Pathetic Pelosi... just PATHETIC....

I’m always astounded as to the extent of deception in which pro-choice Catholics indulge themselves, both inwardly and outwardly, to justify their positions. Perhaps there is no balder example of this than Nancy Pelosi attempting to spin the Catholic doctrine on human life today on Meet the Press. Pelosi argues that the Catholic position on human life only developed in the last 50 years and that it doesn’t impact abortion in any case:

Here's a web site http://www.hopeclinic.com/AbortionHistory.htm on the history of abortion.

A few highlights.

4th Century AD –St.Augustine lays down Catholic dogma sanctioning abortion up to 80 days for female fetus and up to 40 days for male fetus.

1588 – Pope Sixtus forbids all abortions.

1591 – Pope Gregory XIV rescinds Pope Sixtus’ edict against abortion.

This one is my favorite. 1869 – Pope Pius IX forbids all abortions in exchange for France’s Napoleon III acknowledging papal infallibility. France’s population experienced a sharp decrease over the previous 60 years.

Now there's a deal made in Heaven, huh? "You tell the French women they have to bear children and I will tell the world you can't make a mistake." :chesh:
 
Actually, I've already conceded that they've done wrong. But I haven't seen where Pelosi is a liar. The hypocrisy charge I can understand since I sympathize with that view, but I don't see that Pelosi is a liar.

And falling back on the idea that because columnists also dislike Pelosi as a measure of whether she is lying is really weak. If she lied it shouldn't be too difficult to point it out.

As for the CIA, I've already documented why there is plenty of reason to discount what the CIA is saying happened at these meetings, not least of which is the fact that the CIA itself isn't vouching for the information.

Former Senator Bob Graham said on C-Span that the CIA had him on record as being at four CIA briefings regarding prisoner treatment. It turns out he was at only one low level briefing at which waterboarding was not discussed. Not only is the CIA capable of making "mistakes", as was the b**h Justice Dept., it is also capable of playing politics. In this case, they chose to make the "mistake" with the wrong man. Graham is well known for keeping a meticulous diary. He can tell the CIA what he had for lunch on those days in the "mistaken" records. Isn't it strange that it is mostly Republicans opposing any waterboarding investigation except for their assumed hypocrisy of Pelosi? To them, a complete investigation on the matter in its entirety is looking fruitlessly into the past. (We're not allowed to mention the names of those 2 guys at the top before this year, just 120 days ago, any more.)
Can we say the ever-vocal Mr Gingrich cannot speak with much veracity when it comes to hypocrisy and throw in the RW gurus they are parrotting right down to the oh, so important botox "issue".
 
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Of course, there is also this:

Dear Director Panetta:

In light of current controversy about CIA briefing practices, I was surprised to learn that the agency erroneously listed an appropriations staffer as being in a key briefing on September 19, 2006, when in fact he was not. The list the agency released entitled "Member Briefings on Enhanced Interrogation Techniques (EITs)", shows that House Appropriations Committee defense appropriations staffer Paul Juola was in that briefing on that date. In fact, Mr. Juola recollects that he walked members to the briefing room, met General Hayden and Mr.Walker, who were the briefers, and was told that he could not attend the briefing. We request that you immediately correct this record.

Sincerely,

David R. Obey

To which the CIA responded thusly:

While CIA's information has Mr. Juola attending briefings on September 19, 2006 and October 11, 2007, there are different recollections of these events, which Mr. Obey's letter describes. As the agency has pointed out more than once, its list -- compiled in response to congressional requests -- reflects the records it has. These are notes, memos, and recollections, not transcripts and recordings.


But Pelosi is a liar because the CIA said so!



http://washingtonindependent.com/43...g-accounts-are-not-transcripts-and-recordings
 
My guess is that the "mistakes" in the CIA records are yet one more way those 2 guys at the top (I'm not allowed to use their names) used to cover their asses in case anybody became inquisitive about who was responsible for the US using torture.
 
Theresmoreville:

The ranking Republican on the House Intelligence Committee, Rep. Pete Hoekstra (R-Mich.), is asking the Obama Administration to declassify Central Intelligence Agency records which describe details of briefings members of Congress received about aggressive interrogation techniques approved by President George W. Bush.

In a letter sent Friday to Director of National Intelligence Dennis Blair and CIA Director Leon Panetta, Hoekstra said he looked at the “memoranda for the record” on Thursday at CIA headquarters. He said he thinks those records should be made public “as soon as possible,” albeit in edited form. However, he also indicated twice in the letter that the CIA’s records of briefings are incomplete.

“Our records suggest there may have been a few additional briefings,” Hoekstra wrote in the letter released by his office on Monday. “However, my personal review of the Memoranda for the Record has only reinforced my view that those documents provide the best record of briefings that were memorialized with such records.”

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) has found herself as the center of a dispute over whether she was told in 2002 about the use of waterboarding, as a public CIA summary of its files states, or whether, as she claims, she was simply advised that the method had been ruled legal.

There now appear to be several factual disputes about the briefing records, with Pelosi, Hoekstra, and former senator Bob Graham, all asserting that the summary of 40 briefings which agency officials sent to the Hill recently was incomplete and/or inaccurate.


Now it's Hoekstra!

http://www.politico.com/blogs/joshg...ease_CIA_briefing_docs_though_incomplete.html

(Actually, Hoekstra said that the CIA lied to Congress quite a while ago about a different issue - the downing of a plane carrying an American missinoary and her child in Peru by the Peruvian government after the CIA identified the plane as part of a smuggling operation, but I digress).
 
Central Intelligence Agency Director Leon Panetta didn't reject or deny House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's allegations that she was falsely briefed by the CIA about interrogations.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/joshge..._heresies.html

To paraphrase Judge Marilyn on this, I wouldn't trust the CIA and Panetta if his tongue came notarized.

Rep. David Obey sent a letter to CIA Director Leon Panetta on Tuesday saying that "in light of current controversy about CIA briefing practices," he was "surprised to learn that the agency erroneously listed an appropriations staffer as being in a key briefing on September 19, 2006, when in fact he was not."
<snip>
The letter makes Obey the fourth Democrat to allege that the CIA's record of which members of Congress were briefed on the Bush administration's enhanced interrogation techniques contained factual errors. Former Sen. Bob Graham, in an interview with the Huffington Post, noted that the agency's records initially had him being briefed four times in 2002 about the interrogation techniques. Upon contacting officials with the CIA, it was determined that he had only attended one such briefing. Similarly, Sen. Jay Rockefeller has said that the records kept by the agency and made public on May 7 contained errors in regards to his briefings.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/19/another-democrat-says-cia_n_205173.html
 
Here's a web site http://www.hopeclinic.com/AbortionHistory.htm on the history of abortion.

A few highlights.

4th Century AD –St.Augustine lays down Catholic dogma sanctioning abortion up to 80 days for female fetus and up to 40 days for male fetus.

1588 – Pope Sixtus forbids all abortions.

1591 – Pope Gregory XIV rescinds Pope Sixtus’ edict against abortion.

This one is my favorite. 1869 – Pope Pius IX forbids all abortions in exchange for France’s Napoleon III acknowledging papal infallibility. France’s population experienced a sharp decrease over the previous 60 years.

Now there's a deal made in Heaven, huh? "You tell the French women they have to bear children and I will tell the world you can't make a mistake." :chesh:

Abortion existed in biblical times yet no specific mention of it in the bible?
 
Abortion existed in biblical times yet no specific mention of it in the bible?

Sure it is. It is in the 10 commandments.....and covered in the NT as well...."Thou shalt not kill".......more aptly translated, "You shall do no murder."
 
Theresmoreville:

WASHINGTON (AP) — New questions surfaced Wednesday about the accuracy of a CIA document meant to settle who in Congress knew about severe interrogation methods approved by the Bush administration.

Three new errors appeared to emerge in the CIA's matrix of 40 congressional briefings on so-called enhanced interrogation techniques. Those techniques include waterboarding, a form of simulated drowning, which President Barack Obama has called torture.

The CIA acknowledged one of the errors but continued to stand by its version of events in the other two cases.

The briefing chart, widely leaked to the news media two weeks ago, was compiled by the CIA at the request of members of Congress after House Speaker Nancy Pelosi claimed in April that the CIA failed to tell her at a September 2002 briefing that waterboarding had been used against a prisoner.

That briefing occurred within weeks of the waterboarding of terrorist suspect Abu Zubaydah. He was subjected to the procedure at least 83 times.

Pelosi has been a frequent target of criticism from Republicans who are eager to argue that Democrats knew about waterboarding and did little to stop it.

The CIA chart states that a Senate staffer, Chris Mellon, attended a briefing on July 15, 2004. However, Mellon told The Associated Press that he left the Senate in April 2004 and did not attend the briefing.

On Wednesday, CIA spokesman George Little said the CIA has reviewed its record and agrees that Mellon was erroneously listed as having attended the 2004 briefing.

"The briefing chart was prepared in response to requests from Congress," Little said. "The agency compiled it in good faith after reviewing our records from 2002 to 2009. We didn't release it publicly, nor have we hyped it, and we have been candid in describing it."

The CIA matrix also reported that Sen. Jay Rockefeller, D-W.Va., then the top Democrat on the Senate Intelligence Committee, was briefed on Feb. 4, 2003. But it notes that Rockefeller received a "later individual briefing."

Rockefeller spokeswoman Jamie Smith said Wednesday that the senator was not briefed on the CIA interrogation program until Sept. 4, 2003.


Little said that "on the Rockefeller briefing, the chart plainly indicates that he wasn't there and was to be briefed individually later. That's in fact what our records show. The chart makes no claim as to if or when that briefing occurred."

The CIA chart also shows former House Intelligence Committee Chairman Porter Goss attended a March 8, 2005, briefing as a member of Congress. However, Goss was at that time the director of the CIA. He took that job in November 2004.

"On the March 8, 2005, briefing, we were true to the records," Little said. "Although Mr. Goss was CIA director at that time, the underlying records list him as chairman of the House Intelligence Committee. There's a record of an earlier briefing that lists Rep. (Pete) Hoekstra as chairman."

On Tuesday, House Appropriations Chairman Rep. David Obey, D-Wis., said that one of his committee staff members was erroneously listed as attending a briefing in September 2006. The CIA stands by its record on that count.

Obey's spokeswoman, Kirstin Brost, said the CIA was wrong.


"Our records are clear. Our records are detailed. They are mistaken," she said.

The CIA cobbled together the chart from notes, memo and recollections because transcripts of the meetings were not kept. It was sent to Capitol Hill on May 6.

CIA Director Leon Panetta acknowledged in a May 6 letter to House Intelligence Committee Chairman Silvestre Reyes, D-Texas, that the CIA's list may not be completely accurate.

"In the end, you and the committee will have to determine whether this information is an accurate summary of what actually happened," Panetta wrote.


But Pelosi is a liar because the CIA said so!


Aside: Anyone find it ironic that Pelosi is being chastized for saying that the CIA misled Congress when the document the CIA provided to Congress to proves Pelosi is wrong is misleading in and of itself?



http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5isN9N6DPyXoLKEO3ZwDWENLrOMVQD98A98500
 
Sure it is. It is in the 10 commandments.....and covered in the NT as well...."Thou shalt not kill".......more aptly translated, "You shall do no murder."

Just like you justify war as not breaking the commandment.... Others justify abortion as not breaking the commandment....
 
Theresmoreville:




But Pelosi is a liar because the CIA said so!


Aside: Anyone find it ironic that Pelosi is being chastized for saying that the CIA misled Congress when the document the CIA provided to Congress to proves Pelosi is wrong is misleading in and of itself?



http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5isN9N6DPyXoLKEO3ZwDWENLrOMVQD98A98500


Notice you will get no response. They just go for the headline then run from the facts. At least they got the headline out!
 
This is comical. Really the best the republicans have is Pelosi knew illegal torture was going on. Holly fucking shit, how are they going to stop cap and shceme!!!
 
This is comical. Really the best the republicans have is Pelosi knew illegal torture was going on. Holly fucking shit, how are they going to stop cap and shceme!!!

They are trying to make a scandal that our gal, (no evidence of that by the way) , knew there guys were doing illegal stuff.
 
Nope, I am against abortion, but for allowing others to make the decision for themselves.

That you think you own some intellectually higher ground by stating this is why I am able to say pro abortionists are logically inconsistant. To claim you are anti abortion but all for allowing others to do so, makes you pro abortion. Why are you "persoanlly" opposed to abortion?

Abortion kills human beings. Science today leaves no room to dispute this. The tri-mester strawman invented for Roe VS Wade would not hold water today if this were being tried before SCOTUS.
 
Why not a Truth Commission?

Because neither party nor the American people have the stomach for truth.

Cheney is on the tube right now selectively giving information while the disgraced Newt is calling for Pelosi's head.

Why not a Truth Commission?

Because too much may leak out about the TRUTH of 9/11.
 
Notice you will get no response. They just go for the headline then run from the facts. At least they got the headline out!

That is more likely due to the fact that we covered this the first time he posted it. I stated long ago that Pelosi misleading (which when Bush did it was called a LIE) the press about when she found out about waterboarding is the issue. Not whether she was lying about what the CIA briefed her on. Go back and look at the thread, I stated long ago that the 2002 briefing she attended is a he said/she said situation.

But when the press asked her if she knew about the waterboarding long ago, she stated 'I was not briefed on waterboarding' only to find out that her aide was briefed in early 2003 and that she was told of it at that point. She has since admitted to knowing about it in 2003. She deliberately misled the press with her initial comments. She tried to make it appear that she had not known.
 
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