.

An EV directly converts electricity into movement. This makes it far more efficient than a conventional car, which has to burn fuel (creating heat) and then convert that heat into motion.
An EV is more than 70% efficient from the moment you turn it on. Even the best diesel engine, fully warmed up, struggles to get to 40% efficiency. In other words, a conventional ICE car wastes well over half the energy in its fuel.

Read this and educate yourself: https://www.edfenergy.com/energywise/why-EVs-are-efficient

TANSTAAFL. The EV must be charged, Commie. That costs energy...almost twice the energy of simply putting gasoline into a car and converting it directly into movement. That power plant is typically using coal, oil, or natural gas to generate that energy to charge your car. That energy must also be transmitted from that remote location to the charger for your car.

Today's gasoline cars reach about 50% efficiency. Most of the energy for the EV is lost in waste heat. That's lost energy in generating the power, transformers, transmission lines, distribution lines and MORE waste heat charging the battery itself (charging heats the battery).

Your random numbers won't help you.

 

[Into the Night]

And that power from the grid just magically appears. 60% of electricity comes from fossil fuels.

Neither coal, oil, or natural gas are fossils, but your argument is otherwise correct.

There is also the cost of getting the energy from that power plant to the charging station, and, of course, the battery itself is heated during charging. That is also waste heat.
The same sized car as an EV is heavier as well. F=mA still applies, and it takes MORE energy to move the same sized car than the lighter gasoline car.

When you add it all up, EVs use almost twice the energy of a modern gasoline car.

 

[Into the Night]

All technical issues. No doubt the Horse-and-Buggy crowd (especially those who had a lot of stock in Buggy Whips) made similar arguments about the automobile.

You don't get to speak for the dead, Sock. These are not 'technical issues'. This is the math YOU are denying and discarding.

 

[Joe Capitalist]

All technical issues. No doubt the Horse-and-Buggy crowd (especially those who had a lot of stock in Buggy Whips) made similar arguments about the automobile.

At least he finally admits that EVs are a helluva lot more efficient than gas cars.

An EV is more than 70% efficient from the moment you turn it on. Even the best diesel engine, fully warmed up, struggles to get to 40% efficiency. In other words, a conventional ICE car wastes well over half the energy in its fuel.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

You don't get to speak for the dead, Sock. These are not 'technical issues'. This is the math YOU are denying and discarding.

Bulverism. Bigotry.

Bulverism fallacy. Bigotry.

Bulverism. Bigotry. False Authority.

bigotry, bulverism,

 

[Dutch Uncle]

At least he finally admits that EVs are a helluva lot more efficient than gas cars.

An EV is more than 70% efficient from the moment you turn it on. Even the best diesel engine, fully warmed up, struggles to get to 40% efficiency. In other words, a conventional ICE car wastes well over half the energy in its fuel.

I'm not an engineer, Internet or otherwise, but having worked with both gasoline engines and electric motors, a lot of energy from gas engines goes up in heat.

 

[ExpressLane]

At least he finally admits that EVs are a helluva lot more efficient than gas cars.

An EV is more than 70% efficient from the moment you turn it on. Even the best diesel engine, fully warmed up, struggles to get to 40% efficiency. In other words, a conventional ICE car wastes well over half the energy in its fuel.

Gasoline cars don't depend on energy from the grid. Electric cars waste 30% of their energy that they get from the grid that also wastes energy. And diesel engines in trains, ships, and trucks are the work horses of America.

During heat (Summer) and cold (Winter) electric cars waste more energy. During winter fossil fuel cars become more powerful.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

TANSTAAFL. Nothing changes about the maintenance costs of a car just because it's rented.

Bulverism. Bigotry.

Bulverism fallacy. Bigotry.

Bulverism. Bigotry. False Authority.

bigotry, bulverism,

 

[Dutch Uncle]

That's not capitalism, Sock. That's fascism.

Bulverism. Bigotry.

Bulverism fallacy. Bigotry.

Bulverism. Bigotry. False Authority.

bigotry, bulverism,

 

[Joe Capitalist]

I'm not an engineer, Internet or otherwise, but having worked with both gasoline engines and electric motors, a lot of energy from gas engines goes up in heat.

Which is why they need a radiator and coolant to dissipate the heat. Also why ICE cars overheat in stop-and-go traffic.
You'll never see an EV overheat.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Which is why they need a radiator and coolant to dissipate the heat. Also why ICE cars overheat in stop-and-go traffic.
You'll never see an EV overheat.

...unless it's on fire. LOL

Gasoline tech is over 100 years old. E-car tech is relatively new. I'm certain the bugs will be worked out.

 

[IBDaMann]

Not true, Einstein.

It's absolutely true, but as I mentioned in my previous post, you can't be a scientifically illiterate moron and simultaneously understand the ramifications of thermodynamics. You obviously are one of the aforementioned scientifically illiterate morons who presently has other people doing his thinking for him. Please don't take it personally as I rake you over the coals for being a moron who thinks he's a genius.

EVs are much more efficient than ICE cars.

The 2nd law of thermodynamics says that's impossible, but you say that you don't subscribe to such chicanery. OK, I get it. Let's review the merits, or lack thereof, of your position:

Your Position: The process of converting a certain quantity of chemical energy (in the form of hydrocarbons) to electrical energy via combustion engine generators (with loss H), to be transmitted over power lines to charging stations (with loss T), to charge a car (with negligible loss C) that coverts that electrical energy to kinetic energy (with loss K), thus performing the work of propelling the car ... is somehow more fuel efficient than simply converting a certain quantity of chemical energy (in the form of hydrocarbons) directly to kinetic energy via combustion engine (with loss H), thus performing the work of propelling the car.

My Position: Converting a certain quantity of chemical energy (in the form of hydrocarbons) directly to kinetic energy via combustion engine (with loss H), thus performing the work of propelling the car is clearly far more fuel efficient than the convoluted process of converting a certain quantity of chemical energy (in the form of hydrocarbons) to electrical energy via combustion engine generators (with loss H), to be transmitted over power lines to charging stations (with loss T), to charge a car (with minimal loss C) that coverts that electrical energy to kinetic energy (with loss K), thus performing the work of propelling the car.

Please, find me an actual physicist who understands thermodynamics who nonetheless disagrees with me and who agrees with you, who can explain your position, because you obviously cannot. You also have the 2nd law of thermodynamics to overcome and I don't see you getting around that anytime soon.

 

[LurchAddams]

Ford's Overall Sales Climb While EV Numbers Drop

https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/c...ll-sales-climb-while-ev-numbers-drop-44501809


General Motors reports sequential decline in Q2 electric vehicles sales

https://invezz.com/news/2023/07/05/general-motors-q2-ev-sales-decline/

Um... Ford also sells EV's. All US car companies do now. Heard of the F150 Lightning? The Ford MachE? The Chevvy Volt?

Duh!

 

[Into the Night]

At least he finally admits that EVs are a helluva lot more efficient than gas cars.

Word stuffing. He never said any such thing.

An EV is more than 70% efficient from the moment you turn it on. Even the best diesel engine, fully warmed up, struggles to get to 40% efficiency. In other words, a conventional ICE car wastes well over half the energy in its fuel.

TANSTAAFL. You are ignoring energy losses in the charging cycle again. Gasoline cars get almost 50% efficiency now. FAR better than EVs that waste a lot of energy during the charging cycle.
And you are making up numbers. Argument from randU fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

...unless it's on fire. LOL

Gasoline tech is over 100 years old. E-car tech is relatively new. I'm certain the bugs will be worked out.

EVs were around BEFORE gasoline engines were even used in cars, Sock.

 

[Into the Night]

I'm not an engineer, Internet or otherwise, but having worked with both gasoline engines and electric motors, a lot of energy from gas engines goes up in heat.

Even MORE energy required to charge an EV and drive it goes up as heat, Sock. Almost twice as much.

 

[IBDaMann]

I'm not an engineer, Internet or otherwise,

... but you are still compelled to inject a totally mistaken opinion with incoherent gibberish.

a lot of energy from gas engines goes up in heat.

You used the word "heat." Do you even know what that word means?

I'll provide you the definition straight out of the Global Warming Mythology Reference Manual:

Heat: noun
In the Global Warming theology, "heat" means whatever it needs to mean at any given moment. The term is employed by Global Warming believers to shift semantic goalposts as necessary. It's meaning can shift fluidly between "temperature," "increase in temperature," "thermal energy," "flow of thermal energy," "convection," "absorption of electromagnetic radiation," "energy," "friction," "conduction," "infrared," "plasma," "work," "radiance," "power," "radioactivity," "electrical energy" and others as convenient.

Energy does not "go up in heat" except for a portion causing convection, while the rest travels in all directions.

Just for grins, what do you think "heat" means?

... but having worked with both gasoline engines and electric motors,

That puts you in the exclusive class of elites who have both driven a car and used a garbage disposal.

 

[Into the Night]

Which is why they need a radiator and coolant to dissipate the heat. Also why ICE cars overheat in stop-and-go traffic.
You'll never see an EV overheat.

EVs have radiators and coolant too, ya dumb Commie.
They don't overheat in stop and go traffic unless there is something wrong with them.