BMW says goodbye to electric cars

T. A. Gardner said:
Hydrogen can be stored as a liquid. That happens all the time. It doesn't require much pressure for that to happen, but rather just keeping it very cold.

nasakscliquidhydrogendewar.jpg
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Okay, but I don't think you understand the cost of liquifaction of that much hydrogen, both in money and in energy.
You MIGHT want to look at that tank again too. It's built to withstand tremendous pressures! This one only stores hydrogen temporarily, as rockets are being prepared for launch.
 
Lionfish said:
Joey wets his very heavy panties

Electric Vehicles Have A Weight Problem

A crash test study conducted by researchers at The University of Nebraska holds troubling news for the electric vehicle industry and policymakers focused on forcing the cars on consumers. The Canadian Press reports that the study has found what anyone able to reason critically has known for years, which is that US highway guardrails are not strong enough to withstand the force of EVs that weigh 1,000 – 4,000 lbs. more than their gas-powered counterparts.
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An opinion piece from the Daily Caller. Get the fuck outta here.
 
Nordberg said:
Biden? He knows that we have to try and save the environment. That is why he pushes EVs. He believes what 98 percent of environmental scientists do. I am sure he wishes he did not have this fight. The anti-science people come from all strata of society. It may not be a winning political position. But he is trying to do the right thing.
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Hydrogen is still a better alternative than gasoline. I don't see Biden opposing hydrogen in favor of electric. The OP is just too stupid to understand that hydrogen vehicles are still a green option and thinks that they spell the death of EVs.
 
Into the Night said:
Okay, but I don't think you understand the cost of liquifaction of that much hydrogen, both in money and in energy.
You MIGHT want to look at that tank again too. It's built to withstand tremendous pressures! This one only stores hydrogen temporarily, as rockets are being prepared for launch.
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That's where you go big on nuclear and eventually on fusion. You dump the piddle power options like wind and solar entirely. As for the tank, it is a dewar. That is, it's a vacuum bottle. It has to withstand 15 psi of atmospheric pressure versus the near zero in the space between the inner and outer walls.
 
Into the Night said:
Fossils aren't used as fuel. Natural gas, oil products, and coal are used as fuels. NONE of them are fossils.
Oil and natural gas are renewable fuels. Coal? We don't know. It may or may not be renewable, but it's certainly cheap. There's plenty of it!
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The theory that fossil fuels formed from the fossilized remains of dead plants by exposure to heat and pressure in Earth's crust over millions of years was first introduced by Andreas Libavius "in his 1597 Alchemia [Alchymia]" and later by Mikhail Lomonosov "as early as 1757 and certainly by 1763".[21] The first use of the term "fossil fuel" occurs in the work of the German chemist Caspar Neumann, in English translation in 1759.[22] The Oxford English Dictionary notes that in the phrase "fossil fuel" the adjective "fossil" means "[o]btained by digging; found buried in the earth", which dates to at least 1652,[23] before the English noun "fossil" came to refer primarily to long-dead organisms in the early 18th century.[24]
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fossil_fuel

:facepalm:
 
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T. A. Gardner said:
That's where you go big on nuclear and eventually on fusion. You dump the piddle power options like wind and solar entirely. As for the tank, it is a dewar. That is, it's a vacuum bottle. It has to withstand 15 psi of atmospheric pressure versus the near zero in the space between the inner and outer walls.
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You are forgetting what's in the inner container itself.
It is NOT at 15psi.

There are no fusion reactors.
I have no problem with fission reactors, despite the fact that the fuel they use is not renewable, but they use so little of it to do the job that it's practical.

Yes. Dump the piddle power options like wind and solar mandates entirely. This kind of communism and fascism is just the same tyranny. It does not 'save the planet'.
 
ExpressLane said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fossil_fuel

:facepalm:
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You can't use Wikipedia to define words, dude.

A fossil is an image or a plant or animal cast in stone or that has become stone. Typically, fossils are found in sedimentary rock and are made up of carbonates.

Coal is not a fossil (but it may contain fossils). Coal is primarily carbon, an element.
Oil is not a fossil. It is a liquid. It is a hydrocarbon. It does not come from fossils. Oil is found MUCH deeper than any fossil layer and is a renewable fuel.
Natural gas is not a fossil. It is a gas. It is a hydrocarbon. It does not come from fossils. Natural gas is found in biology (farts), compost piles, other bacteriological action, along with oil, and even in their own wells. It is a renewable fuel.

I suggest you become familiar with the Fischer-Tropsche process (which synthesis hydrocarbons from carbon dioxide (or carbon monoxide) and hydrogen, using heat, pressure, and an iron catalyst...all conditions found naturally underground.

The theory that hydrocarbons came from fossils has been falsified. They are found WELL below any fossil layers, and the Fischer-Tropsche process shows why.
 

A new global hydrogen car market study claimed hydrogen-powered cars are predicted to become widely used by 2028. The study assesses the market’s potential for growth and offers strategic insights and market intelligence to help decision-makers make informed decisions.

The report mentioned that the fuel cell car market is projected to increase from its 2018 valuation of $651.9 million to $42.04 billion by 2026, which translates into a compound annual growth rate of 66.9% between 2019 and 2026. Despite the growing popularity of zero-emission vehicles for public usage, battery-electric vehicles have dominated the market for the last ten years.​
However, because of recent funding and subsidies, growing concerns about the cost and environmental impact of mining rare metals needed for batteries, and declining costs for sustainable energy, automakers, governments, and consumers are beginning to view hydrogen more positively.

For some years, automakers have been experimenting with hydrogen fuel cells and hydrogen combustion technologies in an attempt to figure out how to use the most abundant resource on the planet to power their vehicles. While there has been progress, it has been slow compared to the development of battery-electric vehicle technology.​

There are now just two prominent hydrogen-powered cars available on the market: the Hyundai Nexo and the Toyota Mirai. But more hydrogen-powered cars and vans are confirmed to be on the way, with plans for new models from manufacturers like BMW, Land Rover, and Vauxhall within the next five years.

he US Department of Energy will invest billions of dollars​

The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) in charge of developing national energy policies to ensure energy security, promote energy independence, and foster affordability is ready to invest billions of dollars. According to DOE’s Vehicle Technologies Office, $131 million will be invested to boost the nation’s battery supply chain and supercharging electric vehicle innovation.

From the total investment, $71 million will go to 27 projects specialized in developing innovative clean mobility solutions and $10.5 million to three main projects focused on research, development, and demonstration of hydrogen combustion engines.

The three main awardees’ projects working on hydrogen combustion engine innovation include:


  • Paccar. The company, located in Mount Vernon, WA, intends to build and demonstrate a potent hydrogen engine for trucks and other large vehicles to take on the heavy-duty market.
  • Cummins. The corporation’s research focuses on emissions and efficiency to develop a hydrogen engine for heavy-duty applications that is environmentally responsible and gives great performance. Cummins is located in Columbus, IN.
  • Powertrain. The company is located in Plymouth, MI, and is aiming to target a different market niche: high-power applications. They hope to transform industries like motorsports and performance cars by creating an ultra-low-emission hydrogen engine.
Promoting and investing in these companies’ efforts will have a great impact on the long road to a more sustainable and clean future by cutting emissions across industries.

Is hydrogen only set to power commercial vehicles?

While hydrogen combustion engines are currently receiving increased attention in the context of heavy-duty commercial vehicles, some say their potential could extend beyond that specific segment. However, the National Government predicts that hydrogen will be centered on difficult-to-decarbonize transport modes, such as heavy road freight.

In the late 2020s and early 2030s, drivers are expected to see a greater diversity of transport end uses as the automobile industry continues to demonstrate larger-scale applications. According to Car magazine’s analysis, hydrogen is envisioned to be used in a variety of transportation modes by 2030, such as HGVs, buses, and rail, in addition to its initial use in commercial shipping and aviation.

Moreover, the magazine acknowledges that not even the government’s white paper anticipates widespread adoption among private automobile owners. Nevertheless, more internationally conscious automakers will still make efforts to implement it.

https://lagradaonline.com/en/us-hydrogen-billions-dollars/
 
Into the Night said:
No need. Customers (or the lack of them) and their own costs will do that. Claiming 'expert' worship won't get you around the ideal gas law or the costs with producing hydrogen, dude.
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d2c8d04c531f115da870a0bf08bf22fe



The hydrogen ICE truck under development by Reliance Industries and Ashok LeylandPhoto: Reliance Industries

Keep up with the latest developments in the international hydrogen industry with the free Accelerate Hydrogen newsletter. Sign up now for an unbiased, clear-sighted view of the fast-growing hydrogen sector.

An unnamed senior executive at Reliance, which is owned by billionaire Mukesh Ambani, told Indian website Autocar Professional that the company plans to have all H2 ICE units fitted by mid-2024 — a wildly ambitious timescale that would only be feasible with the resources afforded to a company of Reliance’s size.

All of the trucks will be used by Reliance — which is an oil & gas producer, energy generator and petrochemical refiner, as well as having a media arm — for its own business operations, the official said.

The report comes just a year after Reliance unveiled its first hydrogen truck, retrofitted in collaboration with Indian truckmaker Ashok Leyland and billed at the time as India’s first domestically-produced H2 internal combustion engines. After getting the first engine up and running in 2022, the company has spent the last year carrying out “advanced tests” on the technology in trucks at Reliance’s plant at Jamnagar in Gujarat. However, it is not clear whether Reliance and Ashok Leyland have developed the H2 engine technology themselves, or whether they are buying in from a third-party supplier.

“We have had near zero downtime in the trials and we have found that H2 ICE powered hydrogen trucks are three times more efficient than diesel,” the senior company official said. “We will start introducing these in our fleet before rolling out the entire ecosystem for a hydrogen powered economy"

US engineering giant Cummins and Indian industrial conglomerate Tata have already announced plans to spend 35.4 billion rupees ($426m) to jointly build a massive factory in India that will produce up to 4,000 hydrogen internal combustion engines per year.



Toyota to mass-produce hydrogen electrolysers in partnership with Chiyoda

https://www.hydrogeninsight.com/tra...ustion-engines-before-july-report/2-1-1594011
 
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serendipity said:
[FONT=&]
[/FONT][FONT=&]
d2c8d04c531f115da870a0bf08bf22fe



The hydrogen ICE truck under development by Reliance Industries and Ashok LeylandPhoto: Reliance Industries

[/FONT][FONT=&][FONT=&]Keep up with the latest developments in the international hydrogen industry with the free Accelerate Hydrogen newsletter. Sign up now for an unbiased, clear-sighted view of the fast-growing hydrogen sector.[/FONT]

An unnamed senior executive at Reliance, which is owned by billionaire Mukesh Ambani, told Indian website Autocar Professional that the company plans to have all H2 ICE units fitted by mid-2024 — a wildly ambitious timescale that would only be feasible with the resources afforded to a company of Reliance’s size.

All of the trucks will be used by Reliance — which is an oil & gas producer, energy generator and petrochemical refiner, as well as having a media arm — for its own business operations, the official said.

The report comes just a year after Reliance unveiled its first hydrogen truck, retrofitted in collaboration with Indian truckmaker Ashok Leyland and billed at the time as India’s first domestically-produced H2 internal combustion engines. After getting the first engine up and running in 2022, the company has spent the last year carrying out “advanced tests” on the technology in trucks at Reliance’s plant at Jamnagar in Gujarat. However, it is not clear whether Reliance and Ashok Leyland have developed the H2 engine technology themselves, or whether they are buying in from a third-party supplier.

“We have had near zero downtime in the trials and we have found that H2 ICE powered hydrogen trucks are three times more efficient than diesel,” the senior company official said. “We will start introducing these in our fleet before rolling out the entire ecosystem for a hydrogen powered economy"

US engineering giant Cummins and Indian industrial conglomerate Tata have already announced plans to spend 35.4 billion rupees ($426m) to jointly build a massive factory in India that will produce up to 4,000 hydrogen internal combustion engines per year.


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Toyota to mass-produce hydrogen electrolysers in partnership with Chiyoda[/FONT]
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https://www.hydrogeninsight.com/tra...ustion-engines-before-july-report/2-1-1594011
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Hydrogen cars already exist. They have NOT been able to overcome the problems I've described.
 
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