Cluster bombs: Unease grows over US sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

The Western myth of Soviet/Russian incompetence running back many decades gets talked about in depth here:


Highly Recommended.
 
This dude says that the American military started going bad way back right at the end of WW2, when the American Military Elites decided that the Germans who they had just beaten knew more about strategy and tactics than they did, and were imported to teach the Americans "new and better" ways.

This was insanity.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
You are again caught listening to the wrong people thus you have no fucking clue what reality looks like.
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Oh, I know what the reality on the ground is. I've played "red" ( the bad guys) at wargames at the Naval War College (got in because I have a degree in computer programming) and stomped on the officers that should know better. I've wargamed for decades and know the systems in use pretty intimately. Hell, I've even built some of the components.

The Ukrainians are as fucked up militarily as the Russians. The Russian way of war is total and to grind you down regardless of casualties. They're doing it this time too. Ukraine can't win and Russia can't lose. It will go on for years until one side gives in because they're simply too tired to continue.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Oh, I know what the reality on the ground is. I've played "red" ( the bad guys) at wargames at the Naval War College (got in because I have a degree in computer programming) and stomped on the officers that should know better. I've wargamed for decades and know the systems in use pretty intimately. Hell, I've even built some of the components.

The Ukrainians are as fucked up militarily as the Russians. The Russian way of war is total and to grind you down regardless of casualties. They're doing it this time too. Ukraine can't win and Russia can't lose. It will go on for years until one side gives in because they're simply too tired to continue.
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The Russians are taking very few casualties, the Ukrainians are however getting slaughtered....because the Russians have gotten very good at this.

You have been lied to.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
The Russians are taking very few casualties, the Ukrainians are however getting slaughtered....because the Russians have gotten very good at this.

You have been lied to.
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I haven't. I recognized that early on. Neither side is particularly competent, but the Russians have the numbers.
 
BidenPresident said:
On Friday, the US confirmed it was sending the controversial weapons to Ukraine, with President Joe Biden calling it a "very difficult decision".

In response, the UK, Canada and Spain all pointed out that they were opposed to the use of the weapons.

Cluster bombs have been banned by more than 100 countries because of the danger they pose to civilians.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-66144153

Bad decision by Biden.
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Yep
 
BidenPresident said:
On Friday, the US confirmed it was sending the controversial weapons to Ukraine, with President Joe Biden calling it a "very difficult decision".

In response, the UK, Canada and Spain all pointed out that they were opposed to the use of the weapons.

Cluster bombs have been banned by more than 100 countries because of the danger they pose to civilians.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-66144153

Bad decision by Biden.
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No, there is a difference between using these weapons offensively in other countries like Russia is doing in the Ukraine and using them in your own country to defend yourself.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
I am increasingly thinking that there is a cease and desist order coming to America from most of the world re our aggression in and destruction of Ukraine.
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No asshole virtually all of our allies are on board with our helping the Ukraine.
 
I had thought that these munitions are about 20 years old but I just heard Scott Ritter say that they were made in the 80's and 90's, and were mothballed in 2016. He said that they are not very good, and that the only reason we are sending them is that we dont have anything else to send, its all gone.
 
BidenPresident said:
On Friday, the US confirmed it was sending the controversial weapons to Ukraine, with President Joe Biden calling it a "very difficult decision".

In response, the UK, Canada and Spain all pointed out that they were opposed to the use of the weapons.

Cluster bombs have been banned by more than 100 countries because of the danger they pose to civilians.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-66144153

Bad decision by Biden.
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Wonder what the left would say if Trump had sent cluster bombs to the Israel Defense Forces vs Hamas
 
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Hawkeye10 said:
I had thought that these munitions are about 20 years old but I just heard Scott Ritter say that they were made in the 80's and 90's, and were mothballed in 2016. He said that they are not very good, and that the only reason we are sending them is that we dont have anything else to send, its all gone.
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I'm sure it's not that difficult to make new ones.

I highly doubt we keep 20 year old munitions stockpiled.
 
Tinkerpeach said:
Well if we do then probably only half of them work anymore

Explosives degrade over time, that’s just science
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We shall see what happens when Ukraine tries to use them. We shall also see what China et al have to say about America doing this....this is not going to good for us long term.
 
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