Immigration Bill

[Cancel 2016.2]

stupid is as stupid does.

why is it the right cant ever think things through like adults anymore?


Why is their default setting always set on the idiot setting?

another of desh's hateful diatribes... she has this one on repeat because she thinks she is being clever. In reality, she simply shows her own ignorance yet again.

 

[Cancel 2016.11]

That is pure nonsense. The only idiot is one who would suggest such nonsense.



As are most people. However, the argument that granting amnesty only encourages more people to come here via any means necessary rather than via a legal means is valid. While a revamping of our legal immigration policies (especially the costs involved) would help alleviate the illegal means of entry to a point, it still would encourage the illegal means overall.



No, Visas should be prioritized based on industry needs. Otherwise you end up with people on work visas that are not qualified (or interested) in the jobs that are available.



Only a fool would say that a families needs should mean they get a visa vs. providing visas for jobs that are available.

Oh glaring grammatical error only a few words down from where you called someone a fool! That always happens. That's why I try and be nice.

 

[evince]

How does that solve the problems with SS?

remember how its said that there will be too many collecting and not enough paying in?


More people paying in.

 

[evince]

another of desh's hateful diatribes... she has this one on repeat because she thinks she is being clever. In reality, she simply shows her own ignorance yet again.

they hate science.

they lie about history


they listen to news that LIES on a regular basis to cling to historically failed ideas.

that is a default setting of stupid

 

[Mott the Hoople]

How does that solve the problems with SS?

Well though I think that's hyperbole by Desh, she's refering to that by legitimizing these folks and getting them into the tax rolls would mean about 10 million more people paying into the SS trust fun. Which would certainly extends it's vaibility quite a bit into the future.

 

[evince]

more people of a certain age is good for SS.

it will save this country a lot of money.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Oh glaring grammatical error only a few words down from where you called someone a fool! That always happens. That's why I try and be nice.

yep... did not mean to put the 'a' in there. That said, it is quite comical pretending you try to be nice.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

they hate science.

they lie about history


they listen to news that LIES on a regular basis to cling to historically failed ideas.

that is a default setting of stupid

Yet more of Desh's hateful idiotic ranting.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

That is pure nonsense. The only idiot is one who would suggest such nonsense.



As are most people. However, the argument that granting amnesty only encourages more people to come here via any means necessary rather than via a legal means is valid. While a revamping of our legal immigration policies (especially the costs involved) would help alleviate the illegal means of entry to a point, it still would encourage the illegal means overall.



No, Visas should be prioritized based on industry needs. Otherwise you end up with people on work visas that are not qualified (or interested) in the jobs that are available.



Only a fool would say that a families needs should mean they get a visa vs. providing visas for jobs that are available.

That's complete nonsense. Do you even know any of these people? Have you ever even talked to any of them?

I'm telling right now. There's only one thing that encourages these people to come here. The American dream. That is to be able to make a meaningful and productive life for them and their families. In other words JOBS!!

The current immigration bill does absolutely nothing to deal with that issue and building walls or marginalizing or criminalizing these people are simply monuments to stupidity and short sightedness.

The same rednecked bigots who want to criminalize these people are the same assholes who want to work them for slave wages as migrant workers. Toss some of those assholes in jail and fine the shit out of them and you'll see the flood of immigrants dry up real quick.

As for families vs corporations having visa priorities. There i will have to agree to disagree. But I have a frame of reference you don't. I'm married to an immigrant and my valies unquestionably place family before corporations. You can place you faith and values in corporations before families but I have a sneaky hunch that some day you may regreat that.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Would you feel the same way if it was your family member waiting to enter the country?

But it's not an either/or - we can handle families AND workers.

Yes. I know it is not an either/or, however he stated that the needs of a family should come first. Which is nonsense. Work visas should be made available based on the jobs available. In other words if we need 1000 concrete workers and have 1000 concrete workers wanting to come here, those 1000 should take priority to a 1000 computer techs. It should not be based on what certain families desire. Because quite frankly, whose family would not have the 'need'??? No matter who comes here, it is going to be a benefit to that family... otherwise they would not be trying to come here.

 

[evince]

Yet more of Desh's hateful idiotic ranting.

so you guys don't PRETEND the the bible is better than science?


You don't pretend Reagan didn't raise taxes?


You side doesn't allow Fox to tell them Robmoney is winning by 5 points?


Your side doesn't pretend the market is MAGIC?



your own side is calling you the stupid party

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

remember how its said that there will be too many collecting and not enough paying in?

More people paying in.

Ok... I will agree with that. From the standpoint of SS alone it would benefit, at least to shore up the short term.

 

[evince]

wow your making some mental progress here

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

so you guys don't PRETEND the the bible is better than science?

This is your problem Desh, you take the extreme's position and try to relate it to the party as a whole. That is nonsense and based on nothing other than your hate of Reps.

You don't pretend Reagan didn't raise taxes?

No. I don't. Neither does the party. You confuse people talking about the fact that he lowered the INCOME taxes and pretend that he never raised any other forms of taxation (or closed loopholes).

You side doesn't allow Fox to tell them Robmoney is winning by 5 points?

You need to rethink that one.

Your side doesn't pretend the market is MAGIC?

What the hell are you talking about? Who pretends it is 'magic'???

your own side is calling you the stupid party

No desh, that is the echo in that empty head of yours from the countless times you have spewed forth your hate.

 

[Cancel 2016.11]

wow your making some mental progress here

don't get too excited, he is the King of one step forward two steps back. Mentally I mean.

 

[evince]

bobby Jindal

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

That's complete nonsense. Do you even know any of these people? Have you ever even talked to any of them?

Yes, I do. We have many here in CO. Do you know these people up there in Ohio?

I'm telling right now. There's only one thing that encourages these people to come here. The American dream. That is to be able to make a meaningful and productive life for them and their families. In other words JOBS!!

Yes, jobs is a driving force. But so are the safety nets we have in place.

The current immigration bill does absolutely nothing to deal with that issue and building walls or marginalizing or criminalizing these people are simply monuments to stupidity and short sightedness.

I don't disagree with that. But it doesn't change the nonsense you posted earlier.

The same rednecked bigots who want to criminalize these people are the same assholes who want to work them for slave wages as migrant workers. Toss some of those assholes in jail and fine the shit out of them and you'll see the flood of immigrants dry up real quick.

1) People who enter this country illegally ARE criminals you dolt. They broke our laws of entry.

2) You are speaking about 'slave wages' as if you have a fucking clue. For one, read up on how much slaves were paid... then get back to me. Second, their pay depends on the industry they go into and the skill set involved. Yes, there are those that take advantage of their illegal status. But many others do not. You just use the hyperbole because you think it makes you seem more 'caring'.

3) Yes, we should indeed fine (first offense) and imprison (multiple offenses) those that hire illegal workers.

As for families vs corporations having visa priorities. There i will have to agree to disagree. But I have a frame of reference you don't. I'm married to an immigrant and my valies unquestionably place family before corporations. You can place you faith and values in corporations before families but I have a sneaky hunch that some day you may regreat that.

Yes, but EVERYONE who wants the visa 'has a family'. It is important to every single one of them. Otherwise they would not be trying to come here. They are ALL trying for a better life for their families.

It has nothing to do with placing faith in corporations. It has to do with what jobs need to be filled.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

wow your making some mental progress here

Nice burn Desh! LOL

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Yes, I do. We have many here in CO. Do you know these people up there in Ohio?



Yes, jobs is a driving force. But so are the safety nets we have in place.



I don't disagree with that. But it doesn't change the nonsense you posted earlier.



1) People who enter this country illegally ARE criminals you dolt. They broke our laws of entry.

2) You are speaking about 'slave wages' as if you have a fucking clue. For one, read up on how much slaves were paid... then get back to me. Second, their pay depends on the industry they go into and the skill set involved. Yes, there are those that take advantage of their illegal status. But many others do not. You just use the hyperbole because you think it makes you seem more 'caring'.

3) Yes, we should indeed fine (first offense) and imprison (multiple offenses) those that hire illegal workers.



Yes, but EVERYONE who wants the visa 'has a family'. It is important to every single one of them. Otherwise they would not be trying to come here. They are ALL trying for a better life for their families.

It has nothing to do with placing faith in corporations. It has to do with what jobs need to be filled.

You're views are extremely short sighted. Not only that you're not dealing with the practicle realities. Criminalizing these people creates far more problems than it solves and this warped sense of just retribution is simply counter productive.

But let me ask you this, since you haven't exactly told us where you stand in the Immigration Bill.

Do you think that some faceless corporations who desperately needs financial analyst/brokers at $30,000/year should have priority over someone like my wife who is both a productive US CITIZEN and an immigrant and who wants to strenthen the bonds of family?

I would argue for family because with there being no question as to the importance of business and commerce in this nation they and corporations are not the basic functional units of our society and civilization. Families are and strong familes are good for business!!!!

Now don't get me wrong. Too many people want to make this a mutually exclusive argument when it does not need to be. I have no problem with prioritizing visa for highly skilled workers, as long as it's not done to undercut our labor standards and as long as it's not done at the expense of families.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

You're views are extremely short sighted. Not only that you're not dealing with the practicle realities. Criminalizing these people creates far more problems than it solves and this warped sense of just retribution is simply counter productive.

Again, I am not suggesting we go round them all up. I was addressing your invalid point that someone was trying to make them criminals. By definition they ARE criminals. They broke the law. You simply continue resorting to this nonsense to try and silence those who disagree with you.

But let me ask you this, since you haven't exactly told us where you stand in the Immigration Bill.

I would not currently vote for it, because like you I think this 1200 pages of nonsense does little to actually help the situation. That said, I do think something needs to be done to correct our immigration policy so that we don't end up with a repeat of this in another 20 years. As for those currently here illegally, my suggestion would be to add them to the work visa program. If they work here and pay taxes for five years with no felonies, then they get citizenship (as do their children/spouses)

Do you think that some faceless corporations who desperately needs financial analyst/brokers at $30,000/year should have priority over someone like my wife who is both a productive US CITIZEN and an immigrant and who wants to strenthen the bonds of family?

Why are you injecting a US citizen into the conversation? We are talking about how to apply work visas... which would have nothing to do with current citizens, but with jobs that are currently available and unfilled by US citizens and how to distribute the work visas among foreigners wishing to come here. Your wife can certainly apply for the job as broker for $30k if she wishes. The companies would prefer US citizens to work visas. But if your wife doesn't wish to work for the $30k, then she has the right to work elsewhere and get the wages she wishes.

I would argue for family because with there being no question as to the importance of business and commerce in this nation they and corporations are not the basic functional units of our society and civilization. Families are and strong familes are good for business!!!!

Again Mutt... NO ONE is suggesting otherwise. But EVERY family who wants the job would say the SAME FUCKING THING.

Now don't get me wrong. Too many people want to make this a mutually exclusive argument when it does not need to be. I have no problem with prioritizing visa for highly skilled workers, as long as it's not done to undercut our labor standards and as long as it's not done at the expense of families.

The above is where you continue to go wrong. Work visas do not undercut our labor standards. Saying 'as long as its not done at the expense of families' is just nonsense. It is going to be good for whatever family gets the job. You continue to hop between who should get the work visas among foreigners to should foreigners get work visas over US citizens if they are willing to work for less. Decide which point you wish to argue. I think your beef is with the latter... not the former. In which case work visas being given to FOREIGNERS who are not citizens... based on jobs is the only way to go. The other argument I think you are making is debatable... should we allow foreign labor to compete here in the US via work visas?