Question for the mask experts

[Walt]

Hand sanitizer is meant for when soap/water is not available.

Many times that is how it is used, but it uses a different mechanism, so has different strengths and weaknesses. Hand sanitizer kills bacteria and viruses. Soap and water removes bacteria, viruses, and whatever grime. Soap and water is often better, because it removes the grime that bacteria can live on. For viruses, that is less important, because viruses cannot live on anything but living cells. Hand sanitizer is better at getting rid of viruses.

In general, it is best to use multiple methods. So you wash your hands often, and use hand sanitizer often, that is the best method.

I'm not giving COVID to everyone else in the office; I do not have COVID. I cannot spread a disease that I do not have.

Thats what all the super-spreaders say.

Have you forgotten that we've gotten by just fine without wearing a mask everywhere, without excessively washing/sanitizing our hands and our surroundings, etc. because our immune systems did what immune systems do?

Our immune system is a work in progress. Civilization has advanced quicker than our immune system, which means that disease hardily bitch slaps us every couple of generations. There are two possible solutions, either allow major chunks of our population to die, or out think the diseases with technology.

 

[Walt]

Your choice. You are willing to work for such a paranoid employer.

Yes, it is my choice to work for a client which you call paranoid. It is your, and Eric's choice not to be willing to work.

You don't make $500 an hour.

I am doing better than just that. I am getting paid $500 an hour with NO OVERHEAD. Most people charging $500 an hour have a huge amount of overhead, so they might only see $100 an hour.

And if some of my other ventures are successful, I might be raising my rates.

Masks do not stop a virus.

Masks not only stop the virus, but they also keep people employed. Have fun on the soup line.

They don't have to [follow government guidelines].

If you don't follow government guidelines, you cannot connect to the securities clearing houses, you cannot get insurance, you cannot accept investments, etc. I am not a lawyer, so I cannot list all the things you cannot do if you ignore government guidelines, but I know it is extensive.

I keep coming back to this. You can work within the system, and be successful... OR... You can rebel against the system, and be frozen out. Night wants to make this about masks, which I think are useful, but lets make this about clear backpacks. I think the rule about clear backpacks is useless, and stupid. I follow it because I want to make money and be successful, not because I agree with the policy. Even if I disagreed with the policy on masks, I would still follow it to be successful.

 

[Walt]

If the experts were right we all should have been dead by now. The experts predicted that by 2020 it would be over. Done. Finished.

I have never heard any expert predict we would all be dead by 2020. I think Teflon might be confusing his fellow mental patients with experts.

 

[Darth Omar]

I have never heard any expert predict we would all be dead by 2020. I think Teflon might be confusing his fellow mental patients with experts.

Well, you have to admit the experts have been all over the lot lol.

Why are my coworkers [well, ex] required to wear N95’s during surgery now? The regular masks don’t work?

Help me to understand this.

 

[Into the Night]

How do you know you don't have COVID-19? I tested positive for it a while ago but never had symptoms. It eventually left my system.

First, tests CAN indicate a false positive.
Second, no symptoms, not contagious.

Masks do not stop a virus.
6 feet does not stop a virus.
Plastic barriers do not stop a virus.

 

[Into the Night]

How do you know you don’t still have it?

How many people did you infect?

And how could you have no symptoms? It kills everyone. Deadliest virus in the history of viruses

Covid19 has killed no one. It can induce pneumonia, which can kill, but the virus itself does not kill.

Pneumonia can be treated with aggressive antibiotics, especially if caught early.

 

[Into the Night]

Neither of us is a climate scientist, but unlike you, I'm intelligent enough to defer to those who are. An actual scientist explained CO2 accumulation to me thusly:

Suppose you have a bathtub. Every minute, you add one drop of water. Every minute, you also drain one drop of water. What happens? The water stays at the same level.

Suppose you increase the amount of water you add every minute. Instead of adding one drop per minute, you 1.1 drops per minute.

What happens now?

Eventually, that bathtub will be overflowing. It won't happen overnight, but it will happen.

This is what we're doing to the planet with our CO2 emissions. Yes, CO2 exists naturally on planet Earth, and yes, nature has methods of recycling it, but prior to the industrial revolution, there was equilibrium. We're adding that extra 0.1 to each drop of water in the bathtub, so to speak, and it's heating the planet.

You are denying the Stefan-Boltzmann law. Any body, including the Earth, radiates more if it gets warmer.
CO2 has not capability to add energy to the Earth. No gas or vapor has the capability to warm the Earth.

 

[Into the Night]

That’s a variation of the slowly boiling frog thing lol.

There are just too many variables to do anything more than make guesses at future states of the climate.

And we learned a thing or two about computer models in 2020, haven’t we.

Guessing about the future state of the weather is the equivalent of using Holy Entrails to guess about the future.
Climate does not change. A desert climate is still a desert climate. A marine climate is still a marine climate. There is no global climate. Earth is made up of many climates.

 

[Into the Night]

We're the big variable here. You don't think that our species' CO2 emissions have any effect?

None.

No gas or vapor has the capability to warm the Earth.

 

[Into the Night]

Appeal to authority? It's not a fallacy in this instance. If you're sick with bloody diarrhea, are you going to self-diagnose, or will you go to the doctor?

'Expert' worship. Science is not a credential. It is not a license. It is not a doctor. It is not a scientist. It is not people at all. It is just a set of falsifiable theories. Non-sequitur fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

Plants seem to like it lol?

Quite true. Indeed, it's necessary for plant life. Plants combine carbon dioxide, water, and sunlight to produce carbohydrates, or food for the plant (and us!).

 

[Into the Night]

The EU is opening up, and allowing people from Canada to travel to the EU, as long as they have not been to the USA recently. Mexico is closing its border with the USA trying to stem the constant flow of Covid-19 from the USA. The USA is the biggest source of Covid-19 currently.

AND NOTHING IS BEING DONE ABOUT IT!!!

It is not a source of Covid19. The virus came from China.

 

[Into the Night]

Condoms actually do stop HIV transmission.

Most of the time, sometimes, they don't.

Let me guess, you don't believe smoking causes cancer?

It doesn't. There have been people 99 years old that have smoked most of their lives, having never caught a case of cancer.
That said, smoking can cause lung damage.

There really is no way for any of us to know... Even you.

Yes there is. The theory that smoking causes cancer has been falsified.

Given that you have a distorted view of how to stop the transmission, I would not trust any of your claims.

If you are not showing any symptoms of Covid, you are not contagious.
Masks do not stop a virus.
6 feet does not stop a virus.
Plastic barriers do not stop a virus.
Testing is not a cure and does not prevent a virus.

The virus is airborne. It's everywhere. It's on every surface.
It is the immune system that destroys a virus. It is UV light that destroys a virus.

 

[Into the Night]

Many times that is how it is used, but it uses a different mechanism, so has different strengths and weaknesses. Hand sanitizer kills bacteria and viruses. Soap and water removes bacteria, viruses, and whatever grime. Soap and water is often better, because it removes the grime that bacteria can live on. For viruses, that is less important, because viruses cannot live on anything but living cells. Hand sanitizer is better at getting rid of viruses.

If you have washed your hands properly, sanitizer is superfluous.

In general, it is best to use multiple methods. So you wash your hands often, and use hand sanitizer often, that is the best method.

If you have washed your hands properly, sanitizer is superfluous.

Thats what all the super-spreaders say.

You don't get to speak for everyone. You only get to speak for you. It is not possible to spread a virus from someone that is not infected. In the case of Covid19, no symptoms, no vector for spreading the virus. The virus is everywhere in the air anyway. You don't need an infected person to catch Covid19.

Masks do not stop a virus.
6 feet does not stop a virus.
Plastic barriers do not stop a virus.
Treating people like they have a case of leprosy regardless of their health is just bigotry.

Our immune system is a work in progress.

It has to be. It works pretty damn well too.

Civilization has advanced quicker than our immune system,

Non-sequitur fallacy.

which means that disease hardily bitch slaps us every couple of generations.

Covid19 has infected approx. 0.1% of the population, and only 0.06% of the population has died from Covid19 related causes. That's hardly a 'bitch slap'. Fear mongering.

There are two possible solutions, either allow major chunks of our population to die,

Only 0.06% of the population has died from Covid19 related causes. That is not a 'major chunk' of the population. Fear mongering.

or out think the diseases with technology.

Masks do not stop viruses. See the N95 specifications. That is the technology you are depending on, treating it like some kind of luck medallion.

 

[Into the Night]

Yes, it is my choice to work for a client which you call paranoid.

Fine. We agree on that.

It is your, and Eric's choice not to be willing to work.

False dichotomy fallacy.

I am doing better than just that. I am getting paid $500 an hour with NO OVERHEAD. Most people charging $500 an hour have a huge amount of overhead, so they might only see $100 an hour.

I don't believe you.

And if some of my other ventures are successful, I might be raising my rates.

I don't believe you.

Masks not only stop the virus, but they also keep people employed.

False dichotomy fallacy. Non-sequitur fallacy. Masks do not stop a virus. Their use does not stop someone from being employed or making money.

Have fun on the soup line.

I am not on the soup line, and I do not bother with a mask unless I'm sanding, painting, or working in dusty areas.

If you don't follow government guidelines, you cannot connect to the securities clearing houses,

Compositional error fallacy. Not wearing a mask does not prevent someone connecting with a securities clearing house.

you cannot get insurance,

Compositional error fallacy. Not wearing a mask does not prevent someone from obtaining insurance.

you cannot accept investments,

Compositional error fallacy. Not wearing a mask does not prevent someone from accepting an investment from someone else.

I am not a lawyer,

Obviously.

so I cannot list all the things you cannot do if you ignore government guidelines, but I know it is extensive.

Compositional error fallacy. One government policy (which is unconstitutional) is not all government policies.

I keep coming back to this.

You keep making the same fallacies when you do. Argument by repetition fallacy.

You can work within the system, and be successful... OR... You can rebel against the system, and be frozen out.

Compositional error fallacy. False dichotomy fallacy. Argument by repetition fallacy. Non-sequitur fallacy.

Night wants to make this about masks,

No, YOU want to make this about masks.

which I think are useful,

They are not useful to stop a virus. Masks do not stop a virus.

but lets make this about clear backpacks.
I think the rule about clear backpacks is useless, and stupid.

Strawman fallacy.

I follow it because I want to make money and be successful, not because I agree with the policy.

You agree with the policy, liar.

Even if I disagreed with the policy on masks, I would still follow it to be successful.

Which means you not only agree with the policy, you somehow connect it with 'being successful', which has nothing to do with it.

 

[Into the Night]

I have never heard any expert predict we would all be dead by 2020. I think Teflon might be confusing his fellow mental patients with experts.

Clearly you haven't been listening to the 'experts' in the 70's or 80's.

 

[Into the Night]

Well, you have to admit the experts have been all over the lot lol.

Why are my coworkers [well, ex] required to wear N95’s during surgery now? The regular masks don’t work?

Help me to understand this.

An N95 mask does not stop a virus, so wearing them to protect yourself from viruses or even bacteria during surgery is rather pointless.

A regular N95 mask is a dust mask. They are white.
A surgical N95 mask is also a dust mask but has been packaged in sterile packaging. They are usually green or blue to denote the difference by color.

They do help keep a surgeon's face clean during surgery, which of course can be a messy business; and can help in keeping a surgeon's saliva from entering the wound, which would actually begin digestion of the patients tissues. If a surgeon is sick, he is not operating on patients.

The best way to protect a patient is of course the use of sterile instruments and equipment, and to wear the gowns an gloves to keep dirt out of the wound, and to keep bacteria on the hands from getting into the wound.
After that, the patient's own immune system and antibiotics keep any infections that do result from surgery at bay.

 

[Darth Omar]

An N95 mask does not stop a virus, so wearing them to protect yourself from viruses or even bacteria during surgery is rather pointless.

A regular N95 mask is a dust mask. They are white.
A surgical N95 mask is also a dust mask but has been packaged in sterile packaging. They are usually green or blue to denote the difference by color.

They do help keep a surgeon's face clean during surgery, which of course can be a messy business; and can help in keeping a surgeon's saliva from entering the wound, which would actually begin digestion of the patients tissues. If a surgeon is sick, he is not operating on patients.

The best way to protect a patient is of course the use of sterile instruments and equipment, and to wear the gowns an gloves to keep dirt out of the wound, and to keep bacteria on the hands from getting into the wound.
After that, the patient's own immune system and antibiotics keep any infections that do result from surgery at bay.

Surgical masks aren’t packaged sterile but carry on lol.

 

[TexanManWithPlans]

First, tests CAN indicate a false positive.
Second, no symptoms, not contagious.

Masks do not stop a virus.
6 feet does not stop a virus.
Plastic barriers do not stop a virus.

Just stop with your disinformation.

 

[TexanManWithPlans]

You are denying the Stefan-Boltzmann law. Any body, including the Earth, radiates more if it gets warmer.
CO2 has not capability to add energy to the Earth. No gas or vapor has the capability to warm the Earth.

Lol.