Columbia University to No Longer Require SAT/ACT for Undergrad Admissions

That's one perspective.
It's up to the academic institution itself to determine if SAT scores are a good indicator for that school's own academic agenda.

I didn't get great SAT scores myself, not quite reaching a combined score of 1300, to be honest, so I'm not looking at this from a self-serving perspective.

Ahh, but there lies the rub. One institution that is used as a gradient on resumes uses a test that is proven to be flawed in many respects.....much less as a guarded gateway for those seeking knowledge. Not good for society all round.
 
As you know school choice is about the parent choosing where the tax money for their child will be spent. Nice try though.
We have public schools, that is where tax money goes. If you wish your child to attend private school, you may do so at your own expense.
 
We have public schools, that is where tax money goes. If you wish your child to attend private school, you may do so at your own expense.

I prefer Arizona's answer to that: Provide each and every parent with the opportunity to get a voucher equal to the money that would go to public education and the parents get to choose the school they send their child to. That would force public schools to improve their performance or they lose lots of money.

Throwing money at public schools with no guarantee of performance is idiotic.
 
I prefer Arizona's answer to that: Provide each and every parent with the opportunity to get a voucher equal to the money that would go to public education and the parents get to choose the school they send their child to. That would force public schools to improve their performance or they lose lots of money.

Throwing money at public schools with no guarantee of performance is idiotic.
How do you guarantee performance? We are talking about human children not circus monkeys. This is the whole problem with modern education.
 
How do you guarantee performance? We are talking about human children not circus monkeys. This is the whole problem with modern education.

I would start with rigorous testing of both teachers and students. It can be figured out. Without that, throwing money at schools is a worthless proposition.
 
If the entrance qualification standards are lowered, the education presented must be lowered to accommodate these unqualified students.

Otherwise, why lower the entrance qualifications?



The agenda of the left is to lower the standards to allow non-qualified students to attend universities.

Why do the educational standards have to be lowered? Just more people flunk out. The SATs are not really that informative bout a person's future success. https://collegeprep.uworld.com/sat/...g546nyfGt3UGRcmD06u-zxKXdox5mdRhoCPZ8QAvD_BwE There Is an industry teaching kids how to take SATs.
 
Why do the educational standards have to be lowered? Just more people flunk out. The SATs are not really that informative bout a person's future success. https://collegeprep.uworld.com/sat/...g546nyfGt3UGRcmD06u-zxKXdox5mdRhoCPZ8QAvD_BwE There Is an industry teaching kids how to take SATs.

Actually research shows it is predicative of how a student will preform once on campus, it’s why schools use them. Unless you buy the argument they are racists test used to keep non Asian minorities out of (top) Universities.
 
Poor people need to save their kids now. You could give the school choice kids 90% of the tax dollars so the public schools so every kid the public school does not have to educate they make 10% on. So it is a win win. The average high school student in the us costs $13,701. So the kid could have a $12,000 voucher and the public school gets $1,700 for nothing.

State

Average Cost of Private School

Alaska

$6,790

Alabama

$7,282

Arkansas

$6,107

Arizona

$10,508

California

$14,975

Colorado

$12,219

Delaware

$11,158

Florida

$9,160

Georgia

$10,675

Hawaii

$13,206

Iowa

$5,268

Idaho

$8,293

Illinois

$8,273

Indiana

$7,120

Kansas

$7,937

Kentucky

$7,159

Louisiana

$6,925

Maryland

$13,054

Michigan

$7,191

Minnesota

$6,994

Missouri

$9,998

Mississippi

$5,542

Montana

$8,771

North Carolina

$9,947

Nebraska

$3,797

New Jersey

$13,936

New Mexico

$8,884

Nevada

$10,561

Ohio

$7,001

Oklahoma

$6,514

Oregon

$9,775

Pennsylvania

$11,637

South Carolina

$6,909

South Dakota

$3,624

Tennessee

$10,185

Texas

$9,866

Utah

$11,204

Virginia

$14,274

Washington

$11,812

Wisconsin

$4,591

West Virginia

$6,239

Wyoming

$7,238

Related: A Parents’ Guide To Saving for Education
https://www.yahoo.com/video/42-states-where-private-school-180007815.html

You left out new york.
 
That's one perspective.
It's up to the academic institution itself to determine if SAT scores are a good indicator for that school's own academic agenda.

I didn't get great SAT scores myself, not quite reaching a combined score of 1300, to be honest, so I'm not looking at this from a self-serving perspective.

1300 would be a great score if you took the test 30 or more years ago when it was much tougher. You could get into MENSA based on SAT scores long ago!! But of course you are a tranny negro and never got close to 1300. Not even half that. When MLK took the GRE (using the same 200-800 scale as the SAT) in the 50s he got a 270 and a 350!!!! He was off the charts dumb.
 
1300 would be a great score if you took the test 30 or more years ago when it was much tougher. You could get into MENSA based on SAT scores long ago!! But of course you are a tranny negro and never got close to 1300. Not even half that. When MLK took the GRE (using the same 200-800 scale as the SAT) in the 50s he got a 270 and a 350!!!! He was off the charts dumb.

I took the SATs roughly sixty years, so that's one thing,
and I just missed 1300, which is what those of us serious about getting into good schools thought we might need. I got in, anyway.

As for your historical anecdotes, I afford them the same credibility status that I afford you, i.e., a waste of bandwidth.
 
Ahh, but there lies the rub. One institution that is used as a gradient on resumes uses a test that is proven to be flawed in many respects.....much less as a guarded gateway for those seeking knowledge. Not good for society all round.

That's possibly a valid point if the tests are really proven to be that flawed. I'm skeptical, but I can't know for sure.

Nevertheless, the intent seems to be to get young people enrolled who have not made the adequate preparations to study at these academic institutions.
I don't care about the reason why somebody can't compose a grammatically correct declarative sentence in the King's English.
If there are reasons for that, address and mitigate those situations.

The applicants still need to be able to do it, even for community college, never mind Columbia.
You're, I'm assuming, black, and you can obviously do it. It's not a racial thing. It's "Did you do the work?"
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
Ahh, but there lies the rub. One institution that is used as a gradient on resumes uses a test that is proven to be flawed in many respects.....much less as a guarded gateway for those seeking knowledge. Not good for society all round.



That's possibly a valid point if the tests are really proven to be that flawed. I'm skeptical, but I can't know for sure.

Nevertheless, the intent seems to be to get young people enrolled who have not made the adequate preparations to study at these academic institutions.
I don't care about the reason why somebody can't compose a grammatically correct declarative sentence in the King's English.
If there are reasons for that, address and mitigate those situations.

The applicants still need to be able to do it, even for community college, never mind Columbia.
You're, I'm assuming, black, and you can obviously do it. It's not a racial thing. It's "Did you do the work?"

Your first sentence says it all....If you're not sure, it's better to err on the side of caution. Suspending or cancelling the test does that.

No, that is NOT the intent. The intent is to find some type of generalized academic test to determine the next step in a young adult's education. Some are ready for Ivy league but hit just below the requirements for scholarship because the parents can't afford the tuition. Some are NOT ready but have parents who are "legacy" and/or prominent donors. Some are ready but the tests ask the wrong questions, and visa versa.

I know of kids who are auto mechanical geniuses doing "pick up" work for friends and local garages, but never saw the inside of a tech school and were generally low performing grade & high school students. SAT doesn't do a damned thing for them.

And so it goes, as the lady said.
 
Your first sentence says it all....If you're not sure, it's better to err on the side of caution. Suspending or cancelling the test does that.

No, that is NOT the intent. The intent is to find some type of generalized academic test to determine the next step in a young adult's education. Some are ready for Ivy league but hit just below the requirements for scholarship because the parents can't afford the tuition. Some are NOT ready but have parents who are "legacy" and/or prominent donors. Some are ready but the tests ask the wrong questions, and visa versa.

I know of kids who are auto mechanical geniuses doing "pick up" work for friends and local garages, but never saw the inside of a tech school and were generally low performing grade & high school students. SAT doesn't do a damned thing for them.

And so it goes, as the lady said.

I don't want my comments to convey either an anti-education vibe or an elitist vibe, even though the later is part of my schtick for humor purposes.

Our public schools are funded by local property taxes and controlled by locally elected amateur school committee members.
I can't think of a better way to institutionalize inequity in education.

If the schools were funded by the federal income tax and controlled by qualified Doctors of Education in the Department of Education,
we might come close to an education system worthy of the wealthiest nation on the earth. Resources would reflect equality and create equal opportunity.

I grew up in the city. We didn't have school buses. Our schools were right around the corner. We could walk to them K-12.
[Living in Boston, I could walk to them K-16.]

Then some judge decided that since the neighborhoods were not all ethnically diverse, the students weren't being educated properly.
Well, the truth is that the students weren't all educated properly because the schools weren't necessarily funded equally.

You would not have gained a fucking thing being bused to my neighborhood to attend class with some Italian kids from the North End.
You would have met them anyway at the baseball [we win] and basketball [you win] games.
You didn't need Italian kids to learn. You needed a good fucking school with good fucking teachers, and if your classmates were all a similar color or
if they looked like a bag of M&Ms, that wouldn't matter one fucking bit.

You see, good intentions, like the ones that broke up the neighborhood school system, don't get jack shit done.
Making the right moves get worthwhile things accomplished, and nothing is more worthwhile than all kids getting good education opportunities,

You can't do well in college if you didn't kill your K-12 shit, but let's help everybody kill their K-12 shit right now, not get kids who didn't do that into Harvard and MIT..
And you're right to bring up post high school vocational education which is a good choice for many people of every ethnicity and which will support
a good standard of living.

Beyond that, while there may still be a place for expensive private education, even if it's just to keep the public schools honest, public education for ALL has to be extended way beyond K-12.
Plenty of America's best universities are not private schools, and employers recognize that. Let's make them recognize that more.

And as we know, it's not just traditional colleges but
vocational colleges that are needed badly.

If nobody can fix our plumbing, we're all fucked. Doctor of PVC is one of the most essential careers in America.
People who can fix electric cars aren't exactly bloating the population either.
 
Lower the entrance standards and the teaching standards for any university are lowered.

The teaching standards would have to be lowered to accommodate those who can not keep up.

You do not improve the standards of a university...or any other group...by lowering the entrance standards.

Raising the entrance standards would raise the teaching standards.

The phrase, dumbing down America, comes to mind.

Let’s lower the MCAT test standards so that doctors are less skilled in saving lives.

Good grief.
 
Man, the bats are really busy under the Big Dumb Dog's pointy hood tonight! Talk about "triggered"!

You say you want an honest debate. Then prove those points I posted are wrong.

You can skip Israel and just address the Black American issues, since you've already denied BDS, nukes for Iran, Talib and Omar are leftwing. Or that the leftists were angered by the recognition of Jerusalem as the capitol of Israel, the U.S. embassy HQ move to there, recognition of the Golan Heights, the killing of Soleimani, the killing of ISIS leaders, and the Abraham accords.

No white lib has ever been able to do that. Maybe you'll be the first. :dunno:
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
Your first sentence says it all....If you're not sure, it's better to err on the side of caution. Suspending or cancelling the test does that.

No, that is NOT the intent. The intent is to find some type of generalized academic test to determine the next step in a young adult's education. Some are ready for Ivy league but hit just below the requirements for scholarship because the parents can't afford the tuition. Some are NOT ready but have parents who are "legacy" and/or prominent donors. Some are ready but the tests ask the wrong questions, and visa versa.

I know of kids who are auto mechanical geniuses doing "pick up" work for friends and local garages, but never saw the inside of a tech school and were generally low performing grade & high school students. SAT doesn't do a damned thing for them.

And so it goes, as the lady said.


I don't want my comments to convey either an anti-education vibe or an elitist vibe, even though the later is part of my schtick for humor purposes.

Our public schools are funded by local property taxes and controlled by locally elected amateur school committee members.
I can't think of a better way to institutionalize inequity in education.

If the schools were funded by the federal income tax and controlled by qualified Doctors of Education in the Department of Education,
we might come close to an education system worthy of the wealthiest nation on the earth. Resources would reflect equality and create equal opportunity.

I grew up in the city. We didn't have school buses. Our schools were right around the corner. We could walk to them K-12.
[Living in Boston, I could walk to them K-16.]

Then some judge decided that since the neighborhoods were not all ethnically diverse, the students weren't being educated properly.
Well, the truth is that the students weren't all educated properly because the schools weren't necessarily funded equally.

You would not have gained a fucking thing being bused to my neighborhood to attend class with some Italian kids from the North End.
You would have met them anyway at the baseball [we win] and basketball [you win] games.
You didn't need Italian kids to learn. You needed a good fucking school with good fucking teachers, and if your classmates were all a similar color or
if they looked like a bag of M&Ms, that wouldn't matter one fucking bit.

You see, good intentions, like the ones that broke up the neighborhood school system, don't get jack shit done.
Making the right moves get worthwhile things accomplished, and nothing is more worthwhile than all kids getting good education opportunities,

You can't do well in college if you didn't kill your K-12 shit, but let's help everybody kill their K-12 shit right now, not get kids who didn't do that into Harvard and MIT..
And you're right to bring up post high school vocational education which is a good choice for many people of every ethnicity and which will support
a good standard of living.

Beyond that, while there may still be a place for expensive private education, even if it's just to keep the public schools honest, public education for ALL has to be extended way beyond K-12.
Plenty of America's best universities are not private schools, and employers recognize that. Let's make them recognize that more.

And as we know, it's not just traditional colleges but
vocational colleges that are needed badly.

If nobody can fix our plumbing, we're all fucked. Doctor of PVC is one of the most essential careers in America.
People who can fix electric cars aren't exactly bloating the population either.


... Then some judge decided that since the neighborhoods were not all ethnically diverse, the students weren't being educated properly.
Well, the truth is that the students weren't all educated properly because the schools weren't necessarily funded equally.


BINGO!

And instead of the Fed stepping in, kicking ass and taking names to make those inequalities disappear (they didn't have the cojones to re-enact a version of the integration challenges of the 1960's & 70's) you got the SOS state independence vs. federal gov't stuff, and the result was the disaster of "bussing".

But aside from that, I suspect you and I are on the same page with regards to my previous post. If not, set me straight.
 
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