Did Hitler gain power by banning guns?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Guns Guns Guns
  • Start date Start date
G

Guns Guns Guns

Guest



unbranded-bullshit-stamp.jpg







I've seen references to, and bumper stickers stating, that Hitler took all the guns away from law abiding Germans in 1936. The inference is that this led to the disarming of the populace and its fall into a dictatorship. I've read extensively about the Third Reich and have never seen a mention of this. Did he effect total gun control in Germany, or is this a bit of modern fiction to lend weight to the gun-lover crowd?
— John Greenwood, Jacksonville, Florida



The quote you are talking about is something along the lines of the following:
This year will go down in history! For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!
The reference is usually given as a speech by Adolf Hitler--alternatively, some say it was in Mein Kampf, but that is easily checkable and proven false--with citation information as follows (all parenthetical material in the original):
"Abschied vom Hessenland!" ["Farewell to Hessia!"], ['Berlin Daily' (Loose English Translation)], April 15th, 1935, Page 3 Article 2, Einleitung Von Eberhard Beckmann [Introduction by Eberhard Beckmann].
I've seen this quote pop up many times, from political discussions to gun shows, where a friend told me he'd found it emblazoned on signs. I don't think anybody knows the origin of it, but several have tracked it back and found it to be completely false.


The talk.politics.guns FAQ (http://rkba.org/research/rkba.faq), which is pro-gun, includes a number of such false quotes in its "Pious Frauds" section and, to its credit, refutes them. The discussion there is based in large part on research done by Clayton Cramer for his book, Firing Back (currently out of print). Cramer is also a gun supporter, making his work in this area highly credible--and creditable.


The FAQ entry, which is duplicated in the archive of urbanlegends.com (http://www.urbanlegends. com/politics/hitler_gun_control.html), notes the main problems with the supposed quote. First, the quote itself has changed over the years.


Some versions start by saying, "This year will go down in history!" Others say, "1935 will go down in history!" (The former still has a 1935 date attached as a supposed reference.) That, in and of itself, doesn't prove anything, but it's a warning sign.


Another warning sign is the way the citation is generally messed up. The reference date isn't even close to a major public speech by Hitler. Furthermore, the texts of Hitler's various speeches have been checked, and no sign of this quote can be found.


An examination of the Berliner Tageblatt (reasonably close to "Berlin Daily") for the cited date shows that the page referred to was the paper's arts and culture page. There was no reference to a Hitler speech anywhere in the paper that day, or on days close to it.


The name given, Eberhard Beckmann, doesn't seem to correspond to anybody who was in a position to write introductions of this nature. While a person of that name was found, and he did indeed write introductions, said introductions were for photography books and he worked for a German broadcaster after World War II.


OK, so the quote and cite are screwed up. What about the supposed law itself?


Well, as described in the FAQ, 1935 "has no correlation with any legislative effort by the Nazis for gun registration." (Nor, for that matter, does 1936, the year you mention in your question.)


The Nazis did pass a weapons law in 1938, but that only added restrictions to the previous law, especially for Jews and other "non-citizens."


Cramer also told me that since the publication of Firing Back, the quote has morphed again (more indication of it being an urban legend, not reality) and now has a more detailed date and location cite. He asked a friend in Germany to check out this new (mis)information. As we might have expected, the quote was not to be found.


Some gun proponents like this quote because it compares current gun control attempts to those of the Nazis.


But as the pro-gun FAQ cited above freely concedes, "This quotation, however effective it may be as propaganda, is a fraud."


Did gun control, then, pave the way for the Nazi rise to power? If guns had been readily available, would the people have risen against their oppressors?


That seems dubious. The Nazis had a great deal of popular support. Much of their campaign of intimidation involved old-fashioned strongarm tactics, not guns.


Had opponents of the regime been armed, and had there been a tradition of armed resistance in Germany, the Nazis might have had a tougher time of it. But that gets us into a pretty speculative realm.


http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1791/did-hitler-ban-gun-ownership
 
I've nver heard about Hitler GAINING power politically through gun control. The additional prohibitions on minorities is often what's focused on, at least in my experience.
 
the references to hitler removing guns from germany are clearly false, with the exception of the prohibition aimed towards jews and non germans. It's amazing that this crap still sits around and gets quoted by dumbasses.
 
Then I suppose this popular image is nothing but bullshit if it includes Hitler, who himself was a gunlover?


gun-control-works.jpg
 
no, not bullshit. the third reich ensured that those they meant to keep conquered could not re-arm. jews, gypsies, polish, etc.

Can you cite an example of an occupying army allowing civilians in conquered enemy territories to bear arms during wartime?
 
no, which is why your posted image isn't bullshit. those 'experts' agree that it works, by allowing them to kill all they needed/wanted.

Did the US impose gun control on the populaces of Italy, Germany, and Japan during their advance & after occupation in WWII?
 
Did the US impose gun control on the populaces of Italy, Germany, and Japan during their advance & after occupation in WWII?

good question. I can find no citation online to show whether they did or did not. common sense tells me that they would not allow armed civilians until a new government could be set up in that country.
 
good question. I can find no citation online to show whether they did or did not. common sense tells me that they would not allow armed civilians until a new government could be set up in that country.


So Roosevelt and Churchill could conceivably be added to the list of gun-banners?
 
I've nver heard about Hitler GAINING power politically through gun control. The additional prohibitions on minorities is often what's focused on, at least in my experience.

There are many on the "right" who believe that Hitler banned guns after gaining power. He did, but only for the targeted minority groups. It was relatively easy to confiscate weapons from people who were in ghettos, and those who weren't yet were trying desperately to show they were "good citizens" and almost wholesale volunteered their weapons.
 
It was relatively easy to confiscate weapons from people who were in ghettos, and those who weren't yet were trying desperately to show they were "good citizens" and almost wholesale volunteered their weapons.


Got a source for that assertion?
 
Got a source for that assertion?

The 'source' is years of study on WWII with a specific interest in the persecution of Jews in Germany.

On November 11th, 1938 (before the war) Germany passed "Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons" (it's what they called it).

At that time Jews were wearing stars on their shirts, had been kicked out of a list of professions, but Ghettos were not yet there. The Jews that remained in Germany desperately worked to try to maintain a certain level of freedoms that they were doomed to lose over time, to do this they followed the laws in the hopes that "this one" would be the last. When the weapons ban came, almost all weapons were turned over pursuant to the law, and once the "Jewish Houses" were set up it became easier for the authorities to search and seize any weapons that remained.

After the war began (September 1st, 1939) more restrictions came on the Jews that were still in Germany, including restrictions of areas they could go, curfews, restrictions on the time of day they could purchase any food at all, food rationing specific to Jews, they passed regulations forcing Jews to turn over property (radios, electrical appliances, etc.), and forced labor for all Jews who were healthy enough to work.

While "ghettos" as we know them were never in Germany proper, restrictions on the areas they could live, forcing them to move into shared houses called "Judenhauser" or "Jew Houses", and curfew restrictions as well as restrictions to the time of day they could even purchase something, made effective ghettos.
 
Back
Top