ACLU vs. alQaeda!

[Cancel7]

Me? Darla can't stand me. Thinks I'm a dirty old man (she's probably right). Oh well....at least I'm not a nazi fascist extremist reactionary nut case.

It's true; Spurt makes you look good.

 

[Cancel3]

I find it funny that not a single voice expressed here, seems to have any clue at all, as to the enemy we face, the problem and threat they present, or how to fight them. You are all living in your own little la-la lands, completely oblivious to what is happening in the real world. Some of you honestly think you have an understanding, but it is based on some agenda-driven propaganda, which has no basis in fact or reality.

Don thinks this was a "debate" and he has checked out, but this wasn't a "debate" at all. I don't debate with idiots, it's pointless. This was a statement. A Biden-esque prognostication of what is certain to come. Within the next four years, we will see dead American bodies in the streets, victims of terrorist attack. It's all but guaranteed, given the current administration policy on interrogation. Now, when that does happen (and it WILL happen), what do you suppose will be the American reaction?

Will we see pinheads scurry about, passing stupid laws designed to prevent a specific form of attack in the future? If a day care center blows up, we get the Department of Day Care Security? Metal detectors on buses? Armed security at shopping malls? What will be the liberal pinhead response to the terror attacks which are sure to come? And how long will it take, how many lives will have to be lost to terrorism, before they grow a set of balls and decide we better fight or we're all going to die?

This will be interesting to watch, because right now, the liberals are all full of piss and vinegar, relishing in their political triumph, and completely unconcerned with this issue, because it hasn't been an issue since 9/11. I honestly think there are a number of pinheads who firmly believe 9/11 was a fluke that won't happen again in a million years, and the whole war on terror is a farce. I believe they are in for a very rude awakening.

Dixie, let suppose (and its a stretch) that you are correct about the threat.

Do you actually believe that allowing the CIA to torture whomever they choose is going to help?

First of all, as someone pointed out, the terrorists operate in cells, so no one knows enough to screw up the entire organization.

Second of all, a big part of what we are fighting is a PR game. As long as we continue to prove the radical muslim claims to be correct, they will be able to recruit young suicide bombers. And using torture and an intelligence gathering method is helping the enemy far more than it is helping us.

Third of all, it has been shown time after time after time, that torture is an unreliable method of gathering intell. Even the CIA has admitted it doesn't trust the results. So why is it so necessary (in your mind) that we allow our intell people to torture??

And lastly, this sort of nonsense has been going on since 9/11/01. Those who say we should use torture to fight this threat have been claiming that we will see more attacks. When we didn't they praised Bush for keeping the threat overseas and not in our backyard. So either way the lunatics claim to have something.






But you are right about one thing, this is not a debate. This is you going on a rant and ignoring anyone who disagrees with you.

 

[Cancel7]

Mott, don't take Yurt's words about Darla seriously. He has a "darla fetish" and is still trying to buy her underwear on Ebay.

He likes humiliation. And I've humiliated him a lot.

Sigh. Republicans.

 

[Cancel3]

He likes humiliation. And I've humiliated him a lot.

Sigh. Republicans.

I can only imagine what his fantasies of "Mistress Darla" involve.

 

[blackascoal]

I find it funny that not a single voice expressed here, seems to have any clue at all, as to the enemy we face, the problem and threat they present, or how to fight them. You are all living in your own little la-la lands, completely oblivious to what is happening in the real world. Some of you honestly think you have an understanding, but it is based on some agenda-driven propaganda, which has no basis in fact or reality.

Don thinks this was a "debate" and he has checked out, but this wasn't a "debate" at all. I don't debate with idiots, it's pointless. This was a statement. A Biden-esque prognostication of what is certain to come. Within the next four years, we will see dead American bodies in the streets, victims of terrorist attack. It's all but guaranteed, given the current administration policy on interrogation. Now, when that does happen (and it WILL happen), what do you suppose will be the American reaction?

Will we see pinheads scurry about, passing stupid laws designed to prevent a specific form of attack in the future? If a day care center blows up, we get the Department of Day Care Security? Metal detectors on buses? Armed security at shopping malls? What will be the liberal pinhead response to the terror attacks which are sure to come? And how long will it take, how many lives will have to be lost to terrorism, before they grow a set of balls and decide we better fight or we're all going to die?

This will be interesting to watch, because right now, the liberals are all full of piss and vinegar, relishing in their political triumph, and completely unconcerned with this issue, because it hasn't been an issue since 9/11. I honestly think there are a number of pinheads who firmly believe 9/11 was a fluke that won't happen again in a million years, and the whole war on terror is a farce. I believe they are in for a very rude awakening.

Simply amazing.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Dixie, let suppose (and its a stretch) that you are correct about the threat.

Do you actually believe that allowing the CIA to torture whomever they choose is going to help?

Yes, I certainly do, because that has been the case already...

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,436061,00.html

Captured al-Qaeda planner Khalid Sheikh Mohammed has given U.S. interrogators the names and descriptions of about a dozen key al-Qaeda operatives believed to be plotting terrorist attacks on American and other Western interests, according to federal officials. Other high-level al-Qaeda detainees previously disclosed some of the names, but Mohammed, until recently al-Qaeda's chief operating officer and the brains behind the 9/11 attacks, has volunteered new ones. He has also added crucial details to the descriptions of other suspects and filled in important gaps in what U.S. intelligence knows about al-Qaeda's practices.

One of the al-Qaeda operatives identified by Mohammed is Adman G. El Shukrijumah, a 27-year-old Saudi who went to college in South Florida. Last week the FBI launched a global manhunt for Shukrijumah, who, officials say, Mohammed has dubbed a leader on a par with Mohammed Atta, the top man on the 9/11 hijack team. Sources tell TIME that U.S. intelligence agencies are urgently searching for at least two other key lieutenants fingered by Mohammed. Still other team names and descriptions have been refined during Mohammed's interrogation. This data has been dispatched to allied intelligence and security services to be placed on lookout lists.

Mohammed's cooperation has improved investigators' understanding of al-Qaeda's command-and-control structure. Sources say he has explained that at any time, the organization has open-ended plans for as many as two dozen attacks — mostly ideas proposed by field operatives and sanctioned and financed by Osama bin Laden's inner circle.

Mohammed's account dovetails with those of other detainees. Al-Qaeda schemes, now in various stages of development, run the gamut from old-fashioned truck bombings to assassinations to the dispersal of chemical and biological agents, sources say. He has underscored al-Qaeda's interest in spectacular attacks on landmarks such as the White House, the Israeli embassy in Washington, Chicago's Sears Tower and bridges in Manhattan, St. Louis and San Francisco.

Mohammed, captured March 1 in Rawalpindi by Pakistani security officials working with the CIA, began talking much sooner than anticipated, and some officials remain skeptical that at least some of the information he is feeding interrogators is intentionally misleading. But as some of his disclosures have been corroborated by other detainees and electronic sources, investigators are more confident that, as one counter-terror official says, "We're getting valuable, credible, specific information."

First of all, as someone pointed out, the terrorists operate in cells, so no one knows enough to screw up the entire organization.

Doesn't matter what they know now, we can't even insult their mother! As the previous story indicates, key alQaeda operatives do have information, and it does indeed result in thwarting future terror attacks. Several planned attacks have already been foiled because of our interrogations and the information we obtained.

Second of all, a big part of what we are fighting is a PR game. As long as we continue to prove the radical muslim claims to be correct, they will be able to recruit young suicide bombers. And using torture and an intelligence gathering method is helping the enemy far more than it is helping us.

You are completely full of left-wing shit if you believe that. And let us clear something the fuck up, right now... We are not sticking needles in people's eyes or bamboo shoots under their fingernails... we are not burying them in the desert up to their necks and letting ants eat their flesh! We are certainly not chopping off their arms and hands, or any number of techniques used in the typical despotic Arab world as routine punishment for crime. We are using unpleasant and uncomfortable coercive strategy to obtain specific information from specific individuals known to have that information. This is NOT TORTURE! The Arab world is laughing their asses off at your liberal sensitivity, and you can bet they are telling their recruits about how WEAK we are, because we lack the balls to do anything worse than give them a cold cup of coffee!

Third of all, it has been shown time after time after time, that torture is an unreliable method of gathering intell. Even the CIA has admitted it doesn't trust the results. So why is it so necessary (in your mind) that we allow our intell people to torture??

We've never tortured. Read my last statement. Coercive interrogation does work, it worked on Khalid Sheikh Mohammed. What doesn't work, and will NOT work, is offering an alQaeda operative a hot cup of coffee if he cooperates! That is guaranteed NOT to work every single time!

And lastly, this sort of nonsense has been going on since 9/11/01. Those who say we should use torture to fight this threat have been claiming that we will see more attacks. When we didn't they praised Bush for keeping the threat overseas and not in our backyard. So either way the lunatics claim to have something.

To date, some 27 know terror plots have been averted because of our intelligence gathering capabilities. No telling how many more we do not know about because they are classified and highly sensitive in nature. From London to Indonesia, to right here in the US, the plots have been foiled because we were able to find out about them and prevent them from happening. That doesn't compute to an imbecile like you, because it didn't happen, so you ignore it!

But you are right about one thing, this is not a debate. This is you going on a rant and ignoring anyone who disagrees with you.

No it certainly isn't a debate. The only thing I am ignoring is ignorant assertions that we are "torturing" people, when that has never been the case. It is you who is consistently ignoring the facts, and refusing to see the problem we face. In you failure to do so, you will share responsibility for every single one of the Americans who now must die to wake you up. You can call me names, accuse me of fear mongering, or whatever. I don't call the shots, your boy Obama is in charge now, and we will have ACLU-type intelligence gathering techniques under his watch. We will get attacked again... soon... Just remember when it does happen, Dixie told you so.

 

[Cancel3]

Yes, I certainly do, because that has been the case already...

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,436061,00.html

Captured al-Qaeda planner Khalid Sheikh Mohammed has given U.S. interrogators the names and descriptions of about a dozen key al-Qaeda operatives believed to be plotting terrorist attacks on American and other Western interests, according to federal officials. Other high-level al-Qaeda detainees previously disclosed some of the names, but Mohammed, until recently al-Qaeda's chief operating officer and the brains behind the 9/11 attacks, has volunteered new ones. He has also added crucial details to the descriptions of other suspects and filled in important gaps in what U.S. intelligence knows about al-Qaeda's practices.

One of the al-Qaeda operatives identified by Mohammed is Adman G. El Shukrijumah, a 27-year-old Saudi who went to college in South Florida. Last week the FBI launched a global manhunt for Shukrijumah, who, officials say, Mohammed has dubbed a leader on a par with Mohammed Atta, the top man on the 9/11 hijack team. Sources tell TIME that U.S. intelligence agencies are urgently searching for at least two other key lieutenants fingered by Mohammed. Still other team names and descriptions have been refined during Mohammed's interrogation. This data has been dispatched to allied intelligence and security services to be placed on lookout lists.

Mohammed's cooperation has improved investigators' understanding of al-Qaeda's command-and-control structure. Sources say he has explained that at any time, the organization has open-ended plans for as many as two dozen attacks — mostly ideas proposed by field operatives and sanctioned and financed by Osama bin Laden's inner circle.

Mohammed's account dovetails with those of other detainees. Al-Qaeda schemes, now in various stages of development, run the gamut from old-fashioned truck bombings to assassinations to the dispersal of chemical and biological agents, sources say. He has underscored al-Qaeda's interest in spectacular attacks on landmarks such as the White House, the Israeli embassy in Washington, Chicago's Sears Tower and bridges in Manhattan, St. Louis and San Francisco.

Mohammed, captured March 1 in Rawalpindi by Pakistani security officials working with the CIA, began talking much sooner than anticipated, and some officials remain skeptical that at least some of the information he is feeding interrogators is intentionally misleading. But as some of his disclosures have been corroborated by other detainees and electronic sources, investigators are more confident that, as one counter-terror official says, "We're getting valuable, credible, specific information."



Doesn't matter what they know now, we can't even insult their mother! As the previous story indicates, key alQaeda operatives do have information, and it does indeed result in thwarting future terror attacks. Several planned attacks have already been foiled because of our interrogations and the information we obtained.



You are completely full of left-wing shit if you believe that. And let us clear something the fuck up, right now... We are not sticking needles in people's eyes or bamboo shoots under their fingernails... we are not burying them in the desert up to their necks and letting ants eat their flesh! We are certainly not chopping off their arms and hands, or any number of techniques used in the typical despotic Arab world as routine punishment for crime. We are using unpleasant and uncomfortable coercive strategy to obtain specific information from specific individuals known to have that information. This is NOT TORTURE! The Arab world is laughing their asses off at your liberal sensitivity, and you can bet they are telling their recruits about how WEAK we are, because we lack the balls to do anything worse than give them a cold cup of coffee!



We've never tortured. Read my last statement. Coercive interrogation does work, it worked on Khalid Sheikh Mohammed. What doesn't work, and will NOT work, is offering an alQaeda operative a hot cup of coffee if he cooperates! That is guaranteed NOT to work every single time!



To date, some 27 know terror plots have been averted because of our intelligence gathering capabilities. No telling how many more we do not know about because they are classified and highly sensitive in nature. From London to Indonesia, to right here in the US, the plots have been foiled because we were able to find out about them and prevent them from happening. That doesn't compute to an imbecile like you, because it didn't happen, so you ignore it!



No it certainly isn't a debate. The only thing I am ignoring is ignorant assertions that we are "torturing" people, when that has never been the case. It is you who is consistently ignoring the facts, and refusing to see the problem we face. In you failure to do so, you will share responsibility for every single one of the Americans who now must die to wake you up. You can call me names, accuse me of fear mongering, or whatever. I don't call the shots, your boy Obama is in charge now, and we will have ACLU-type intelligence gathering techniques under his watch. We will get attacked again... soon... Just remember when it does happen, Dixie told you so.

Yes, we have stopped many terrorist plots. Did we do that by torturing them or by other intell methods??

I am not saying anything about offering someone a cup of coffee, but I am also not talking about carte' blanche to do whatever the fuck they want.

The ONLY way to assure safety from terrorism is to remove freedoms. A free society is ALWAYS (read it again, Dixie - ALWAYS) going to have the threat of attack over its head. It is the nature of a free society to have that threat. You want to blow it all out of proportion in some attempt to play "We are the biggest badass nation in the world" game. But its mostly bullshit.

The fact that one guy rolled over (and there is no real data on WHY he rolled) does not justify the use of whatever means of torture you deem useful.

And this bullshit of either being able to torture (call it what you want, experts have called it torture) or being nice passive people is bullshit. Its extremism. You want to equate the internationally acceptable intell methods with "...offering an alQaeda operative a hot cup of coffee if he cooperates!"???? That is either a sign your are a fool who is blindly following the conservative talk show idiots, or that you are purposefully misleading (or trying) people.


There is a chance people will die. You betcha. But the ONLY way to really remove that threat is to remove our freedoms. Anything else is just illusions.

 

[Jarod]

Dixie, honest question.

If American troops were captured and tourtured by a forign nation, would you not want the international community up in arms about it? Would you not want those who did it brought to justice?

Whats good for the goose is good for the gander in the eyes of the world!

 

[Cancel7]

Yes, I certainly do, because that has been the case already...

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,436061,00.html

Captured al-Qaeda planner Khalid Sheikh Mohammed has given U.S. interrogators the names and descriptions of about a dozen key al-Qaeda operatives believed to be plotting terrorist attacks on American and other Western interests, according to federal officials. Other high-level al-Qaeda detainees previously disclosed some of the names, but Mohammed, until recently al-Qaeda's chief operating officer and the brains behind the 9/11 attacks, has volunteered new ones. He has also added crucial details to the descriptions of other suspects and filled in important gaps in what U.S. intelligence knows about al-Qaeda's practices.

One of the al-Qaeda operatives identified by Mohammed is Adman G. El Shukrijumah, a 27-year-old Saudi who went to college in South Florida. Last week the FBI launched a global manhunt for Shukrijumah, who, officials say, Mohammed has dubbed a leader on a par with Mohammed Atta, the top man on the 9/11 hijack team. Sources tell TIME that U.S. intelligence agencies are urgently searching for at least two other key lieutenants fingered by Mohammed. Still other team names and descriptions have been refined during Mohammed's interrogation. This data has been dispatched to allied intelligence and security services to be placed on lookout lists.

Mohammed's cooperation has improved investigators' understanding of al-Qaeda's command-and-control structure. Sources say he has explained that at any time, the organization has open-ended plans for as many as two dozen attacks — mostly ideas proposed by field operatives and sanctioned and financed by Osama bin Laden's inner circle.

Mohammed's account dovetails with those of other detainees. Al-Qaeda schemes, now in various stages of development, run the gamut from old-fashioned truck bombings to assassinations to the dispersal of chemical and biological agents, sources say. He has underscored al-Qaeda's interest in spectacular attacks on landmarks such as the White House, the Israeli embassy in Washington, Chicago's Sears Tower and bridges in Manhattan, St. Louis and San Francisco.

Mohammed, captured March 1 in Rawalpindi by Pakistani security officials working with the CIA, began talking much sooner than anticipated, and some officials remain skeptical that at least some of the information he is feeding interrogators is intentionally misleading. But as some of his disclosures have been corroborated by other detainees and electronic sources, investigators are more confident that, as one counter-terror official says, "We're getting valuable, credible, specific information."



Doesn't matter what they know now, we can't even insult their mother! As the previous story indicates, key alQaeda operatives do have information, and it does indeed result in thwarting future terror attacks. Several planned attacks have already been foiled because of our interrogations and the information we obtained.



You are completely full of left-wing shit if you believe that. And let us clear something the fuck up, right now... We are not sticking needles in people's eyes or bamboo shoots under their fingernails... we are not burying them in the desert up to their necks and letting ants eat their flesh! We are certainly not chopping off their arms and hands, or any number of techniques used in the typical despotic Arab world as routine punishment for crime. We are using unpleasant and uncomfortable coercive strategy to obtain specific information from specific individuals known to have that information. This is NOT TORTURE! The Arab world is laughing their asses off at your liberal sensitivity, and you can bet they are telling their recruits about how WEAK we are, because we lack the balls to do anything worse than give them a cold cup of coffee!



We've never tortured. Read my last statement. Coercive interrogation does work, it worked on Khalid Sheikh Mohammed. What doesn't work, and will NOT work, is offering an alQaeda operative a hot cup of coffee if he cooperates! That is guaranteed NOT to work every single time!



To date, some 27 know terror plots have been averted because of our intelligence gathering capabilities. No telling how many more we do not know about because they are classified and highly sensitive in nature. From London to Indonesia, to right here in the US, the plots have been foiled because we were able to find out about them and prevent them from happening. That doesn't compute to an imbecile like you, because it didn't happen, so you ignore it!



No it certainly isn't a debate. The only thing I am ignoring is ignorant assertions that we are "torturing" people, when that has never been the case. It is you who is consistently ignoring the facts, and refusing to see the problem we face. In you failure to do so, you will share responsibility for every single one of the Americans who now must die to wake you up. You can call me names, accuse me of fear mongering, or whatever. I don't call the shots, your boy Obama is in charge now, and we will have ACLU-type intelligence gathering techniques under his watch. We will get attacked again... soon... Just remember when it does happen, Dixie told you so.

Dixie I hate to see a grown man so piss-his-pants scared. You know you should get a security blanket! Think about it Dixie, one little trip to Babies R Us and this could be you:

 

[Onceler]

"Just remember when it does happen, Dixie told you so. "

You also told us that Obama was "Bush 3" on the WOT just a few weeks back, or told us that we'd be out of Iraq in 6 months to a year, or that Iraq would weaken and destroy AQ, or that Hillary Clinton would win the primary because of the PUMA vote, or that Palin would propel McCain to a huge victory over the pinheads, or....well, you get the picture.

The United States doesn't torture; period. You don't have to become a terrorist to beat a terrorist - you & Bush have never gotten that. But your time is done.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

The fact that one guy rolled over (and there is no real data on WHY he rolled) does not justify the use of whatever means of torture you deem useful.

Oh it is widely known how the information was obtained. They strapped his terrorist ass to a waterboard, and he sang like a canary! It's how you get these hardened thugs who have made their vows with Allah to crack! You can't do it by pussyfooting around with ACLU-type protections of their rights and being courteous to them, it doesn't work.

And this bullshit of either being able to torture (call it what you want, experts have called it torture) or being nice passive people is bullshit. Its extremism. You want to equate the internationally acceptable intell methods with "...offering an alQaeda operative a hot cup of coffee if he cooperates!"???? That is either a sign your are a fool who is blindly following the conservative talk show idiots, or that you are purposefully misleading (or trying) people.

No, experts in intelligence have called it "coerced interrogation tactics" and it is only called "torture" by idiot liberal pinheads who obviously have no concept of the difference. You see... here's the thing... no one in their sane right mind condones "torture" under any circumstance! IF that was what we had been doing at Gitmo and elsewhere, I would be outraged by it, because it is a deplorable practice. But making people uncomfortable, putting them in unpleasant situations, making things rough on them and not enjoyable, is NOT torture, it's not even close! IF we allowed regular army field personnel to interrogate prisoners at their discretion, I would be outraged by that... but we aren't, haven't ever been to my knowledge. Regular army should (and does) use the guidelines in the Army Field Manual, but this shouldn't be applied to the CIA in hard core intelligence gathering. When we DO capture some high ranking alQaeda big wig, we should be able to strap his ass to a waterboard like we did Khalid, and potentially save lives by foiling terror attacks!

 

[Jarod]

Maybe I am a crazy liberal... but out of those who died for our rights and for our nation to exist... Id rather suffer another terrorist attack than give up those rights or give up those ideals that so many have died for.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

You want to equate the internationally acceptable intell methods with "...offering an alQaeda operative a hot cup of coffee if he cooperates!"????

I have actually READ the Army Field Manual directive on interrogation. You are not allowed to do anything physically threatening, demeaning, or insulting to the individual. You are not allowed to intimidate or harass them in any way. You can't play loud music, or keep them awake. You are not allowed to deny them any personal possessions, or isolate them from their families and friends. You can't threaten to do these things, you can't hint that you are even thinking about that. Nope... the only thing you can do, is offer them stuff. That's it! You can offer them a hot cup of coffee, you can offer them a more comfortable bed... that is the limits imposed by the Army Field Manual in dealing with detainee's.

As I said, for a regular army guy, I can see us having these guidelines, and I can appreciate the fact that we don't allow our troops to interrogate prisoners. That is what the Army Field Manual is designed to provide, and that is fine! We are talking about the CIA and the people who are charged with actually interrogating these people and getting the information we need to prevent terrorist attacks! They are now subject to the same guidelines as regular army personnel, and we are handcuffed as far as intelligence gathering. Hell, we might as well close Gitmo, what purpose is it going to serve now? Let's just turn these thugs loose in America, and give them guns and bombs! Maybe they will see how nice we're being and not attack us? You reckon?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Maybe I am a crazy liberal... but out of those who died for our rights and for our nation to exist... Id rather suffer another terrorist attack than give up those rights or give up those ideals that so many have died for.

Well fucktard, you're certainly going to get your wish. You will see hundreds, maybe thousands, of dead Americans. I hope you can sleep well knowing they died so you could claim righteousness.

 

[charver]

Well fucktard, you're certainly going to get your wish. You will see hundreds, maybe thousands, of dead Americans. I hope you can sleep well knowing they died so you could claim righteousness.

"And by the way Jarod i'm still waiting for you to cross my palm with mother-fucking silver."

 

[Onceler]

You don't think sleep deprivation is torture either? Very common method under Pol Pot.

You're nuts; I don't even consider you as an American. America stands for something, and if we start to let that slide out of fear, it's a very slippery slope down to the level that the terrorists operate on. Your reasoning here is the same reason you don't care about civilian casualties, and can't comprehend what they do to America's standing & principles.

 

[Bonestorm]

Here's a relevant quote from a well reported Vanity Fair article on torture that was published quite recently:

As for K.S.M. [Khalid Sheikh Mohammed] himself, who (as Jane Mayer reports) was waterboarded, reportedly hung for hours on end from his wrists, beaten, and subjected to other agonies for weeks, Bush said he provided “many details of other plots to kill innocent Americans.” K.S.M. was certainly knowledgeable. It would be surprising if he gave up nothing of value. But according to a former senior C.I.A. official, who read all the interrogation reports on K.S.M., “90 percent of it was total fucking bullshit.” A former Pentagon analyst adds: “K.S.M. produced no actionable intelligence. He was trying to tell us how stupid we were.”

There's also this:

In researching this article, I spoke to numerous counterterrorist officials from agencies on both sides of the Atlantic. Their conclusion is unanimous: not only have coercive methods failed to generate significant and actionable intelligence, they have also caused the squandering of resources on a massive scale through false leads, chimerical plots, and unnecessary safety alerts—with Abu Zubaydah’s case one of the most glaring examples.

Read the whole thing here:

http://www.vanityfair.com/magazine/2008/12/torture200812

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Oh well, if Vanity Fair said it....


FUCKTARD!

 

[Cancel3]

Dixie, honest question.

If American troops were captured and tourtured by a forign nation, would you not want the international community up in arms about it? Would you not want those who did it brought to justice?

Whats good for the goose is good for the gander in the eyes of the world!

I notice you didn't answer this question, Dixie.

And the fact that you keep making predictions about what WILL happen, when you have the most abysmal record on your previous predictions is hilarious.

Tell us more, dixie. Your accuracy has been so good so far. lmao

 

[Jarod]

Well fucktard, you're certainly going to get your wish. You will see hundreds, maybe thousands, of dead Americans. I hope you can sleep well knowing they died so you could claim righteousness.

My great grandfather died fighting for America. His memory is not served and his sacrifice is not honored if we are going to trade the liberty he died for in exchange for some small measure of safety.