Rationing and long lines

[Damocles]

I don't know anyone who's gone to the US to be treated. It is very, very expensive, you know.

Why fly to the States when you can just go private here or go to Europe for reasonable rates?

What? You know you want to... It's okay. Spend extravagantly... We'll get you the liposuction you need.

The Brits didn't make it illegal to have private clinics and the Canadians illegally run private clinics that people can go to and pay. There's no worries, SM. When the US screws it up we'll have back-alley clinics too.

 

[Good Luck]

You do know that I am breaking the law by buying that drug overseas as a result of the infamous Medicare Part D law passed by the GOP Majority at 5am after a delay of the final vote count for hours. So much for "over-regulation" pleas by Republicans. In the same law they also forbad Medicare from negotiating for lower drug prices, yet now they rag on Medicare for inefficiencies. The above restrictions were placed there by lobbyists(Tauzin/Hastert/Delay) in order to preserve PROFIT to the industry and adding to the burden of higher costs to the American people. If a drug company nets 8-12 percent on Public Health, that is a cost the people must pay. If, as a result of those profits, huge executive bonuses are triggered, yet another cost is added. Finally, if those profits result in additional dividends to shareholders, still more cost is added to the Healthcare system.
I would bet a whole bunch of money that layers of profit far exceed the cost of tort actions against the industry, control of which which seems to be the only efficiency fostered by the Right.

Yes, there are ridiculous cost-increasing regulations that were written by republicans. There are cost-increasing regulations written by democrats.

My POINT is that federal regulations are a HUGE part of the problem of health care costs. Until/unless we are willing to look long and hard at these regulations they will continue to be a huge part of the problem, from those that govern medical research, to those that govern the introduction of new medications/equipment/procedures, to those that govern how lawsuits are handled and the resulting regulations on malpractice insurance, to those that govern how our current federal health care assistance dollars are spent. ALL of it needs to be examined, and rewritten so they do what they what they are supposed to do without all the additional waste, graft, and unneeded red tape thrown in. Until we do that, the term "reform" is just a political tool for big government dunderheads to suck on like a teat.

 

[belme1201]

Yes, there are ridiculous cost-increasing regulations that were written by republicans. There are cost-increasing regulations written by democrats.

My POINT is that federal regulations are a HUGE part of the problem of health care costs. Until/unless we are willing to look long and hard at these regulations they will continue to be a huge part of the problem, from those that govern medical research, to those that govern the introduction of new medications/equipment/procedures, to those that govern how lawsuits are handled and the resulting regulations on malpractice insurance, to those that govern how our current federal health care assistance dollars are spent. ALL of it needs to be examined, and rewritten so they do what they what they are supposed to do without all the additional waste, graft, and unneeded red tape thrown in. Until we do that, the term "reform" is just a political tool for big government dunderheads to suck on like a teat.

I agree, but there comes a time to accept the fact that the status-quo is a failure and go on from there. There are those out there in the industry and bought-and-paid-for politicians who would be quite content to do absolutely nothing. With change, we may and probably will make mistakes, but if we don't start a path to change soon, the Healthcare system will destroy us while it enriches the already wealthy even more. The insurance business adds absolutely nothing to the quality of healthcare, the opposite being the truth, yet with Part D etc. we subsidize them.
For how much longer can private business be required to be the healthcare provider of last resort and still be competitive in the world? The Chinese, Mexicans and Indians must love it while the Canadians and Europeans laugh at us and marvel at our stupidity.

 

[DamnYankee]

I don't know anyone who's gone to the US to be treated. It is very, very expensive, you know.

Why fly to the States when you can just go private here or go to Europe for reasonable rates?

Just because you don't know any doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Rick folks who get the shaft in GB do it, and Canadians of moderate means drive over to get stuff done. Apparently getting well means more to these folks than saving money. *shrug*

 

[Demwit]

A neighbor lady had a heart attack. Had to go to 3 hospitals before they had a room available for her.

 

[cawacko]

A neighbor lady had a heart attack. Had to go to 3 hospitals before they had a room available for her.

Besides my condolences to the woman is there a point to that?

 

[charver]

Just because you don't know any doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Rick folks who get the shaft in GB do it, and Canadians of moderate means drive over to get stuff done. Apparently getting well means more to these folks than saving money. *shrug*

I'm guessing the numbers are pretty tiny but if you can show me some figures proving that millions of Britons are paying over the odds for American health care then go ahead.

 

[uscitizen]

Besides my condolences to the woman is there a point to that?

We do not have as many beds per capita as France does. Empty beds cost the industry lost income.
So is health care as available here as in France?
The thread topic was waiting lines and rationing.

 

[DamnYankee]

I'm guessing the numbers are pretty tiny but if you can show me some figures proving that millions of Britons are paying over the odds for American health care then go ahead.

I'm not saying millions, just folks with money who can't get what they need at home. Where will they go? *shrug*

 

[charver]

I'm not saying millions, just folks with money who can't get what they need at home. Where will they go? *shrug*

And i've already said. They can go private in the UK or they can opt to get treatment in any number of European hospitals.

There are hardly any British people choosing to go to the US for treatment. Again, if you have figures that say different you can always post them.

 

[DamnYankee]

And i've already said. They can go private in the UK or they can opt to get treatment in any number of European hospitals.

There are hardly any British people choosing to go to the US for treatment. Again, if you have figures that say different you can always post them.

You've made my point for me. There are about 900,000 Brits waiting to get into hospitals, so if they want treatment they can fork over some cash. When the US system goes socialist you won't have the option of American hospitals, so your private costs will increase still further. *shrug*

 

[charver]

You've made my point for me. There are about 900,000 Brits waiting to get into hospitals, so if they want treatment they can fork over some cash. When the US system goes socialist you won't have the option of American hospitals, so your private costs will increase still further. *shrug*

So what you're saying is that you can find no figures proving all these Britons are receiving treatment in the US?

No shame in that, SM. We're all wrong sometimes.

 

[DamnYankee]

So what you're saying is that you can find no figures proving all these Britons are receiving treatment in the US?

No shame in that, SM. We're all wrong sometimes.

Why would there be figures when they spend their own cash? If they spend it in the US or Switzerland its all the same- they can't rely on the British system because it sucks.

 

[charver]

Why would there be figures when they spend their own cash? If they spend it in the US or Switzerland its all the same- they can't rely on the British system because it sucks.

So there are no figures for British people being treated in US hospitals?

So you're basing your argument that British people are all traveling to the US on what? You have the most expensive treatment in the world. Why on earth would people wanting to pay for treatment abroad pick the most expensive provider when there are plenty of alternatives?

 

[DamnYankee]

So there are no figures for British people being treated in US hospitals?

So you're basing your argument that British people are all traveling to the US on what? You have the most expensive treatment in the world. Why on earth would people wanting to pay for treatment abroad pick the most expensive provider when there are plenty of alternatives?

My "argument" is based on what I have been told by Brits who have experienced your system. The fact that nearly a million Brits are on waiting list is evidence that these people are telling the truth. *shrug*

 

[charver]

My "argument" is based on what I have been told by Brits who have experienced your system. The fact that nearly a million Brits are on waiting list is evidence that these people are telling the truth. *shrug*

I'm still waiting for this evidence that they're being treated in the US.

Come on SM don't let me down.

 

[DamnYankee]

http://www.harrysnews.com/tgDieinBritain.htm *shrug*

 

[charver]

http://www.harrysnews.com/tgDieinBritain.htm *shrug*

No, that's a crude comparison of American and British hospitals.

What i asked was where is the evidence that British people are coming in any significant numbers for treatment in the US when they are more expensive than private UK hospitals or European alternatives.

Come on SM. You could just admit you're talking bollocks and we'll say no more about it.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

No, that's a crude comparison of American and British hospitals.

What i asked was where is the evidence that British people are coming in any significant numbers for treatment in the US when they are more expensive than private UK hospitals or European alternatives.

Come on SM. You could just admit you're talking bollocks and we'll say no more about it.

Brits aren't coming in large numbers because the trip is fairly expensive. We have a number of Canadians in the US being treated in US facilities. We also have at least 10 million or so, illegal Mexicans being treated in emergency rooms. A very good Russian friend of mine, came to America because her daughter had a rare heart condition and UAB was where the doctors there recommended she be taken for treatment.

So there is plenty of evidence to support the US health system as a literal medical mecca to the rest of the world. I'm sure we even have a few Brits here being treated for something.

 

[tinfoil]

So there are no figures for British people being treated in US hospitals?

So you're basing your argument that British people are all traveling to the US on what? You have the most expensive treatment in the world. Why on earth would people wanting to pay for treatment abroad pick the most expensive provider when there are plenty of alternatives?

Becaue you get what you pay for. surely you can understand that quality and liability come with a fee. You might have cheaper care, but you have to nobody to sue when you get screwed