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The Almighty
Yes, I do believe in genetics. I do believe in basic human rights for all human beings. You do not believe in either.
Admit it Dems: Ryan scares the shit out of you
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Yes, I do believe in genetics. I do believe in basic human rights for all human beings. You do not believe in either.
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The Almighty
Thank you for proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that you have not read what the vouchers actually do and how they would work. You are just spouting off Dem talking points.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Cause if you did you clearly do not understand it.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
How does Ryan's plan do that when it clearly states it's voluntary for those under 55, and those over 55 will see no change?
What it leaves current seniors with, is the security of knowing their Social Security (Medicare) will not be effected. What it leaves future seniors with, is the assurance the program will still be alive and kicking when they retire and need it. It also gives individuals control over their own lives, as opposed to relying on the government for something.
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The Almighty
try reading up on it...
http://paulryan.house.gov/uploadedfiles/wydenryan.pdf
then perhaps you can explain how a fairly liberal Democratic Senator supports this plan if it is so bad.
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The Almighty
Dear Mutt... do explain what you wish to discuss or what portion of it you think I do not understand. Otherwise you simply remain looking foolish, as always.
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The Almighty
he just wanted to toss Wall St. into the mix... he has yet to realize that the big insurance companies are not the same as the big investment banks
The Ryan-Wyden Plan is different from what Ryan put in his budget that passed the House that Romney said he would sign if it reached his desk as president. Wyden voted against the Ryan budget.
You need fresher talking points, SF.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
To whcih I have to retort "bullshit" and "you can't bullshit a bullshitter." My family has been in the health care industry for far to long to believe your party line bullshit. Pricing support shits on seniors. What's to protect seniors from being denied coverage by insurance companies under the Ryan plan? Nothing. What's to protect seniors from insurance companies dramatically raising premium prices on seniors cause they represent higher risk under the Ryan plan? Nothing. Who picks up the additional cost if Ryans free market relgious assumptions don't pan out? Seniors and their families do. That's who.
These are fucking old ideas SF! They were first floated out in the 50's before medicare when the high cost of insurance for seniors had a significant impact on families, economically, who had to pick up the cost for aging and sick parents. Premium support was argued back in the 50's before medicare even became law and was shot down for that very reason. That institutional controls did not exist that would prevent the business community from exploiting seniors.
Now you may trust WallStreet investment bankers to look after your parents health but those of us who live in a reality based world know what they'll really be looking after. THEMSELVES!!!
SmarterthanYou
rebel
you were the moron that said he was a racist, I posted a picture of him and YOU assumed he was black. not I. in fact, I challenge you to link a post where I said he was black.
SmarterthanYou
rebel
where apparently idiots like you can't learn.
And I see you're now attempting to spin yet another turd....
...feebly attempting (and failing miserably) to convince anyone dumb enough to believe it that you weren't posting a pic of Griggs to insinuate that by his appearance you were proving he couldn't possibly be racist.
Quit while you're behind, STY.
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Darla
Ryan's original budget, went to a 100% voucher system which would not have kept pace with the cost of insurance. ( I want to add here that these are the same morons who want to overturn ACA which is the only thing that would disallow prexisting condition claims - in other words, without the ACA it would be a rare senior who could buy insurance on the open market period, at any price).
When his own party freaked out not the least because they lost house races in special elections on this very budget, Ryan, like the mewling little punk ass coward that he is, went back and made some changes. What SF is linking to now is the changed plan. Which while terrible enough and on its own will devastate the elderly, is still only a Trojan horse for the plan Ryan has spent his entire career advocating for - ending Medicare, period. It would be replaced with a voucher which in real life would be nearly useless.
Sf is hoping you don't know the background on Ryan, and I think you do, but for anyone here who doesn't.
The fact is that Ryan is so psychopathically radical that today's radically right off the cliff republican party balked at real goal.
But he's going to run on it. Why? Because the Obama campaign is going to force him to. Too bad.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
Yep... STILL, this is a line of hyperbolic rhetoric that needs to be stopped in it's tracks. As soon as one of them starts yammering about this effecting seniors, it needs to be pointed out, the plan wouldn't effect seniors at all, and the people who aren't yet seniors, could choose to remain in the current system as well, it's entirely optional for people under 55.
The argument is this... Medicare goes tits up in 12 years... (less if Obama is allowed to roll the corpse.)
The Democrats offer NO PLAN! NADDA! NOTHING! ZILCH!
Meanwhile... we have on the table, a sensible well-thought-out plan that WILL WORK, and actually saves the program. This is such an easy argument, a first-grader could make it... but the GOP, you watch and see... they will bungle this and let Democrats continue to spread this stupid meme.
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Darla
Exactly. And this is Ryan's liberal Medicare plan. It's not even his end goal.
This would murder more people than all of our wars put together if it went on long enough. But dont' worry - fertilized eggs would be safe!
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Darla
They own the one that passed the house. Too bad who doesn't like it. They passed it, they wanted to "shove it down our throats" it's this psychopath's end goal, and that's what they're going to have to defend. Let's see how the American people like it.
It doesn't matter how many tantrums SF throws on this board.
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Darla
Romney/Ryan 2012: Kill the Elderly: Save Fertilized Eggs!
The real death panels!
Crashk
Unite or Die
the fascists here believe that their ideas are new and shiny because they don't know the history of their party. Or the history of why Medicaid and Medicare were enacted.
"A supply-sider and deficit hawk, Ryan is the author of the GOP’s only Congressional Budget Office–certified “road map” to balance the budget and eliminate the long-term deficit. His proposal calls for politically courageous cuts to beloved entitlements such as Medicare and Medicaid—cuts so drastic that New York Times contributor James Kwak summarized their effects under the headline: “People will die.” Ryan has argued that the central battle in American politics is between “individualism and collectivism” and said, “The reason I got involved in public service, by and large, if I had to credit one thinker, one person, it would be Ayn Rand.”
http://reason.com/archives/2010/05/10/paul-ryan-radical-or-sellout
the fact that his political philosophy is based on the failed and antisocial ideas of Ayn Rand should be enough to scare people away from this ticket without the onion making fun of them. Fascists are not funny.
Romney's budget proposals are actually worse. Ryan's plan adopts the Affordable Care Act's cuts on the growth of Medicare spending and includes cuts on military spending. Romney, by contrast, repeals the curb on Medicare spending and increases military spending to no less than 4% of GDP while capping total spending at 20% of GDP all while promising to balance the budget. It'd be laughable if he weren't actually the Republican nominee.