Jarhead's delusional view on Obamacare...

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

The Delusion:

Jarhead: The healthcare bill helps me first and foremost by ensuring that all Americans have access to quality healthcare. This means that even the weakest among us will be covered, when that happens, we are all stronger. The next Albert Einstein might be in that group. The bill also helps me by ensuring that people's healthcare is paid for up front and not around the back with my tax dollars... (its much cheaper this way). Additionally eventually it will make my healthcare cheaper and the quality of the care better.

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First of all, the HCR bill does not cover all Americans, far from it. They boast that 32 million more Americans will be covered, of the 50 million who currently aren't covered, but NO ONE is covered without cost to them for mandated insurance policies. For someone making $50k a year, this will amount to an estimated $18k a year. A burden most middle class families simply can't afford... the penalty for not complying to the mandate, is around $1,200 per year. More frightening, is the prospect of going naked on insurance at a time of their life when insurance is vitally important.

Next is Jarhead's fantasy that health care will be paid for "up front" ...by who? Did the HCR bill include a magical Health Care Fairy or something? Look, there is no such thing as a Free Lunch! Someone has to pay for stuff, it's just how the real world works. Fantasizing that you live in some mystical fairy tale, where things are just magically paid for at no cost to anyone, is clinically 'mentally challenged'. We are adding 30+ million Americans to the system, but somehow, that isn't going to cost any more money???

Then, we have the delusional fantasy that his health care is going to be "cheaper and better quality" in the years to come. I'm sorry, but I find it hard to follow this logic. The insurance companies have to increase premiums to compensate for the additional expense of covering pre-existing illnesses and preventative care costs. Subsequently, we are adding 30+ million to the system, while 40% of the doctors say they are going to get out of the practice... how in the hell could you imagine, in that atmosphere, better quality, better availability, or lower costs in the future? Most carriers have already announced drastic increases in premiums for the coming year, and in 4 years, when more of the 'benefits' of Obamacare kick in, the costs will spiral even higher.

Jarhead is apparently living with the Rainbow Unicorns on a Cotton Candy Cloud!

 

[zappasguitar]

The Delusion:



----------------------------------------------------------------------------

First of all, the HCR bill does not cover all Americans, far from it. They boast that 32 million more Americans will be covered, of the 50 million who currently aren't covered, but NO ONE is covered without cost to them for mandated insurance policies. For someone making $50k a year, this will amount to an estimated $18k a year. A burden most middle class families simply can't afford... the penalty for not complying to the mandate, is around $1,200 per year. More frightening, is the prospect of going naked on insurance at a time of their life when insurance is vitally important.


Next is Jarhead's fantasy that health care will be paid for "up front" ...by who? Did the HCR bill include a magical Health Care Fairy or something? Look, there is no such thing as a Free Lunch! Someone has to pay for stuff, it's just how the real world works. Fantasizing that you live in some mystical fairy tale, where things are just magically paid for at no cost to anyone, is clinically 'mentally challenged'. We are adding 30+ million Americans to the system, but somehow, that isn't going to cost any more money???

Then, we have the delusional fantasy that his health care is going to be "cheaper and better quality" in the years to come. I'm sorry, but I find it hard to follow this logic. The insurance companies have to increase premiums to compensate for the additional expense of covering pre-existing illnesses and preventative care costs. Subsequently, we are adding 30+ million to the system, while 40% of the doctors say they are going to get out of the practice... how in the hell could you imagine, in that atmosphere, better quality, better availability, or lower costs in the future? Most carriers have already announced drastic increases in premiums for the coming year, and in 4 years, when more of the 'benefits' of Obamacare kick in, the costs will spiral even higher.

Jarhead is apparently living with the Rainbow Unicorns on a Cotton Candy Cloud!

There you go...worrying about other people's "delusions" when you should be worrying about the very real delusions YOU live under.

 

[NOVA]

an attempt to link the validity of a premise to a characteristic or belief of the person advocating the premise? Yep.

 

[apple0154]

The Delusion:

First of all, the HCR bill does not cover all Americans, far from it. They boast that 32 million more Americans will be covered, of the 50 million who currently aren't covered, but NO ONE is covered without cost to them for mandated insurance policies. For someone making $50k a year, this will amount to an estimated $18k a year. A burden most middle class families simply can't afford... the penalty for not complying to the mandate, is around $1,200 per year. More frightening, is the prospect of going naked on insurance at a time of their life when insurance is vitally important.

Next is Jarhead's fantasy that health care will be paid for "up front" ...by who? Did the HCR bill include a magical Health Care Fairy or something? Look, there is no such thing as a Free Lunch! Someone has to pay for stuff, it's just how the real world works. Fantasizing that you live in some mystical fairy tale, where things are just magically paid for at no cost to anyone, is clinically 'mentally challenged'. We are adding 30+ million Americans to the system, but somehow, that isn't going to cost any more money???

Then, we have the delusional fantasy that his health care is going to be "cheaper and better quality" in the years to come. I'm sorry, but I find it hard to follow this logic. The insurance companies have to increase premiums to compensate for the additional expense of covering pre-existing illnesses and preventative care costs. Subsequently, we are adding 30+ million to the system, while 40% of the doctors say they are going to get out of the practice... how in the hell could you imagine, in that atmosphere, better quality, better availability, or lower costs in the future? Most carriers have already announced drastic increases in premiums for the coming year, and in 4 years, when more of the 'benefits' of Obamacare kick in, the costs will spiral even higher.

Jarhead is apparently living with the Rainbow Unicorns on a Cotton Candy Cloud!

For the zillionth time the bill is a start. When insurance company rates get too high the people will demand something be done and that "something" will be a government option or universal coverage.

The country didn't have to take this road but we all know what transpired during the talks.

As for quality, costs and availability there is not one country that progressed from a "pay or suffer" system to universal coverage and then reverted. Not one country. There is not one example of citizens demanding a return to a "pay or suffer" system after 40 or 50 years of universal coverage. Not one example.

When people say all these ludicrous things about how terrible government medical is how can anyone take them serious when there is not one single example they can show. NOT ONE.

It's truly baffling how intelligent people can give weight to such nonsense.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

For the zillionth time the bill is a start. When insurance company rates get too high the people will demand something be done and that "something" will be a government option or universal coverage.

The country didn't have to take this road but we all know what transpired during the talks.

As for quality, costs and availability there is not one country that progressed from a "pay or suffer" system to universal coverage and then reverted. Not one country. There is not one example of citizens demanding a return to a "pay or suffer" system after 40 or 50 years of universal coverage. Not one example.

When people say all these ludicrous things about how terrible government medical is how can anyone take them serious when there is not one single example they can show. NOT ONE.

It's truly baffling how intelligent people can give weight to such nonsense.

Yes. A "pay AND suffer" system sounds MUCH better!

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

For the zillionth time the bill is a start. When insurance company rates get too high the people will demand something be done and that "something" will be a government option or universal coverage.

For the zillionth time, you fucking idiot, where the hell is the money coming from to pay for it? We can't afford what we presently have on our plate, much less a massive bloated government-run health care system, where everyone is cared for at the expense of the government. We just CAN'T do it... there is not enough money to do it, not enough rich old farts to tax and pay for it! Try to get it through your dumbass head, nothing in the whole wide world is ever FREE! Someone will have to pay for every single thing the government does... they do not earn money! So what difference does it really make if the middle class pays $18k a year in premiums, or $20k a year in new taxes? Because that is essentially what your retarded ass is suggesting here.

 

[FUCK THE POLICE]

I think Dix's meth dealer was surprised by the ridiculous amount dixie ordered yesterday, but sent it over anyway just for teh lulz.

 

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Meth meth dixie meth meth dixie meth meth meth dix-meth!

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

For the record, here is what we should have done... Let Insurance carriers compete across state lines, like the auto insurance does. That would have solved about 80% of the problems we have with 'affordability' right there. Did you know, if you have a clean driving record and no accidents in the past 5 years, you can call your insurance company and tell them you are thinking about switching insurance companies, give them a rate about $20 a month less than you are currently paying, and they will match it most of the time? It's true! (This is one of those things they tell you in some book you'll pay $49.95 for, but I just gave it to you for free.) My car insurance was $159 a month, it is now $79 a month, because I used this tactic every few months until it was reduced to that amount. It works, give it a try! If health insurance could compete like that, the SAME THING would happen, people could negotiate lower rates, and the cost of health insurance would be minuscule in most cases.

Once you have a capitalist free market system working, you can create a nationalized 'group rate' insurance program for people who fall in the cracks and can't get coverage, or lose their jobs, whatever... I have no problem with supplementing a plan to help people who are in need and without insurance coverage, but this monstrosity is a disaster, and has to be repealed ASAP.

 

[apple0154]

Yes. A "pay AND suffer" system sounds MUCH better!

Show one country that reverted. At least show one country that has a prominent politician campaigning on reverting.

From where do you get your ideas? When you hear politicians talking about the evils of universal medical have you ever done any research? If so, what have you discovered? Do you know of any country which reverted? Do you know of any country where it's on the political agenda?

Surely you have something. Or do you?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Show one country that reverted. At least show one country that has a prominent politician campaigning on reverting.

From where do you get your ideas? When you hear politicians talking about the evils of universal medical have you ever done any research? If so, what have you discovered? Do you know of any country which reverted? Do you know of any country where it's on the political agenda?

Surely you have something. Or do you?

Sure, show me one country with a Constitution and Declaration of Independence, operating as a Representative Republic such as ours, who provides full health care coverage for 300+ million citizens, and I'll be happy to! Unless you have such an example, it is irrelevant what another country does.

 

[apple0154]

For the zillionth time, you fucking idiot, where the hell is the money coming from to pay for it? We can't afford what we presently have on our plate, much less a massive bloated government-run health care system, where everyone is cared for at the expense of the government. We just CAN'T do it... there is not enough money to do it, not enough rich old farts to tax and pay for it! Try to get it through your dumbass head, nothing in the whole wide world is ever FREE! Someone will have to pay for every single thing the government does... they do not earn money! So what difference does it really make if the middle class pays $18k a year in premiums, or $20k a year in new taxes? Because that is essentially what your retarded ass is suggesting here.

Are you saying that of the dozens of countries that have universal medical the US is the poorest? Are you saying the US is so poor it can not afford to look after it's ill citizens?

That's what it sounds like to me but maybe I'm mistaken so I'll ask directly, "Are you saying the US is poorer than all the countries that have universal medical? Are you saying the US can not afford to look after it's ill citizens?

 

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Dixmeth too much meth!

 

[apple0154]

For the record, here is what we should have done... Let Insurance carriers compete across state lines, like the auto insurance does. That would have solved about 80% of the problems we have with 'affordability' right there. Did you know, if you have a clean driving record and no accidents in the past 5 years, you can call your insurance company and tell them you are thinking about switching insurance companies, give them a rate about $20 a month less than you are currently paying, and they will match it most of the time? It's true! (This is one of those things they tell you in some book you'll pay $49.95 for, but I just gave it to you for free.) My car insurance was $159 a month, it is now $79 a month, because I used this tactic every few months until it was reduced to that amount. It works, give it a try! If health insurance could compete like that, the SAME THING would happen, people could negotiate lower rates, and the cost of health insurance would be minuscule in most cases.

Once you have a capitalist free market system working, you can create a nationalized 'group rate' insurance program for people who fall in the cracks and can't get coverage, or lose their jobs, whatever... I have no problem with supplementing a plan to help people who are in need and without insurance coverage, but this monstrosity is a disaster, and has to be repealed ASAP.

So, if you understand the benefits of a "group rate" and know there isn't any bigger group than the entire population of the country then your only logical objection to a universal plan would be if you believe the majority of US citizens are ill. Is that what you believe?

 

[apple0154]

Sure, show me one country with a Constitution and Declaration of Independence, operating as a Representative Republic such as ours, who provides full health care coverage for 300+ million citizens, and I'll be happy to! Unless you have such an example, it is irrelevant what another country does.

Every country with a universal plan is different. There are capitalist countries and communist countries and socialist countries and rich countries and poor countries and countries with Kings and countries with Queens and countries with Prime Ministers and countries with dictators and there are large countries and small countries and on and on it goes. Countries with a large land area and a small population and countries with a large land area and a large population and countries with a small land area and a small population and countries with a small land area and a large population and on and on it goes.

Why do you have such little faith in your country?

On that note I have to get my beauty sleep.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Are you saying that of the dozens of countries that have universal medical the US is the poorest? Are you saying the US is so poor it can not afford to look after it's ill citizens?

That's what it sounds like to me but maybe I'm mistaken so I'll ask directly, "Are you saying the US is poorer than all the countries that have universal medical? Are you saying the US can not afford to look after it's ill citizens?

I'm saying that the dozens of countries you continue to cite, are nowhere NEAR the size of ours, and in most cases, do not operate within the framework of democracy, and are for the most part, socialist communist countries ruled by dictators. I'm also saying that in every single instance, the quality of health care is far diminished from what we are accustomed to in America, and it is not promptly available to most people. I posted a comparative chart a while back, showing the average waiting time for a kidney transplant in other countries with nationalized health care, compared with American health care, and it was astonishing what a difference there was.

You are pumping out liberal propaganda you've been filled with, and it's not truthful or honest in any respect. In short, you haven't the slightest clue of what you're talking about, you are just parroting nonsense from your masters, like a good little idiot socialist.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Every country with a universal plan is different. There are capitalist countries and communist countries and socialist countries and rich countries and poor countries and countries with Kings and countries with Queens and countries with Prime Ministers and countries with dictators and there are large countries and small countries and on and on it goes. Countries with a large land area and a small population and countries with a large land area and a large population and countries with a small land area and a small population and countries with a small land area and a large population and on and on it goes.

And to the letter, every one of them pale in comparison to the quality of health care offered in America. This is precisely why their dignitaries travel to America for medical treatments, instead of having them done in their own country.

 

[Canceled2]

I'm saying that the dozens of countries you continue to cite, are nowhere NEAR the size of ours, and in most cases, do not operate within the framework of democracy, and are for the most part, socialist communist countries ruled by dictators. I'm also saying that in every single instance, the quality of health care is far diminished from what we are accustomed to in America, and it is not promptly available to most people. I posted a comparative chart a while back, showing the average waiting time for a kidney transplant in other countries with nationalized health care, compared with American health care, and it was astonishing what a difference there was.

You are pumping out liberal propaganda you've been filled with, and it's not truthful or honest in any respect. In short, you haven't the slightest clue of what you're talking about, you are just parroting nonsense from your masters, like a good little idiot socialist.

And you forgot to add all of them got rid of their anchor baby status years ago~

 

[FUCK THE POLICE]

And to the letter, every one of them pale in comparison to the quality of health care offered in America.

In the imagination of right wingers, sure. In reality, no. America has the worst healthcare out of developed nations, due to free market policies.

 

[zoombwaz]

The only delusion here is your defense of the current health care ripoff.

But what really got my attention is your sig line, which says( and I quote):

Pinhead's Say The Darnedest Things:
"Almost nothing about God can be proven."
~Jarod

Apparently, you find this quote of his very amusing. Why so? And why do you think the plural of pinhead has an apostrophe in it, when it clearly does not? I know what is wrong with his statement, but it's minor, and I don't think that's the kind of thing you get your jollies over. So what is it about Jarod statement that you find so amusing? Is it the inclusion of the word almost, or is it the whole rest of the quote that you find amusing and if so, why?

I await your explanation.