Illinois charged murder of unborn

TOP said:
So you don't consider her unborn child a baby?
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The words "unborn child" sound to me like the title of a cheap horror movie. If you are asking me if I consider a blastocyte, embryo, or fetus a baby...NO, I DO NOT.

But even if it is, I consider it a right of a woman to terminate a pregnancy occurring in her own body if she chooses.

Do you consider a blastocyte, embryo or fetus a baby?

Does our government?
 
volsrock said:
u stated "The charge means nothing."
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Yeah, I did. And I was wrong to state what I was attempting to say that way.

Good catch. I was wrong...you are correct...I apologize and withdraw the comment.

In its place I will substitute, "The charge is only a charge. Being convicted of the charge is something else entirely. Some charges are proved sufficiently for conviction; some are not."
 
volsrock said:
Pregnant woman, 22, is decapitated as her family planned baby shower: Horror as head is found in a dumpster outside house as police charge her 'savage monster' ex-boyfriend, 22, with murdering her and unborn child

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...9409b-0e88-4f53-9198-a5fd8ca6a112&ai=10918797

Illinois is a blue state



murdering her and unborn child

WAIT WTF ...I thought u couldn't murder the unborn?
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The mother did not want the baby aborted--very different. Murder is defined by law and many states include murder of the unborn baby (even if the mother was not killed) as murder.
 
GEICO lost a case and has to pay out because a women got an STD from unprotected sex in a car they insured

nothing surprises me any more
 
We're still a strongly patriarchal society, as are most around the globe.

Opposing abortion isn't about "life" for most. It's about controlling women.
 
Libs ok with the existence of criminal murder charges for the willful murder of unborn children, when the mother wanted the child. If mother does not want the child its A-OK to willful slaughter the child.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Yup. Some fetuses are more developed than others.

But still not a baby.
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That's a baby...very possibly viable outside of the mother had there been an opportunity to save the little girl... And the person was so charged...
 
It was a fetus.

Some jurisdictions "consider" it to be a baby...some do not.

The federal government does not. Almost none of the states do completely.
 
Frank Apisa said:
It was a fetus.

Some jurisdictions "consider" it to be a baby...some do not.

The federal government does not. Almost none of the states do completely.
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California does

Feticide is the act of killing a fetus. Under California Penal Code Section 187(a), murder is defined as the unlawful killing of a human being or fetus by another human being with malice aforethought.
 
Frank Apisa said:
Yup. Some fetuses are more developed than others.

But still not a baby.
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There are people who have "fetus showers".... but we all know... those are really baby showers...;)
A woman who has a miscarriage loses a child. Does she not? A couple who discovers "they" are pregnant celebrate and care for the child who is developing and on the way...they don't sing to the fetus and plan for the fetus... People who adopt from a mother who decides to give up her baby celebrate and look forward to the birth...And follow along as the baby develops. When our children were growing and developing, we did not refer to them as anything but our babies....did we?
It's pretty clear when and why "blastocyte, embryo, fetus" are the go to words....
 
volsrock said:
California does

Feticide is the act of killing a fetus. Under California Penal Code Section 187(a), murder is defined as the unlawful killing of a human being or fetus by another human being with malice aforethought.
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California DOES NOT recognize a fetus to be a baby...completely.

Yes, there is a law that makes it a crime to kill a fetus. But it is a fetus...not a baby.
 
Frank Apisa said:
I do not recognize what is termed "an unborn child" to be a baby. An "unborn child" may be a blastocyte, embryo, or fetus. A "baby" is a "baby."

I am joined in that opinion by huge numbers.
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A baby is a baby....an unborn child, as you mention...at any stage of development...the other terms are also applicable...but no parent uses them...
But you are, of course, entitled to your opinion...and I to mine...;)
 
Frank Apisa said:
California DOES NOT recognize a fetus to be a baby...completely.

Yes, there is a law that makes it a crime to kill a fetus. But it is a fetus...not a baby.
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A fetus is an unborn child. CALCRIM 520 (California Criminal Jury Instructions) defines a fetus as “an unborn human being that has progressed beyond the embryonic stage after major structures have been outlined, which occurs at seven to eight weeks of development.”

https://www.lacriminaldefenseattorney.com/legal-dictionary/f/feticide/
 
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