Isreal Learned of the Attack a Year Ago

[Althea]

I personally hate this type of hindsight expertise. I see not an ounce of "bombshell" in reports like this.

This is for the benefit of Bibi. He's the cancer that Israel can't seem to excise. They want him gone. He was well on his way to taking over the courts that are about to judge him for a variety of fraud charges. Then this happened.
Just as Biden gets bashed no matter what he says on the war, the regurgitating of this report is aimed at coming after Netanyahu when the war is over. Which is why it might never be 'over'.

Yes, if a thing ends up happening, it can look 'obvious to some that others should have known...because look at this evidence

Yup. We had Dubyah's PDB on Aug. 6, 2001. re. 'Bin Laden determined to strike in U.S.. Said brief was pretty accurate in a number of ways. Like Israel, the question was whether success was feasible at the time.

This story will stay alive until they oust Netanyahu.

 

[Guno צְבִי]

This is for the benefit of Bibi. He's the cancer that Israel can't seem to excise. They want him gone. He was well on his way to taking over the courts that are about to judge him for a variety of fraud charges. Then this happened.
Just as Biden gets bashed no matter what he says on the war, the regurgitating of this report is aimed at coming after Netanyahu when the war is over. Which is why it might never be 'over'.

Yup. We had Dubyah's PDB on Aug. 6, 2001. re. 'Bin Laden determined to strike in U.S.. Said brief was pretty accurate in a number of ways. Like Israel, the question was whether success was feasible at the time.

This story will stay alive until they oust Netanyahu.

Bottom line Israelis are united. And after and only after will internal politics take center stage, running up until Oct 7 Likud wasn't too popular

 

[Grokmaster]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html

Did I miss it or has it taken two days for this bombshell to go off here?

"...Hamas followed the blueprint with shocking precision. The document called for a barrage of rockets at the outset of the attack, drones to knock out the security cameras and automated machine guns along the border, and gunmen to pour into Israel en masse in paragliders, on motorcycles and on foot — all of which happened on Oct. 7.

The plan also included details about the location and size of Israeli military forces, communication hubs and other sensitive information, raising questions about how Hamas gathered its intelligence and whether there were leaks inside the Israeli security establishment.

The document circulated widely among Israeli military and intelligence leaders, but experts determined that an attack of that scale and ambition was beyond Hamas’s capabilities, according to documents and officials. It is unclear whether Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu or other top political leaders saw the document, as well...."

So it's Israel's fault that the palestinians are savages. Got it.

 

[martin]

Israel did not know where or when the invasion would happen. Just like with 9/11. The intelligence was not detailed enough to be actionable.

I'm surprised you endorse a preemptive strike.

You're suggesting they should have fled their homes a year ago.

"Just like 9/11" - the unintelligent tendency to think in boxes. Yours isn't by far the only example of it in this thread. The thinness of this thinking shows itself in its dead ends, when the comparisons bear no insights. The box is the beginning and the end.

 

[Phyllis Diller]

The box is the beginning and the end.

 

[Althea]

Bottom line Israelis are united. And after and only after will internal politics take center stage, running up until Oct 7 Likud wasn't too popular

Yup. Which is why Bibi is going to drag this out as long as he can.

 

[Bigdog]

Apparently your poor intelligence prevents you from realizing that if the reporting is accurate the government could have but chose not to reposition at least a small existing force to the area in the belief Hamas lacked the ability to stage such an attack. Or else the government anticipated such an attack plausibly happening but felt helpless to do anything about it which does not sound much like Bibi.

Typical socialist, believes gov'ts have unlimited resources.

So weaken other parts of Israel's border by moving troops and have them sit somewhere on the Gaza border for ... how many years? You really have no grasp on reality, Martin.

The whole thing could have been a diversion. It's a common military ruse.

 

[Bigdog]

"Just like 9/11" - the unintelligent tendency to think in boxes. Yours isn't by far the only example of it in this thread. The thinness of this thinking shows itself in its dead ends, when the comparisons bear no insights. The box is the beginning and the end.

Are you still hiding from Russian nukes in your bunker, Martin? Because it sounds like you live under a rock.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Bottom line Israelis are united. And after and only after will internal politics take center stage, running up until Oct 7 Likud wasn't too popular

I have no doubt the Israelis are united but don't know enough about Israeli culture and politics to know if they are united behind Bibi's reelection.

 

[Geeko Sportivo]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html

Did I miss it or has it taken two days for this bombshell to go off here?

"...Hamas followed the blueprint with shocking precision. The document called for a barrage of rockets at the outset of the attack, drones to knock out the security cameras and automated machine guns along the border, and gunmen to pour into Israel en masse in paragliders, on motorcycles and on foot — all of which happened on Oct. 7.

The plan also included details about the location and size of Israeli military forces, communication hubs and other sensitive information, raising questions about how Hamas gathered its intelligence and whether there were leaks inside the Israeli security establishment.

The document circulated widely among Israeli military and intelligence leaders, but experts determined that an attack of that scale and ambition was beyond Hamas’s capabilities, according to documents and officials. It is unclear whether Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu or other top political leaders saw the document, as well...."

As this story is very disturbing and telling, it also misses a very serious point.

Why does Israel leave itself so wide open by not having Intelligence embedded into Palestinia?

I'll tell you why! Because after they embed, they quickly become double agents! But no! Israel finds this unacceptable and punishes them when they confess their points of view, instead of finding ways to keep them beneficial and productive.

It's difficult to live with and know Palestinians without understanding and becoming empathetic to their plight! I AM SORRY, but this is the TRUTH!

And keep in mind that the US CIA has many double agents embedded out into the world, and they continue to be beneficial and doing a great service for this country.

Just about every Ambassador we have out there in the world came up through the ranks of the CIA!

But, obviously Israel just can't see the forest for the trees.

Next!

 

[Dutch Uncle]

As this story is very disturbing and telling, it also misses a very serious point.

Why does Israel leave itself so wide open by not having Intelligence embedded into Palestinia?

I'll tell you why! Because after they embed, they quickly become double agents!

It's difficult to live with and know Palestinians without understanding and becoming empathetic to their plight!

And keep in mind that the US CIA has many double agents embedded out into the world, and they continue to be beneficial and are doing a great service for this country.

But, obviously Israel just can't see the forest for the trees.

Next!

Disagreed. More likely, like the US prior to 9/11, complacency by the top leadership is the major factor in why security and intelligence were lacking.

 

[martin]

Are you still hiding from Russian nukes in your bunker, Martin? Because it sounds like you live under a rock.

Sounds like you're complimenting my bunker for being under a rock. Thing is I'm in the light that shines on the simple and what should be obvious truth that Israel is a country, not a national synagogue. It is subject to the same standards expected of other nation states and the same exposure to criticism. Predictably, though, there are comments here, dumb and offensive, that imply Israel is, in fact, a kind of national synagogue.

 

[evince]

No, you don't need to school me, evince. I'm familiar with the history. What is your point?

Ask Richard Clarke


They pushed him away when he REPEATEDLY tried to warn him something was going down



John O’ Neill warned and warned Bush


He was sooooo disturbed he quit and left to take a job at the TWIN TOWERS as top security


He died trying to stop AQs plans



We knew things were going down


The Bush assholes IGNORED THE THREATS!

 

[evince]

As this story is very disturbing and telling, it also misses a very serious point.

Why does Israel leave itself so wide open by not having Intelligence embedded into Palestinia?

I'll tell you why! Because after they embed, they quickly become double agents! But no! Israel finds this unacceptable and punishes them when they confess their points of view, instead of finding ways to keep them beneficial and productive.

It's difficult to live with and know Palestinians without understanding and becoming empathetic to their plight! I AM SORRY, but this is the TRUTH!

And keep in mind that the US CIA has many double agents embedded out into the world, and they continue to be beneficial and doing a great service for this country.

Just about every Ambassador we have out there in the world came up through the ranks of the CIA!

But, obviously Israel just can't see the forest for the trees.

Next!

They only saw the trees they wanted to see

 

[evince]

These 9/11 comparisons are foolish. Bush is said only to have known terrorist hijacks were being planned, not where, but the public was acquainted with terrorist hijacks which had been happening for years. There are so many daily flights, thousands of them, that
air passengers lived with this possible danger every time they took a flight knowing the odds of their plane being targeted were too small to take seriously. This they had done for years and on rare occasions been rudely surprised. The Hamas threat to the small region neighboring its borders was altogether different.

Richard Clarke spoke out today


You are wrong



Why didn't Israel heed the detailed Hamas attack plan it saw a year before the October 7th siege? "The problem here is that the Israelis didn't have a system for dealing with warning," says former White House Counterterrorism Adviser Richard Clarke. As with 9/11, "it wasn't a failure of imagination, it was a failure of management."

 

[evince]

The comparisons were not lost on Clarke


He lived it

 

[Dutch Uncle]

They only saw the trees they wanted to see

As long as "They" are the politicians, the "Deciders", I agree. The military and intelligence agencies do their jobs as professionals.

 

[martin]

Ask Richard Clarke


They pushed him away when he REPEATEDLY tried to warn him something was going down



John O’ Neill warned and warned Bush


He was sooooo disturbed he quit and left to take a job at the TWIN TOWERS as top security


He died trying to stop AQs plans



We knew things were going down


The Bush assholes IGNORED THE THREATS!

Okay, the thing is there are so many differences between 9/11 and this that I think it only confuses things trying to argue parallels or search for lessons. They are just routes down the garden path, obstacles in the way of seeing the present issues on their own terms.

 

[evince]

Okay, the thing is there are so many differences between 9/11 and this that I think it only confuses things trying to argue parallels or search for lessons. They are just routes down the garden path, obstacles in the way of seeing the present issues on their own terms.

They are exactly the same crime against the peoples trust



Richard Clarke agrees

 

[evince]

Disagreed. More likely, like the US prior to 9/11, complacency by the top leadership is the major factor in why security and intelligence were lacking.

The terror experts told us Bush ignored them


Bush told them to stop telling them about the threats


That it was Clinton Crap


It was on purpose