US Downgraded

That's not entirely true Grind. The teabaggers do give a fuck!

They give a fuck about all that tea they've been drinking.

They just don't give a fuck that it's going to ruin the country that or they are that clueless.

What's going to ruin the country is spending money we don't have. That's what got us into this mess, not the idea that we need to tax the wealthy. I think we need to tax those who pay no taxes at all. After all, we all want EVERYONE to pay their fair share. Right?
 
Privatize Social Security, cut 1/3 off the defense budget. Perfect compromise legislation to save the future - both sides have to touch & embrace their respective 3rd rails.

Except that SS isn't a problem. Defense has to be first on the chopping block and then medicare/medicaid. These are the two spending programs that are killing this country. Defense has to be first because it represents by far the greater danger.
 
Excerpts of what S&P said to explain the downgrade:

Some excerpts from the release:

[...]The political brinksmanship of recent months highlights what we see as America’s governance and policymaking becoming less stable, less effective, and less predictable than what we previously believed. The statutory debt ceiling and the threat of default have become political bargaining chips in the debate over fiscal policy.

[...]It appears that for now, new revenues have dropped down on the menu of policy options.

[...]The act contains no measures to raise taxes or otherwise enhance revenues, though the committee could recommend them.

[...]Compared with previous projections, our revised base case scenario now assumes that the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts, due to expire by the end of 2012, remain in place. We have changed our assumption on this because the majority of Republicans in Congress continue to resist any measure that would raise revenues, a position we believe Congress reinforced by passing the act.

Standard & Poors indicates that they could improve their rating for the U.S. if “the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts for high earners lapse from 2013 onwards, as the Administration is advocating.”ref

Facts? They don't want no bloody facts Bgfrn! Tea! Give them more tea!!!
 
Both republicans and democrats are responsible for this downgrade. This is typical Washington finger pointing nonsense that I am getting fed up with.

Exactly and drinking more tea aint gonna fix the problem. The time for brinksmanship is done. Now is the time to govern!
 
What's going to ruin the country is spending money we don't have. That's what got us into this mess, not the idea that we need to tax the wealthy. I think we need to tax those who pay no taxes at all. After all, we all want EVERYONE to pay their fair share. Right?

An excellent point. Taxing people who pay no tax.

I think we all can agree that individuals and corporations who utilise offshore tax havens should be taxed to the fullest extent.

Imagine, corporations actually paying the tax on profits they actually earn in a certain country, eh?

Luckily, our politicians, with an eye on serving their true masters, ignore their electors to do the bidding of their corporate paymasters. After all, only the ordinary people pay taxes and that's the way it should be.
 
Like I said: DRASTIC spending cuts would HAVE TO be made to Social Security and Medicare if a BBA was passed. Children and elderly WILL starve if you right wing scum get your way. The problem is you are TOO fucking stupid to grasp the consequences of your right wing answer for everything...PUNISHMENT.

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Balanced Budget Amendment: Bad for Seniors

Congress is considering several proposals that would amend the Constitution and require that annual spending levels not exceed revenue levels. This requirement would jeopardize all federal programs, including Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, which would experience across-the-board cuts. Only defense spending during times of war or military conflict would be exempt from cuts.

The proposals do not make exceptions for unforeseen emergencies or economic downturns and could further harm a weakened economy. During an economic slump, government expenditures increase in the form of payments for unemployment insurance (UI), food stamps and Medicaid. These increased government disbursements are considered “automatic stabilizers.” A balanced budget amendment (BBA), however, effectively suspends the automatic stabilizers by requiring them to be offset with cuts in federal spending or tax increases, neither of which are advisable during a recession.

Most disturbing is that the BBA proposals balance the federal budget entirely through spending cuts and make it virtually impossible to do so through revenues (taxes). Since the proposals make it more difficult to raise revenues – a three-fifths or two-thirds vote (depending on the bill) is needed in both chambers – the measures are designed to protect the Bush tax cuts for the rich while balancing the budget on the backs of seniors and the middle class.

One such balanced budget proposal, H.J. Res. 1, would cap government expenditures at 18% of gross domestic product (GDP) by 2018. To meet this goal, Congress would essentially have to enact extreme budget cuts. Among other things, such cuts would include:

(1) adopting Representative Paul Ryan’s voucher plan to privatize Medicare;

(2) raising the Medicare eligibility age from 65 to 67;and

(3) raising the Social Security retirement age to 70. It would also require cuts so harsh that many of the most vulnerable would be left with absolutely nothing:

By 2021, such a budget would reduce the following programs in half: Medicaid; the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP, formerly food stamps), and Supplemental Security Income.

H. J. Res. 1 aims to scale back government spending to the early 1960s level, prior to the passage of the Medicare and Medicaid programs. This rollback in government spending would not adequately capture the current and future needs of the country. Given the aging population, rising health care costs, and the legacy of two unfunded foreign wars and a decade’s worth of costly tax cuts, it is unrealistic to expect to go back to those spending levels.

The balanced budget amendments are designed to protect the Bush tax cuts for the rich, while balancing the budget on the backs of America’s seniors and the middle class!

A balanced budget amendment would result in severe cuts to Medicare!

* It would raise the Medicare eligibility age to 67, voucherize the program and
impose even deeper cuts than the Ryan budget.

A balanced budget amendment would result in severe cuts to Social Security!

* It would raise the retirement age to 70

* Because the BBA would require that spending in any year be offset by revenues collected in the same year, Social Security could not use its reserves to pay benefits – even if it had balances in its trust fund, as it does today. Instead, it would be forced to cut benefit for millions of Americans

A balanced budget amendment would gut Medicaid and diminish low-income programs!

* The BBA would reduce the federal Medicaid contributions to states, thereby shifting costs on to the states, providers and Medicaid beneficiaries and seriously jeopardize nursing home and home care services for seniors and individuals with disabilities.

* By 2021, programs like Medicaid, food stamps and SSI would be cut in half.

A balanced budget amendment is bad for the economy!

* By requiring a balanced budget every year, no matter how the economy was performing, the BBA would force cuts in vital programs and spending JUST when the economy is weak or in recession - just the opposite of good economic policy.

http://www.retiredamericans.org/system/storage/24/00/0/947/fact_sheet-budget-balanced_budget_amendment_final.pdf

Facts Bgfrn....you keep giving them facts when what they want is tea...more tea!! Give them tea to drink that's all they want! LOL
 
What's going to ruin the country is spending money we don't have. That's what got us into this mess, not the idea that we need to tax the wealthy. I think we need to tax those who pay no taxes at all. After all, we all want EVERYONE to pay their fair share. Right?

Yea well tell that to the cut tax and spend money like drunken sailor conservatives who drove us into the ditch in the first place. You're singing to the choir here.
 
An excellent point. Taxing people who pay no tax.

I think we all can agree that individuals and corporations who utilise offshore tax havens should be taxed to the fullest extent.

Imagine, corporations actually paying the tax on profits they actually earn in a certain country, eh?

Luckily, our politicians, with an eye on serving their true masters, ignore their electors to do the bidding of their corporate paymasters. After all, only the ordinary people pay taxes and that's the way it should be.

You do understand that there are a vast number of people out there who don't understand that you're being sarcastic and you are now at grave risk of becoming the next leader of the Tea Party. LOL
 
Yea well tell that to the cut tax and spend money like drunken sailor conservatives who drove us into the ditch in the first place. You're singing to the choir here.

right....because the democrats never spent a dime....never had any power starting in 2007

:rolleyes:

bush and the pubs spent like mad drunk sailors, no doubt. but don't act like it was only them. both parties spend like drunks on new years eve with a wad full of cash that isn't theirs...
 
A BBA will surely raise everyone's taxes, while big business keeps their money out of the country.

No, it wouldn't "surely" do any such thing. Only if we maintain that cradle to grave care is somehow tenable in a government that has to live within its means would such be the case. This comes from the insistence that the only way to raise revenue is through higher tax rates, you shouldn't allow yourself to fall into that trap.
 
No, it wouldn't "surely" do any such thing. Only if we maintain that cradle to grave care is somehow tenable in a government that has to live within its means would such be the case. This comes from the insistence that the only way to raise revenue is through higher tax rates, you shouldn't allow yourself to fall into that trap.

It's sad you people on the right HAVE to create myths to find an excuse to punish people Damo. America doesn't have a 'cradle to grave' care system. Compared to other 1st world countries, our social safety net is minimal.

But the question is; are we a civilized society or is America a jungle? SHOULD we provide care for the most vulnerable in our society?
 
It's sad you people on the right HAVE to create myths to find an excuse to punish people Damo. America doesn't have a 'cradle to grave' care system. Compared to other 1st world countries, our social safety net is minimal.

But the question is; are we a civilized society or is America a jungle? SHOULD we provide care for the most vulnerable in our society?

WE should, our GOVERNMENT shouldn't...it's not their role. We have over 1 million non-profit organizations in America, dedicated to caring for the most vulnerable in our society, and we should contribute our time and money to these organizations. We certainly shouldn't leave it all up to liberals to decide who needs help with our tax money, that's how we wind up funding Cowboy Poetry Festival.

Since you immediately run to "the vulnerable" as soon as someone mentions balancing the budget, you might want to read my thread: http://www.justplainpolitics.com/showthread.php?34066-Before-the-children-and-elderly-starve.... In it, I point out billions of dollars we are blowing every year, on silliness, redundancy, and outright incompetence, for things that help absolutely no one, except recipients of government funding.
 
WE should, our GOVERNMENT shouldn't...it's not their role. We have over 1 million non-profit organizations in America, dedicated to caring for the most vulnerable in our society, and we should contribute our time and money to these organizations. We certainly shouldn't leave it all up to liberals to decide who needs help with our tax money, that's how we wind up funding Cowboy Poetry Festival.

Since you immediately run to "the vulnerable" as soon as someone mentions balancing the budget, you might want to read my thread: http://www.justplainpolitics.com/showthread.php?34066-Before-the-children-and-elderly-starve.... In it, I point out billions of dollars we are blowing every year, on silliness, redundancy, and outright incompetence, for things that help absolutely no one, except recipients of government funding.

If you don't trust the Federal Government running social services and/or don't believe it can be changed and run efficiently why would you ever support the Federal Government running security? Why trust the President and Congress with the Armed Services when the budgets of special "black ops" and covert spies are kept from the public. If you don't believe you can change the fact they're spending money on monkey doo-doo what do you think is happening in the Armed Services where the public are not privy to details?
 
If you don't trust the Federal Government running social services and/or don't believe it can be changed and run efficiently why would you ever support the Federal Government running security? Why trust the President and Congress with the Armed Services when the budgets of special "black ops" and covert spies are kept from the public. If you don't believe you can change the fact they're spending money on monkey doo-doo what do you think is happening in the Armed Services where the public are not privy to details?
Its not a matter of trust, you dodo.....its a matter of fact and tangible results....
We never lost a war that was in the hands of the military, we only lose those that are micromanaged by pinheads in Washington...so I don't put much faith in the President and Federal Government to run the military in an efficient manner....but the military has shown success in the past .....


While all....ALL....A L L...social programs run by government are rife with mismanagement, fraud, waste, and abuse,.... and are failing in their stated purpose.....and not nearly as successful as private charity.....

But that said....Its the Federal governments number 1 duty to protect the country from foreign and domestic overthrow.....its not food stamps or free cell phones or subsidized college tuition...
 
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WE should, our GOVERNMENT shouldn't...it's not their role. We have over 1 million non-profit organizations in America, dedicated to caring for the most vulnerable in our society, and we should contribute our time and money to these organizations. We certainly shouldn't leave it all up to liberals to decide who needs help with our tax money, that's how we wind up funding Cowboy Poetry Festival.

Since you immediately run to "the vulnerable" as soon as someone mentions balancing the budget, you might want to read my thread: http://www.justplainpolitics.com/showthread.php?34066-Before-the-children-and-elderly-starve.... In it, I point out billions of dollars we are blowing every year, on silliness, redundancy, and outright incompetence, for things that help absolutely no one, except recipients of government funding.

Well Dixie, thanks for admitting what I have said all along...conservatives and Republicans want to END Social Security and Medicare. So from this point forward, don't try to paint it any other way.

We TRIED a charity only approach...it FAILED. Before Medicare, 66% of seniors lived below the poverty line, today it's 14%. Before Medicare, 50% of seniors had NO health insurance and more than 25% were estimated to go without medical care due to cost concerns. Many DIED without treatment. Since the advent of Medicare, "the health of the elderly population has improved, as measured by both longevity and functional status," said one study published in the journal Health Affairs. In fact, according to the study, "life expectancy at age 65 increased from 14.3 years in 1960 to 17.8 years in 1998 and the chronically disabled elderly population declined from 24.9 percent in 1982 to 21.3 percent in 1994." ref

Charity is great, but it will never cover everyone. Maybe you also believe the elderly need to beg for assistance. How dignified for people who worked their whole life raising and supporting a family...how reassuring to someone on a fixed income that they MIGHT get some help.

You folks on the right continue to exhibit NOTHING that would classify you as human. Raised by wolves...
 
If you don't trust the Federal Government running social services and/or don't believe it can be changed and run efficiently why would you ever support the Federal Government running security? Why trust the President and Congress with the Armed Services when the budgets of special "black ops" and covert spies are kept from the public. If you don't believe you can change the fact they're spending money on monkey doo-doo what do you think is happening in the Armed Services where the public are not privy to details?

Well, the FIRST reason I would support the Fed running security, is because that's the one thing the Constitution clearly gives them authority and obligation to do. The government is not supposed to take care of everyone's every need from cradle to grave, that is a statist perception of government, which is the root basis for Marxism, Socialism, and Communism, but not American Constitutional Democracy. We have a unique Constitutional republic, which gives the people (not the government) control of the collective, and government is one of the tools used. The problem is, over 200+ years, we've forgotten how to use the tool... it doesn't mean the tool is broken, or we need a new tool. The Founders were smart men, they built a system which has created the greatest power ever to exist on this planet. We've only recently had the problem of pinheads wanting to adopt Statist viewpoints, and cling to the Eurotrash Socialist model of government.
 
Well, the FIRST reason I would support the Fed running security, is because that's the one thing the Constitution clearly gives them authority and obligation to do. The government is not supposed to take care of everyone's every need from cradle to grave, that is a statist perception of government, which is the root basis for Marxism, Socialism, and Communism, but not American Constitutional Democracy. We have a unique Constitutional republic, which gives the people (not the government) control of the collective, and government is one of the tools used. The problem is, over 200+ years, we've forgotten how to use the tool... it doesn't mean the tool is broken, or we need a new tool. The Founders were smart men, they built a system which has created the greatest power ever to exist on this planet. We've only recently had the problem of pinheads wanting to adopt Statist viewpoints, and cling to the Eurotrash Socialist model of government.

SO...when the government is invading, killing, maiming, arresting, incarcerating, and executing human beings it is doing good, but when it saves lives and helps citizens, it is EVIL.
 
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