Can Trump And Putin Destroy The Deep State?

[anatta]

Deep State is the un-elected bureaucrats who run the IC (leadership) for their own agenda whether it dovetails
with an elected POTUS's or not.
Further it's dominated by Russiaphobes, being as that's the nature of it's existence

 

[Amadeus]

NATO doesn't "resist" it expands for no real reason except it could after the collapse of the USSR.
Maybe if we stopped looking at Russia thru mono-polarism where only the west's security concerns are valid
Putin wouldn't need to push back for it's own equally valid security needs.

Putin allows police and mobs of thugs to beat gay people. He encourages it. Putin murders his political opponents. Put that into context for me.

 

[anatta]

Putin allows police and mobs of thugs to beat gay people. He encourages it. Putin murders his political opponents. Put that into context for me.

why? what does it matter for the US?
The only thing we can change about Russia is our relationship w/Russia

 

[Cancel 2020.1]

why? what does it matter for the US?
The only thing we can change about Russia is our relationship w/Russia

It matters that Putin is - pardon the simplicity - a bad guy. He's simply not to be trusted. That doesn't mean that you don't try to forge whatever relationship you can, but Russia under Putin can likely never be what we would describe as an "ally."

What do you make of the reports recently about Kushner and the 666 5th Ave. property?

 

[Amadeus]

why? what does it matter for the US?
The only thing we can change about Russia is our relationship w/Russia

Why should the US have a relationship with an autocratic dictatorship that abuses its own people and outright murders political dissent? Russia is a glorified gas tank to begin with. It could be more, but Putin prevents it.

 

[Nomad]

Deep State is the un-elected bureaucrats who run the IC (leadership) for their own agenda whether it dovetails
with an elected POTUS's or not.
Further it's dominated by Russiaphobes, being as that's the nature of it's existence

Congratulations.

Every steaming load of horse shit you drop is always bigger than the previous one.

You just keep setting new records.

 

[anatta]

It matters that Putin is - pardon the simplicity - a bad guy. He's simply not to be trusted. That doesn't mean that you don't try to forge whatever relationship you can, but Russia under Putin can likely never be what we would describe as an "ally."

What do you make of the reports recently about Kushner and the 666 5th Ave. property?

i haven't heard about it..I'm working crazy hours this weekend taking infomercial calls.

I agree Russia under Putin can never be an allie; but we can find areas to work together on like terrorism.
And we should counter their expansion in the middle east by alliances.

I would have no problem simply with our NATO alliances in Europe either - the problem comes when the NATO expansion leads to increased weaponization ( for no strategic reasoning) by Cold War 2.0..
That and the fact NATO alliances are governed by Article 5

 

[Amadeus]

I agree Russia under Putin can never be an allie; but we can find areas to work together on like terrorism.

Russia sucks at fighting terrorism. They've greatly contributed to the problem in Syria, including the refugee crisis. They are fucking useless as a partner in terrorism.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/04/04/russia-isnt-really-interested-in-fighting-terrorism-putin-syria/

It has also been documented that, in addition to other forms of aid given to the Islamic State by Russia and Assad — which include Assad’s purchases of oil from the Islamic State, allegations of intelligence sharing with Islamic State forces, and the fortuitous resupply of arms and ammunition from Russian stocks — the FSB has helped recruit fighters for the Islamic State and facilitated the movement of jihadis to Syria. Although some have said this was a “local initiative” to clean up the North Caucasus before the Sochi Olympics, there is reporting that this recruitment was happening via Russian assets across Europe as well.

This early support yielded clear results for the Kremlin. It is hard to ignore that the first group of Russian-speaking jihadis showed up in Syria at exactly the right time to help turn the war away from Assad and toward Iraq. They did so with the intelligence to act quickly and in alignment with Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi and other Sunni Islamic State leaders, many of whom were KGB-trained (an artifact from the Kremlin’s long-term partnership with the Baath Party in Syria and Iraq). The arrival of the Islamic State was a key part of Russia’s narrative that there were no moderate rebels to support against Assad.

There is evidence that Russia has been working with the Taliban in Afghanistan, as well. The Russians believe that empowering the Taliban, in particular with legitimacy and intelligence sharing, will take space away from the expansion of the Islamic State. However, this has also meant working against American interests as U.S. troops continue to fight the Taliban, al Qaeda, and the Islamic State alike.

 

[anatta]

Russia sucks at fighting terrorism. They've greatly contributed to the problem in Syria, including the refugee crisis. They are fucking useless as a partner in terrorism.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/04/04/russia-isnt-really-interested-in-fighting-terrorism-putin-syria/

you need to check your sourcing. The author was an advisor to the Georgian gov't among others.

FSB has helped recruit fighters for the Islamic State and facilitated the movement of jihadis to Syria. Although some have said this was a “local initiative” to clean up the North Caucasus before the Sochi Olympics, there is reporting that this recruitment was happening via Russian assets across Europe as well.

why would the FSB do that? its a ridiculous charge i've never seen anywhere else.
Openly working with jihadi is way to much to believe.

However WE did the same de facto thing in Syria - we trained up "Secularist rebels" in Jordan by the CIA.
we armed them with heavy weapons -including TOW missiles- and then sent them over the border with money in their pockets.
They immediately fled over the Turkish border -with the money and without the weapons,
or were captured by the Islamists who confiscated their weapons and their money.
We wound up arming and funding our enemies like al-Nusra, if not ISIS..

Oh! and Turkey was buying up a lot of ISIS oil ..this is our NATO partner! this is from AP below:

Despite US-led campaign, Islamic State rakes in oil earnings
https://apnews.com/061e7a8329964486...led-campaign-islamic-state-rakes-oil-earnings
Washington has been talking to regional governments, including Turkey, about its concerns over the importing of energy infrastructure into IS-run territory in Syria, including equipment for extraction, refinement, transport and energy production, according to a senior U.S. official with firsthand knowledge of the IS oil sector.

 

[Darth Omar]

The Deep State doesn't exist any more than Roswell aliens, and Putin and Trump are not equals. Trump is one Putin's many puppets and vessels through which he disrupts the alliances that have kept the world safe from Russian aggression.

It's actually unfortunate the DS got labeled as such---makes it too easy to dismiss as tin foil stuff.

Whatever you want to call it, there is a cabal in the IC that is doing everything they can to undermine the administration of a duly elected president.

Some call that treason. Or subverting democracy, or something.

 

[Amadeus]

you need to check your sourcing. The author was an advisor to the Georgian gov't among others.
why would the FSB do that? its a ridiculous charge i've never seen anywhere else.
Openly working with jihadi is way to much to believe.

Assad, Russia's partner in Syria:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/assad-henchman-heres-how-we-built-isis

Based on exclusive interviews with high-level defectors from the regime’s security apparatus, it sheds new light on key decisions—like sending volunteers to fight the U.S. occupation of Iraq, which helped establish the forerunner of the Islamic State, releasing more than 1,000 former al Qaeda militants from Syrian prisons in 2011, and rarely fighting the Islamic State militants.

It also reveals how:

— the regime likely staged bombings of its own security facilities in 2011 and 2012 to foster the impression that al Qaeda had an armed presence in Syria long before it did.

— Syrian intelligence received orders to stand by when al Qaeda fighters crossed from Iraq into Syria in 2012.

— Syrian intelligence has penetrated the leadership of extremist jihadist groups and at critical moments can influence their operations.

Remarkably, several high-level former Syrian security officials who spoke on the record with this reporter said that U.S. intelligence agencies never debriefed them. The ex-officials viewed this as a major lapse, not only because they were privy to, and complicit in, the inner workings of Assad’s role in organizing a terrorist insurgency against U.S. forces in Iraq, but also because they were well-placed to advise on the establishment of a new state security apparatus should Assad’s police state collapse or be overthrown.

 

[Amadeus]

It's actually unfortunate the DS got labeled as such---makes it too easy to dismiss as tin foil stuff.

Whatever you want to call it, there is a cabal in the IC that is doing everything they can to undermine the administration of a duly elected president.

Some call that treason. Or subverting democracy, or something.

What I call treason is Trump officials colluding with foreign government(s) to subvert the policies of the United States. Which actually fits the definition of treason.

 

[Bill]

Yes, absolutely!

The combined efforts of these two men can and will save the sanctity of the entire world and restore a lasting peace among the civilized nations outside the sphere of the Muslim extremists and the Wall Street vermin controlling the global currency!

No more useless wars by agreement between the two leaders of their respective countries whom I predict will go down in history as among the great leaders of nations.

Donald Trump the accidental president and Vladimir Putin, the two designated villains of the new world order and both it's greatest threats.

WOW... those that served & competed against this great foe roll in their graves...

Maybe they can finally put an end to the Joker, Mothra & Godzilla too???

 

[Bill]

Deep State is the un-elected bureaucrats who run the IC (leadership) for their own agenda whether it dovetails
with an elected POTUS's or not.
Further it's dominated by Russiaphobes, being as that's the nature of it's existence

Hhhhmmm, I guess there must be some proof of this?? WHo, or whatever they are we must do away w/ them for their persecution of pO' putin?? Who is a victim here just like trump...??

 

[Cancel 2018.2]

Did you ever post the word "Deep state", post a thread about it, and/or talk about it prior to about six or eight months ago?

Or did you just start using the word and the inflammatory rhetoric behind it because you like to follow orders from your superiors in the reich wing media and parrot what they instruct you to parrot?

Did you ever think that maybe the deep state was so deep, it was only recently fount out?

Look at the NSA spying.

 

[Bill]

Did you ever post the word "Deep state", post a thread about it, and/or talk about it prior to about six or eight months ago?

Or did you just start using the word and the inflammatory rhetoric behind it because you like to follow orders from your superiors in the reich wing media and parrot what they instruct you to parrot?

Yep & the same goes for a few others... The new boggy man & to think he/they were here all the time & they just discovered them...........

 

[Bill]

who's "sympathizing" you moron?
do you enjoy ratcheting up Russian/west tensions and expanding NATO into permanent deployments into eastern Europe and places like Finland?

Just how many tank battallions do we need in Poland? the numbers are never enough -we constantly expand.

Then we bitch t Russia for deploying so called "battlefield nukes" (nuke tipped land based cruise missiles)
to overcome our numerical advantage.

etc.etc..whom do you think pays for all of this? Why is increasing tensions a good idea?

So if we don't want that, we must get rid of the deep state, perhaps Goldstein & the boggyman to & then everyone will live happily ever after..............

 

[Bill]

I can only imagine if you jokers were around for the Cuban Missile Crisis:
we would have wound up invading Cuba and starting a nuclear war..

Says the guy w/ henery killinger in his sig???

Having some ligit complaints hardly equates to what has been going on............ Russia was the foe, now they are the good guy & imaginary gubment workers are the bad guys, the press, anyone that opposes trump & now putins will............. wtf

 

[Bill]

is he any adversary to anyone besides demmycrats?......

You mean like Chechens?? Georgians?? Ukrainians?? AMERICANS, etc etc etc!!

 

[Bill]

I'm curious did anyone find or even define the 'deep state'? post # ?

It is said that if anyone reveals that they will be killed on a dark windy night, their heart cut out & buried somewhere in the Urals........ Or feed to the nearest stray dog or cat.