Ok, I just read the indictment. Here's what I learned: Trump is f.*****

Joe Capitalist said:
What Terry is saying it's wrong. The President is NOT the ultimate person having authority over ANY classified document.

I worked at the Pentagon in the 80s and held a top secret SI/TK clearance. The theory in government is the President can only be president for eight years but top secret information goes on forever. There are things that the POTUS is not privy to. He does not have a 'need to know' so he doesn't. And to have one person have 'ultimate authority' over documents he he's no knowledge or understanding of would be quite ridiculous. TA is either a flaming liar or a gullible idiot.
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You are full of shit. EO 13526 makes it absolutely clear that the President as Commander in Chief of the military is the ultimate authority on anything classified. I call your claim above, a bullshit lie. I doubt you've ever filled out the five year security clearance background check form, let alone had one.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
It's simple. A lot of the charges hinge around his possession of the documents. Those are problematic because Trump was president at the time he acquired them. I pointed out the reason earlier EO 13526. He could declassify those documents on a whim. Again, not all the charges have to do with that, but the ones that do are going to be very hard to make a case for.
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You do not understand what you read and you should stop talking about it.


It is correct Trump COULD choose to declassify almost anything the government classified. But that 'COULD' is subject to a process. He 'CAN' do it as long as he follows the process.


What that means is no authority could stop him doing it and going thru the process, should a POTUS choose to.

What the 'COULD' does NOT mean, is that anything is automatically classified just because he could have done it. Trumps own white house on three precedent cases proved that to be true.


It is like saying you 'could' go to the store. That does not mean you did it. It means you have the power to but there are things you must do (get up, walk, get there) to make it happen.


You need to stay out topics where adults speak as you are one of the more ignorant posters on these topics.
 
Joe Capitalist said:
Trump lost the popular vote in 2016. He lost both the popular vote and electoral vote in 2020.
Now, with J6 and all of Trump's indictments still fresh in Americans minds, there's no fucking way he'll find enough votes to pull out a win.
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unless you nominate Biden.....there is no way he can get those 45,000 people to vote for him twice....
 
PostmodernProphet said:
fuckwit......we've been telling you that for seven years.......you're just too stupid to listen......
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I am speaking of the 37 counts against him now. Not your fucking 7 year old wet panties. Not a single politician has said he is innocent of any charges, so your personal shit is meaningless.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
I think it's wrong in all cases, and everyone who does it needs to be charged. What's happening with Trump is the system is singling him out because the system hates him.
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You say one thing then do exactly as I pointed out; defend Trump's crimes because lesser people got away with some violations.

The fact you think Trump's actions are equal to Biden's, Clinton's and Pence's is partial proof of your bias.
 
Doc Dutch said:
You say one thing then do exactly as I pointed out; defend Trump's crimes because lesser people got away with some violations.

The fact you think Trump's actions are equal to Biden's, Clinton's and Pence's is partial proof of your bias.
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This is simply a no true Scotsman fallacy. Essentially, what you do is say that the other's actions aren't exactly the same as Trump's and then dismiss them as irrelevant. Having classified documents, in any amount at any level of classification, that are not properly secured and handled is sufficient for a charge to be put forward. All four should be indicted for mishandling classified information just as that officer I gave as an example was.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
This is simply a no true Scotsman fallacy. Essentially, what you do is say that the other's actions aren't exactly the same as Trump's and then dismiss them as irrelevant. Having classified documents, in any amount at any level of classification, that are not properly secured and handled is sufficient for a charge to be put forward.

All four should be indicted for mishandling classified information just as that officer I gave as an example was.
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Bullshit. What I'm saying is that our government seems to be a little loose with their classified material as proved by both Biden and Pence. What Hillary did was intentional, but she didn't even get a wrist slap. What Trump did was not only intentional, but far worse since he was giving the information to unauthorized people and endangering national security.

Agreed but only fools think the penalties should be the same. Balance General Petraeus's punishment for an example.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
I'm not blinded by "partisanship." I'm being realistic about this based on having a security clearance for nearly 30 years. Every five years I have to fill out a form about 20 pages long detailing my life and then be interviewed to keep that clearance. I had to go to training annually on what's required when you have a security clearance.

You, and virtually everyone else here, are commenting on what you do not know or understand. I keep pointing out Hillary. What she did with that e-mail server was so obviously, egregiously, maliciously, and deliberately done that it should have been a slam dunk to put her in prison for it for 20+ years. She was a worst case scenario. She makes Trump look like an amateur.

Biden and Pence were just oblivious and stupid. They too deserve a smackdown to keep the system honest. If some poor enlisted schmuck in the military would get convicted for it, our leaders should too. But normally, they slide while only the little guy gets slammed.

Trump was stupid for his handling of this start to finish. But singling him out as a severe punitive example is wrong. If you can't charge everyone who does this shit, then don't start charging only the people you hate for it. That's what I see with Trump.
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Frankly, Scarlett, I don't give a damn about your clearance, or your excuses for what #TRE45ON did. YeahButHillary and YeahButBidenPence have no relationship at all to what Trump did and what he is charged with. The fact that you keep bringing Hillary up screams partisan bias, and you know it. You just do not want to acknowledge that your #MaliciousMango is in well-deserved and self-inflicted deep, deep shit.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
I think it's wrong in all cases, and everyone who does it needs to be charged. What's happening with Trump is the system is singling him out because the system hates him.
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Why weren't Biden, Clinton, and Pence charged? Because they did not seek to hide documents from the government. They did not ignore first requests and then a subpoena to return them. They did not order underlings to hide them. They did not instruct their attorneys to say "Yes, everything has been returned" when it wasn't. They did not flaunt the documents in order to show off. They did not claim that the documents had been declassified when they were not.

You say you hold a TS clearance. If YOU had possession of a classified document and took it to a party and showed it off to others, YOU would have been rotting in prison long before now. Why do you think some ignorant and corrupt former IMPOTUSx2 should be above the law and treated better than YOU would have been? This isn't a monarchy or a dictatorship where laws don't apply to the would-be king. Trump is now a private citizen, just like you and I.
 
I feel like it’s ridiculous to even bring up the Pence Clinton Biden situation in the same breath, as what Trump did, the hypocrisy is astounding.

Donald Trump purposely took military documents, he used these military documents, he showed these military documents to people, and he refused to return them when politely asked. Then Donald Trump hid them, so that they would not be returned in a subpoena, and finally he lied to the government about the existence of the documents.

There is a hugely strong case against him for intentionally doing these things. His only hope is to win the presidency again so that he can shut down the case against him.
 
floridafan said:
We still await the 2 additional indictments against Donald. He has earned and deserved everyone of them.
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I do not know what is going to happen with January 6, but I feel pretty sure the Georgia case will result in an indictment.
 
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