Why is Rick Perry in the lead?

[Onceler]

The point Oncelor is that the unemployment rate IS STILL ABOVE 9%. No matter how many times you stomp your feet and apologize for Obama.... he is NOT making things better.

Tell me Oncelor.... WHAT is it that can STOP a PANIC? Could it be........... LEADERSHIP?

Tell us.... list for us.... WHAT did Obama do that made people believe the economy was going to get better? What policies did he enact that have HELPED employment since that stop gap stimulus plan? WHAT did Obama do since then? He immediately 'pivoted' to cramming an unwanted health care reform down our throats rather than focus on the economy.

I know you have to apologize for him, because he is your messiah and you have be so commanded. But do try to pull your head out of his ass long enough to realize how bad things are right now.

Well, I'll stand by my wild, out-there premise that it's better to be gaining 100,000 jobs in a month than losing 400,000. And that it's better to be growing than in recession. I know - real crazy stuff.

The stimulus did more than you & yours will ever give it credit for. It fell short of what was promised, but it created hundreds of thousands of jobs, and a time when no one was hiring. And you overestimate what one person can do in a global economy from a "leadership" standpoint. You think a "morning in America" speech is going to reassure investors, or people who are hiring? It won't. We're at a point where gov't's role is incredibly limited. The best thing that they could have done would have been a better debt deal, and guess what? Obama offered to cut entitlements & not actually raise taxes, and the GOP still said no.

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

only a hack would say this:

obama is not at fault because there was NOTHING, no policy that could have stopped job losses in 09'. but.....bush is a failure because he couldn't stop the job losses.

 

[Onceler]

only a hack would say this:

obama is not at fault because there was NOTHING, no policy that could have stopped job losses in 09'. but.....bush is a failure because he couldn't stop the job losses.

Bush CREATED the job losses.

Man, are you obtuse....

 

[Damocles]

I disagree. It was clearly a bubble, that was out of control, and everyone knew it would pop eventually. If you do some searches, you can definitely find discussions regarding that on this board, from 6-7 years ago.

Bush did not pay attention to domestic policy; he didn't care about it.

Right... So in 2001 when he warned it was coming, he was "not caring"... in 2003 when he called the problems in FM&FM was systemic and could cause a far larger problem than just mortgages or when he proposed a new agency to regulate FM&FM he was "not paying attention"... (That's when Barney Frank told us that it was important NOT to do this because it would keep some people out of their home, and called them "fundamentally sound", that was, of course, when he was "caring" while Bush was "not paying attention" and "not caring"). At this point Greenspan, in 2005, chimed in saying that enabling to increase in size placed the entire financial system at a substantial risk... Schumer chimed in telling how "great" a job Fm&FM were doing.... (of course that was when he was caring while Bush was not)...

Anyway, he warned us, but he was just an uncaring buffoon... Good thing we didn't listen to him, it made our lives so much better.

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

Bush CREATED the job losses.

Man, are you obtuse....

really? explain how bush himself created the job losses. if there was no policy that could stop the job losses, how can you blame bush?

 

[Onceler]

really? explain how bush himself created the job losses. if there was no policy that could stop the job losses, how can you blame bush?

I explained a few times how Bush ignored the economy. He could have prevented the crash; he didn't.


The crash - again, on Bush's watch - precipitated the job losses. It's pretty simple.

 

[Bonestorm]

Right... So in 2001 when he warned it was coming, he was "not caring"... in 2003 when he called the problems in FM&FM was systemic and could cause a far larger problem than just mortgages or when he proposed a new agency to regulate FM&FM he was "not paying attention"... (That's when Barney Frank told us that it was important NOT to do this because it would keep some people out of their home, and called them "fundamentally sound", that was, of course, when he was "caring" while Bush was "not paying attention" and "not caring"). At this point Greenspan, in 2005, chimed in saying that enabling to increase in size placed the entire financial system at a substantial risk... Schumer chimed in telling how "great" a job Fm&FM were doing.... (of course that was when he was caring while Bush was not)...

Anyway, he warned us, but he was just an uncaring buffoon... Good thing we didn't listen to him, it made our lives so much better.

This again? Jesus. Zombie lies never die.

How in the hell have so many people allowed themselves to be convinced that Barney Frank, ranking minority member on a single House committee, personally thwarted the will of the Republican President of the United States, the Republican led Senate and the Republican led House? I would suggest partisanship is the answer, but I know that we have no Republican hacks on this site and have only moderate independents and Democratic/left-wing hacks.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Well, I'll stand by my wild, out-there premise that it's better to be gaining 100,000 jobs in a month than losing 400,000. And that it's better to be growing than in recession. I know - real crazy stuff.

]

But is it better to be at 9% unemployment than 8%?

The stimulus did more than you & yours will ever give it credit for. It fell short of what was promised, but it created hundreds of thousands of jobs, and a time when no one was hiring. And you overestimate what one person can do in a global economy from a "leadership" standpoint. You think a "morning in America" speech is going to reassure investors, or people who are hiring? It won't. We're at a point where gov't's role is incredibly limited. The best thing that they could have done would have been a better debt deal, and guess what? Obama offered to cut entitlements & not actually raise taxes, and the GOP still said no.

Guess what.... a LEADER would have told his party to get the fucking debt deal done in 2010 when they STILL HAD A SUPERMAJORITY.

and yes... a LEADER most certainly could have stopped the panic. THAT IS WHAT LEADERS DO. They present a PLAN on how to SOLVE the problems the country faces. No plan from Obama. hell... we can't even get the idiot to have a BUDGET. Instead we get regulations and bureaucracy where we don't need them and get NOTHING where we do need them.

Like I stated.... it is quite clear you are an Obama apologist.

As for your 100k jobs vs. losing 400k. Yes, that aspect is better. But we are talking about the economy as a whole.... so tell us genius... are we really ADDING jobs if the number of jobs added (100k) is LESS than the number needed to keep up with population growth? Or are we still LOSING ground in reality?

 

[Onceler]

The Barney Frank thing only gets more hilarious with time.....

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

I explained a few times how Bush ignored the economy. He could have prevented the crash; he didn't.


The crash - again, on Bush's watch - precipitated the job losses. It's pretty simple.

no you haven't. you haven't explained anything. you have made biased and unfounded conclusions. it is truly hilarious how now, it is bush could have prevented it, instead of he created it. but, obama can't prevent anything.

unemployment over 9% on obama's watch = bush's fault in onceler's world. we get it, you're a hack. obama is not responsible for anything, unless it is good.

 

[Onceler]

no you haven't. you haven't explained anything. you have made biased and unfounded conclusions. it is truly hilarious how now, it is bush could have prevented it, instead of he created it. but, obama can't prevent anything.

unemployment over 9% on obama's watch = bush's fault in onceler's world. we get it, you're a hack. obama is not responsible for anything, unless it is good.

How could Obama have prevented the crash of '08?

I'd love to hear that one. Great point, Yurt....

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

How could Obama have prevented the crash of '08?

I'd love to hear that one. Great point, Yurt....

great, now moving the goal posts. can't actually prove YOUR claim, so now you move it to obama.

typical onceler routine when cornered.

btw, i never claimed obama alone could stop the crash. unlike you who claims bush alone could have stopped the crash. see the difference?

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

This again? Jesus. Zombie lies never die.

How in the hell have so many people allowed themselves to be convinced that Barney Frank, ranking minority member on a single House committee, personally thwarted the will of the Republican President of the United States, the Republican led Senate and the Republican led House? I would suggest partisanship is the answer, but I know that we have no Republican hacks on this site and have only moderate independents and Democratic/left-wing hacks.

did barney help or hinder change? he was a ranking member. and if you think it was just him, you're delusional.

and how is it in your world the pubs and bush get the blame when the dems were in charge from 07-10?

 

[Onceler]

great, now moving the goal posts. can't actually prove YOUR claim, so now you move it to obama.

typical onceler routine when cornered.

btw, i never claimed obama alone could stop the crash. unlike you who claims bush alone could have stopped the crash. see the difference?

Bush was President in 2008 - it was his 8th year in office, presiding over the economy.

Obama wasn't.

See the difference?

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

Bush was President in 2008 - it was his 8th year in office, presiding over the economy.

Obama wasn't.

See the difference?

so only the president is in control of the economy? wow. and in 2009 you claim there was nothing obama could do, yet in your world, he was presiding over the economy.

onceler's world:

2008 - bush could have done something

2009 - obama could not have done anything

pure hackery...and i notice you're still moving away from proving your claim

 

[Onceler]

so only the president is in control of the economy? wow. and in 2009 you claim there was nothing obama could do, yet in your world, he was presiding over the economy.

onceler's world:

2008 - bush could have done something

2009 - obama could not have done anything

pure hackery...and i notice you're still moving away from proving your claim

That's another lie. I never said Obama could do nothing - he DID something. He did what he could to FIX the problem that Bush CREATED.

You have real problems understanding this. Once the crash hit, jobs were going to get lost...there was no way around that. At least Obama's actions turned that aspect of things around.

 

[Bonestorm]

did barney help or hinder change? he was a ranking member. and if you think it was just him, you're delusional.

and how is it in your world the pubs and bush get the blame when the dems were in charge from 07-10?

Barney Frank was a ranking member. He voted against a bill that passed the House that related to Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac. He did not block anything. The bill then went to the Senate where it languished in a committee controlled by the Republicans.

When the Democrats took control of the House, Barney Frank sponsored a bill that related to Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac that was co-sponsored by the Republican that sponsored the bill that previously passed the House that Barney Frank voted against. Like the previous bill that passed the House, the bill that Barney Frank sponsored languished in committee in the Senate, this time in a committee controlled by the Democrats.

The refusal to impose additional regulations on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac was a bipartisan refusal of the Senate. The House did its part. The right -wing demonization of Barney Frank despite the fact that he didn't get in the way of anything is pretty revealing of the Republican psyche.

Having said all of that, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were not the cause of the financial collapse.

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

Barney Frank was a ranking member. He voted against a bill that passed the House that related to Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac. He did not block anything. The bill then went to the Senate where it languished in a committee controlled by the Republicans.

When the Democrats took control of the House, Barney Frank sponsored a bill that related to Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac that was co-sponsored by the Republican that sponsored the bill that previously passed the House that Barney Frank voted against. Like the previous bill that passed the House, the bill that Barney Frank sponsored languished in committee in the Senate, this time in a committee controlled by the Democrats.

The refusal to impose additional regulations on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac was a bipartisan refusal of the Senate. The House did its part. The right -wing demonization of Barney Frank despite the fact that he didn't get in the way of anything is pretty revealing of the Republican psyche.

Having said all of that, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were not the cause of the financial collapse.

so barney frank saying there was no problem, indicating or saying it was racist to fix the alleged problem....was a help? if you want to believe that, have at it.

 

[Bonestorm]

so barney frank saying there was no problem, indicating or saying it was racist to fix the alleged problem....was a help? if you want to believe that, have at it.

Do you take pride in knowing so little about pretty much everything yet having opinions about everything nonetheless?

 

[Damocles]

This again? Jesus. Zombie lies never die.

How in the hell have so many people allowed themselves to be convinced that Barney Frank, ranking minority member on a single House committee, personally thwarted the will of the Republican President of the United States, the Republican led Senate and the Republican led House? I would suggest partisanship is the answer, but I know that we have no Republican hacks on this site and have only moderate independents and Democratic/left-wing hacks.

So first you say that Bush didn't try anything, then when you are literally shown to be incorrect your answer is he wasn't "strenuous" enough trying to get it done and tell me he didn't care.

Reality: Bush told you this was coming, the democrats (far more than just Barney, the reason we mention that is because it is easy to find video of it) kept telling us there was no reason to even look there. In fact they fought so much against it that republican leaders knew that the stuff wouldn't pass even when they gained the majority...

Except he, Greenspan, etc. told you it was coming and why... tried to do something about it... yet he is the one who "didn't care" and was an utter buffoon. And after all of that, you call somebody who brings up that Bush told you what was coming and tried to do something about it a "hack"...

Bush was by far my least favorite republican President since Grant... But that doesn't mean I don't understand that the man warned us, and tried to do something about it.

I'm not the one actually ignoring what the man actually said and proposed to say that he "didn't care"... That's where you'll find your "hack"..