"Texas Senate Passes Bill Banning Educators From Teaching KKK as Morally Wrong"

Walt said:
It prohibits teachers from teaching facts that cause "discomfort, guilt, anguish, or another form of psychological distress", which turns out to be quite a few facts.
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That is not what the bill says. It prohibits a school or teacher
requiring teaching the concept that

"vi)an individual should feel discomfort, guilt, anguish, or any other form of psychological distress on
account of the individual’s race or sex;"

It does not say the teacher cannot teach any facts that make a student feel discomfort, etc.

And, what a teacher does in class often has little to do with official curricula. There is little real supervision over whether the teacher includes required topics.

And, the House and Senate bill are different. See the actual bills below. The OP was not very accurate and sensationalized the real news.

https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/871/billtext/pdf/SB00003E.pdf#navpanes=0

https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/87R/billtext/pdf/HB03979F.pdf#navpanes=0


 
Flash said:
That is not what the bill says. It prohibits a school or teacher
requiring teaching the concept that

"vi)an individual should feel discomfort, guilt, anguish, or any other form of psychological distress on
account of the individual’s race or sex;"

It does not say the teacher cannot teach any facts that make a student feel discomfort, etc.

And, what a teacher does in class often has little to do with official curricula. There is little real supervision over whether the teacher includes required topics.

And, the House and Senate bill are different. See the actual bills below. The OP was not very accurate and sensationalized the real news.

https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/871/billtext/pdf/SB00003E.pdf#navpanes=0

https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/87R/billtext/pdf/HB03979F.pdf#navpanes=0
Click to expand...

The first link paragraph Sec.28.0022(4)(A) was very interesting. A lot of it made sense until I got to the part quoted below where I wasn't sure what they were trying to say in all instances even though I think it appears to be a good:

(vii)A meritocracy or traits such as a hard
work ethic are racist or sexist or were created by members of a
particular race to oppress members of another race;

(viii) the advent of slavery in the
territory that is now the United States constituted the true
founding of the United States; or

(ix) with respect to their relationship to
American values, slavery and racism are anything other than
deviations from, betrayals of, or failures to live up to the
authentic founding principles of the United States, which include
liberty and equality;
 
NiftyNiblick said:
Texas is a shithole.

It's an embarrassment that that despicable state is part of our nation.

I personally don't recognize them as such.
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Its a despicable state that idiots vote against their own interests for these GQPer enemies of the State who are a moral atrocity on humanity, and to which caused Texas in particular to be in the covid-19 sh!thole. Nothing wrong with the land of Texas, its the GQPer swine the inhabits it.
 
Walt said:
...You obviously do not have children. Especially with young children, it is the teacher's job to teach them what is good and what is bad....
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I only have grandchildren and understand how school is a major part of a kid's culturalization, socialization and education. You and I both know there are asshole teachers out there. This legislation appears to be trying to limit the bad.

From what I read of it, it's okay to say "the KKK is bad" but not "You're bad because your daddy is the Grand Poobah of the local racist hate club".
 
SmarterthanYou said:
one would think they understand the rubber band effect...........but no, too many people are too hateful........and don't bother coming at me with question about my support or not..........as far as i'm concerned, you're all so fucking wrong you have a space in hell reserved for you
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AKA Newton's Third Law of Motion. Do you see Democrat goals as being a reaction to the previous president?
 
Walt said:
You obviously do not have children. Especially with young children, it is the teacher's job to teach them what is good and what is bad.
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We are not talking about teaching young children basic morality, the topic was about teaching secondary history classes. It is not the job of history teachers to preach what actions were right or wrong. No teacher had to tell you "lynchings are bad." They should allow students to make their own judgments--that is a big part of education.

My main point is that those silly bills are just exercises in political partisanship and won't affect what is actually taught in the classroom. By the time the TEA converts those bills (if they pass) into regulations and those regulations are then ignored by the teachers, it means nothing.

The criticisms are just attempts to berate states because people don't like the way they vote. They think "voting against their own interests" means they don't vote for government to give them more benefits. Somebody thinks they are in a superior position to decide what is in the interest of others. It is simply racism applied to people based on the regions in which they live that have a large number of minorities.

The regulation prevented any school from requiring lessons which caused discomfort, etc. But, there is no way to implement such a law.

If I am teaching about lynching and a black student says that makes them feel uncomfortable, do I stop the lesson? Or, should that be something a history class should include?
 
Nordberg said:
For some reason, texas decides what books the nation's schools get.
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Texas does not decide--publishers make that decision. Some publishers include topics certain (large) states require to sell more books. A history textbook that includes that information is indistinguishable from any other secondary history book although it might include reference to a Hispanic guy somebody wanted included in the history requirements.

How many secondary school students do you think actually read their textbooks? Unfortunately, many teachers do not really require reading because "they won't read it, anyway" or because they consider it a boring way to teach....



Texas schools are not even required to use those books and can purchase its own materials.
 
Flash said:
No teacher had to tell you "lynchings are bad."
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Lynchings were presented as society punishing criminals, and were strongly supported by much of local society at the time. They even put up monuments to honor the lynchings. You only think they were bad, because modern teachers told you they were bad. The alt right wants to reverse that.

Flash said:
They should allow students to make their own judgments--that is a big part of education.
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At the same time they are saying that students should use their own judgement to decide, they also argue that strong propaganda should be included in the history books. Can you see the hypocracy?

Flash said:
My main point is that those silly bills are just exercises in political partisanship and won't affect what is actually taught in the classroom.
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160 years of lies about the Civil War means your point is questionable.
 
Flash said:
Texas does not decide--publishers make that decision.
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Texas makes statewide textbook decisions. Any local school board that uses textbooks other than the Texas standards will serve prison time. They do not joke around in Texas.

This means publishers have three choices, they can either publish one set of textbooks suitable to Texas nationwide(the cheapest solution), publish two sets of textbooks(one for Texas, and one for the rest of the country), or lose Texas as a marketplace. Those choices are reduced to two, with Texas punishing textbook publishers for publishing a second set for other states.

Flash said:
Some publishers include topics certain (large) states require to sell more books.
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There is no other state that has statewide textbook requirements. Only Texas has this power, or should we say only Texas uses this power.

Flash said:
Texas schools are not even required to use those books and can purchase its own materials.
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That would be a crime in Texas. Most school boards do not want to have to go to jail.
 
Walt said:
Lynchings were presented as society punishing criminals, and were strongly supported by much of local society at the time. They even put up monuments to honor the lynchings. You only think they were bad, because modern teachers told you they were bad. The alt right wants to reverse that.
Click to expand...

No teacher ever told me lynchings are bad and I taught 8th grade U. S. history for four years in Texas and never told any students lynching is bad. That would be very patronizing of me to moralize such events. Nobody wants students to think lynchings are not bad. You continue to misinterpret the Texas legislation which would prevent schools from mandating what teachers can teach.

Texas legislators are idiots when it comes to school curricula issues but it is harmless rhetoric that is soon forgotten. It is made worse by misleading sensationalized media reports and spread by partisan liberals who like to make fun of those states they don't like.

Walt said:
At the same time they are saying that students should use their own judgement to decide, they also argue that strong propaganda should be included in the history books. Can you see the hypocracy?
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No, because they are not arguing for any strong propaganda included in history books. It would be hypocrisy if they wanted to teach what is right or wrong; especially since there are areas on which history teachers disagree and some would be teaching something is good and others that it is bad.

Social science departments in universities, including history, are relatively liberal and public school teachers usually share those same values which they impart in the classroom. Most will be unaware of that legislation, if passed, or ignore it. Texas has been going through these wars for decades in the State Board of Education over what is included regarding evolution and social science curricula. It has not changed anything that actually occurs in the classroom and by the time the board compromised on those topic very little was changed. For example, language was stuck in science curricula regarding evolution that stated scientific theories should be critically examined.

Walt said:
160 years of lies about the Civil War means your point is questionable.
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What lies about the Civil War have been taught in Texas since the 1950's-1960's? Texas teaches the same thing from the same (unread) texts as all the other states. And, it varies by the number teachers teaching that subject.
 
Walt said:
Texas makes statewide textbook decisions. Any local school board that uses textbooks other than the Texas standards will serve prison time. They do not joke around in Texas.

This means publishers have three choices, they can either publish one set of textbooks suitable to Texas nationwide(the cheapest solution), publish two sets of textbooks(one for Texas, and one for the rest of the country), or lose Texas as a marketplace. Those choices are reduced to two, with Texas punishing textbook publishers for publishing a second set for other states.

That would be a crime in Texas. Most school boards do not want to have to go to jail.
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Walt, I think you are getting information from the place the Trump supporters are getting their news on the election.

Where did you read school board members go to jail?

From the law: https://law.justia.com/codes/texas/2005/ed/002.00.000031.00.html§ 31.024. ADOPTION BY STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION. (a) By
majority vote, the State Board of Education shall:
(1) place each submitted textbook on a conforming or
nonconforming list; or
(2) reject a textbook submitted for placement on a
conforming or nonconforming list.

§ 31.101. SELECTION AND PURCHASE OF TEXTBOOKS BY SCHOOL
DISTRICTS. (a) Each year, during a period established by the State
Board of Education, the board of trustees of each school district
and the governing body of each open-enrollment charter school
shall:
(1) for a subject in the foundation curriculum, notify
the State Board of Education of the textbooks selected by the board
of trustees or governing body for the following school year from
among the textbooks on the appropriate conforming or nonconforming
list; or
(2) for a subject in the enrichment curriculum:
(A) notify the State Board of Education of each
textbook selected by the board of trustees or governing body for the
following school year from among the textbooks on the appropriate
conforming or nonconforming list;

The State Board makes two lists of conforming and nonconforming textbooks (nonconforming have less than 50% of the essential knowledge and skills).
The district can choose a book from either list. Or, they can choose any materials not on the list but they must pay for those.
 
I think many of our posters are getting their information about the influence of Texas on textbook selection from very outdated information or from incorrect information which they did not bother to verify. Posters like to believe negative stories.

From the Texas Tribune which is a respected liberal news source on Texas politics:

The Textbook Myth: Urban Myth

"Despite all the handwringing about Texas' influence on the textbook market nationally, it's just not so, publishing insiders say. The state's clout has been on the wane and will diminish more as technological advances and political shifts transform the industry.


As the furor over the State Board of Education’s ideological rewriting of social studies standards has exploded nationally in recent weeks, a primary narrative has emerged: that whatever 15 politicians in Texas (or at least the rightest-leaning half of them) decide will be published in textbooks nationwide for years to come.

That fear has already stoked a political backlash: One California state senator is drafting legislation to keep any hint of the Texas version of U.S. history out of California textbooks. “The de-emphasis on civil rightsin so many areas — reducing the scope of Latino history, especially in a state like Texas — is just mind-boggling,” said Adam Keigwin, chief of staff for San Francisco Democrat Leland Yee.


But Yee and his liberal-to-moderate contemporaries in other states need not fret, textbook industry experts say. Though Texas has been painted in scores of media reports as the big dog that wags the textbook industry tail, that’s simply no longer true — and will become even less true in the future, as technological advances and political shifts transform the marketplace, said Jay Diskey, executive director of the Association of American Publishers. Diskey calls the persistent reports of Texas dominating the market an “urban myth.” Yet the myth persists.


Continued: https://www.texastribune.org/2010/03/26/texas-textbooks-national-influence-is-a-myth/
 
gemini104104 said:
Its a despicable state that idiots vote against their own interests for these GQPer enemies of the State who are a moral atrocity on humanity, and to which caused Texas in particular to be in the covid-19 sh!thole. Nothing wrong with the land of Texas, its the GQPer swine the inhabits it.
Click to expand...

I, often accused of not liking America, have often described it as the most valuable tract of real estate on the planet.
Imagine what it would be like if more of the inhabitants were worthy to have it?
 
Walt said:
It prohibits teaching any historical facts that "discomfort, guilt, anguish, or another form of psychological distress." The big no no in their book is teaching that the Founding Fathers owned slaves.
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The Texas bill sounds like the politically correct college speech codes that prohibit speech that is offensive, racist, sexist, ableist, specieist, and inappropriate laughter or eye contact or lack thereof.
 
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