Putin is going down, asshole, and you should avoid having your lips attached to his ass when he does, Dookie.
Russia warns Sweden and Finland against Nato membership
- Thread starter moon
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Putin is going down, asshole, and you should avoid having your lips attached to his ass when he does, Dookie.
C rimea was a result of the lease at Sevastopol being in jeapordy
The rest of this is pure nonsense - blaming Russia for systemic endemic Ukraine corruption
Even freaks like Fiona Hilla and "call me colonel" Vindman wouldn't say that.
Your post is pure speculation to the point of fantasy. Russiaphobia on steroids
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_in_Ukraine
According to the United States Agency for International Development (USAID), the main causes of corruption in Ukraine are a weak justice system and an over-controlling non-transparent government combined with business-political ties and a weak civil society. Corruption is regularly discussed in the Ukrainian media.
So you are OK with a country telling it's neighbors, "Do what I say or I will kill your citizens."?
moon
Satire for Sanity
No- but I'm OK with Russia asking for Ukraine to be neutral and then reacting when the request was refused.
It is, after all, an existential concern for Russia as NATO promised not to advance eastwards. After Ukraine, the next eastward country would have been Russia itself- and don't say that NATO wouldn't have loaded Ukraine with nukes. The yarn that NATO is purely a ' defensive ' gang is as ludicrous as claiming that Zionism isn't about ethnic cleansing. NATO is a protection racket- and the saps have to have someone to be ' protected ' from.
So you are OK with Russia telling it's neighbors, "Do what I say or I will kill your citizens."
Russia is telling Ukraine that they can't associate with the west and then invaded when they refused to comply with that request even though Ukraine had not applied for NATO membership.
moon
Satire for Sanity
You are neglecting the fact that NATO organized a coup in 2014 which ousted the elected pro-Russian president, allowed the Neo-Nazis to take over and shell the Donbas for eight years with 14,000 deaths.
Why are you even stumbling on in such pseudo-patriotic ignorance ? Your notion of ' peaceful little Ukraine just trying to be independent ' is an utter nonsense. NATO packed it with weapons.
And you are ignoring the fact that Ukraine held a free and fair election in 2019 and elected the leader of their choice.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Ukrainian_presidential_election
By your argument we should invade Russia because the bolsheviks organized a coup in 1917. It would be just as stupid as your argument.
It seems you have bought into the same specious argument that Putin did, that Ukraine was longing to return to mother Russia.
moon
Satire for Sanity
No- but you're ignoring the fact that the breakaway regions did not take part.
LOL.. So if the breakaway regions are about 12% of the Ukrainian population and the winner had over 70% of the vote how do you think voting in those regions would have changed the outcome?
Zelenskyy won by over 9 million votes and only 4 million voters were in Crimea and the western breakaway regions.
I am hardly the one ignoring facts.
I think we are past that.
NATO expansion, uber-weaponization of Ukraine, and turning Ukraine government into a western pawn
dependent show poking the bear to be the modus operandi
it wasn't "NATO"it was the USA. Vicky Nuland, John McCain and Robert Kagan+
USAID commercials (i have to source that if you want)
That set the stage for the Crimean annexation - instead of just leaving Ukraine to it's corrupt self
our meddling set off the chain of events that resulted in turning Ukraine from a neutral buffer state
to a defacto sophisticated armed NATO state - with the warpigs calling for more and more.
I still think the invasion could have been avoided had Biden taken the Lavrov letters ( Russian redlines) seriously - but we didn't and Russia was left the Hobsons choice of a hostile Ukraine or invasion
BartenderElite
Verified User
Russia has no say whatsoever in who independent countries ally themselves with.
moon
Satire for Sanity
OK- but I don't differentiate .
moon
Satire for Sanity
Quite obviously- it does. So does the USA.
BartenderElite
Verified User
No one should have to ask Russia's permission to join NATO.
This is an archaic narrative. We should not indulge Putin's war of nostalgia.
moon
Satire for Sanity
You're making the erroneous assumption that ALL the breakaway Ukrainians lived in the Donbas.
LOL. Are you claiming they didn't bother to vote? Why would they not vote if they had the opportunity to vote out what you claim are Nazis? Are they stupid? Are they just non existent?
Basically you are claiming that 50% of the country would have welcomed Russia but when Russia invaded they suddenly didn't welcome Russia? You are as deluded as Putin was when it comes to thinking the Ukranians would welcome Russia.
60% of voters not in the breakaway regions voted. Zelenskyy got 73% of the vote. Zelenskyy vote totals were over 40% of the eligible voters not in the break away regions. His opponent didn't even get 15% of the eligible voters.
By the way, why do you think part of Russia should have been allowed to vote in a Ukrainian election? Doesn't that seem a bit odd to you? Either Crimea is a part of Russia or it is a part of Ukraine. It can't be both.
moon
Satire for Sanity
Electorates frequently boycott elections. What incentive is there to vote when an external agency- the USA- can oust your choice ? America is a democracy-killer.
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Crimea was because Putin wanted it, and saw the opportunity, whatever technical or quasilegal excuse you can come up with is just RT rationalizations, it was on Putin's radar for a long time
And Putin has been working to pass off the Ukraine as a corrupt incompetent country for a long time, even had Trump convinced, why do you think the Nazism stereotyping is part of his crusade