Thorium, yay or nay?

[Althea]

If you read any of the articles I posted you'd be able to answer that question yourself! I can't believe you really are as dim and lazy as you make out.

Sent from my iPhone 10S

Do have anything current? Most of the available info is from the same period that you referenced....2013. You don't think Gates could have figured this out in 3 years?

 

[Althea]

To summarize; by the time thorium reactors are perfected and given the same level of subsidy, green energy would render them obsolete in all but the most populous countries.

I realize that there will always be those who are opposed to fueless energy sources.

Yep....all nukes have sucked up countless billions in subsidies.

 

[cancel2 2022]

Do have anything current? Most of the available info is from the same period that you referenced....2013. You don't think Gates could have figured this out in 3 years?

A New Class of Nuclear Reactor

Engineers and researchers have long dreamed of a self-fueling source of energy. As early as 1958, Saveli Feinberg imagined a nuclear reactor that could breed fuel within its core. TerraPower will use proven fast reactor technology, high-performance computing simulations and real testing in current fast reactor test facilities to make the traveling wave reactor (TWR) concept a reality. The TWR is a uniquely designed nuclear reactor. It is able to operate for an extended period of time, using only depleted uranium (U-238) as fuel. This material is produced during the enrichment process, when enriched uranium (U-235) separates from natural uranium. U-235 is the main fuel for today’s light water reactors, while U-238 is a by-product of the enrichment process and is currently set aside as waste. Nuclear power plants produce electricity by splitting large atoms, such as U-235, into smaller atoms. Each time an atom splits (or “fissions”) it releases neutrons and heat. In turn, released neutrons cause other fissions, creating a sustained chain reaction. For conventional nuclear energy plants, U-235 is used because U-238 cannot sustain a chain reaction in today’s light water reactors. TerraPower’s engineers discovered a method to extract energy from U-238, making it a perfect source of energy for the TWR.
Innovative Core Physics

The TWR’s economic benefits stem from its higher thermal efficiency and ability to breed and burn metallic fuel comprised of initial starter fuel of U-235 and U-238. TerraPower’s ability to develop new fuels and materials that can breed and burn U-238 could enable a TWR to get more energy out of every pound of mined uranium than a conventional light water reactor.

Chain Reaction

TerraPower’s mission is to develop this nuclear reactor to meet growing global electricity needs. The goal of the TWR design is to greatly reduce proliferation risks and create new, affordable options for converting low-level waste into energy resources.
Looking to the Future

The TWR design will evolve as we proceed with materials testing and a prototype reactor. Our studies show that future generations of the technology will be capable of running on other forms of fuel–spent light water reactor fuel or recycled TWR fuel. We even foresee versions of the TWR that will use natural uranium or thorium as fuel.

http://terrapower.com/pages/the-physics

Sent from my iPhone 10S

 

[cancel2 2022]

Yep....all nukes have sucked up countless billions in subsidies.

So how much subsidy has thorium reactor research received up to now?

Sent from my iPhone 10S

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Great, even before there is even a working reactor, health and safety come along to piss in the porridge. No wonder Bill Gates got fed up with all the jobworths in the US. If you guys had been around on the 40s the Manhattan Project would have been buried in red tape and Hitler would have sent a V3 over to New York with a 20 kiloton warhead.

Sent from my iPhone 10S

Oh that's nonsense. Health and safety was one of the first and most difficult issues addressed on the Manhatan project. It is always a major concern in developing nuclear energy and always...repeat for emphasis...always has been a formost consideration in its development. Why do you think there's been so few major safety incidents in the US nuclear program? You think that was an accident?

Let's put things in perspective too. The Manhatan project was not the largest or most expensive US weapons program in WWII.

 

[cancel2 2022]

Oh that's nonsense. Health and safety was one of the first and most difficult issues addressed on the Manhatan project. It is always a major concern in developing nuclear energy and always...repeat for emphasis...always has been a formost consideration in its development. Why do you think there's been so few major safety incidents in the US nuclear program? You think that was an accident?

Let's put things in perspective too. The Manhatan project was not the largest or most expensive US weapons program in WWII.

Which is why Bill Gates is building his prototype travelling wave reactor in China. If he did it in the US the NRC would delay the project by a decade at least.

You're not exactly impartial here, you make your living by implementing health and safety. The more bureaucracy and red tape there is, the more employment for you. There has to be a balance and I think it has gone way too far in the direction of being so risk adverse that it seriously hinders large scale projects like 4th gen nuclear power.

Sent from my iPhone 10S

 

[Althea]

A New Class of Nuclear Reactor

Engineers and researchers have long dreamed of a self-fueling source of energy. As early as 1958, Saveli Feinberg imagined a nuclear reactor that could breed fuel within its core. TerraPower will use proven fast reactor technology, high-performance computing simulations and real testing in current fast reactor test facilities to make the traveling wave reactor (TWR) concept a reality. The TWR is a uniquely designed nuclear reactor. It is able to operate for an extended period of time, using only depleted uranium (U-238) as fuel. This material is produced during the enrichment process, when enriched uranium (U-235) separates from natural uranium. U-235 is the main fuel for today’s light water reactors, while U-238 is a by-product of the enrichment process and is currently set aside as waste. Nuclear power plants produce electricity by splitting large atoms, such as U-235, into smaller atoms. Each time an atom splits (or “fissions”) it releases neutrons and heat. In turn, released neutrons cause other fissions, creating a sustained chain reaction. For conventional nuclear energy plants, U-235 is used because U-238 cannot sustain a chain reaction in today’s light water reactors. TerraPower’s engineers discovered a method to extract energy from U-238, making it a perfect source of energy for the TWR.
Innovative Core Physics

The TWR’s economic benefits stem from its higher thermal efficiency and ability to breed and burn metallic fuel comprised of initial starter fuel of U-235 and U-238. TerraPower’s ability to develop new fuels and materials that can breed and burn U-238 could enable a TWR to get more energy out of every pound of mined uranium than a conventional light water reactor.

Chain Reaction

TerraPower’s mission is to develop this nuclear reactor to meet growing global electricity needs. The goal of the TWR design is to greatly reduce proliferation risks and create new, affordable options for converting low-level waste into energy resources.
Looking to the Future

The TWR design will evolve as we proceed with materials testing and a prototype reactor. Our studies show that future generations of the technology will be capable of running on other forms of fuel–spent light water reactor fuel or recycled TWR fuel. We even foresee versions of the TWR that will use natural uranium or thorium as fuel.

http://terrapower.com/pages/the-physics

Sent from my iPhone 10S

My apologies. When I asked for updates, I should have been more specific. I wasn't looking for a brief history of the concept, with forward looking statements that still haven't been achieved. I did ask for something current, and you did supply something with this year's date, albeit with 4-60 year old rhetoric.

So how much subsidy has thorium reactor research received up to now?

Sent from my iPhone 10S

Thus far, it's in the early (failing) stages. If it ever proves viable, it will require billions in subsidies to build one reactor.

Which is why Bill Gates is building his prototype travelling wave reactor in China. If he did it in the US the NRC would delay the project by a decade at least.

You're not exactly impartial here, you make your living by implementing health and safety. The more bureaucracy and red tape there is, the more employment for you. There has to be a balance and I think it has gone way too far in the direction of being so risk adverse that it seriously hinders large scale projects like 4th gen nuclear power.

Sent from my iPhone 10S

Traveling wave reactor was scrapped, as it didn't work. You do remember I asked for current data?

 

[cancel2 2022]

My apologies. When I asked for updates, I should have been more specific. I wasn't looking for a brief history of the concept, with forward looking statements that still haven't been achieved. I did ask for something current, and you did supply something with this year's date, albeit with 4-60 year old rhetoric.

Thus far, it's in the early (failing) stages. If it ever proves viable, it will require billions in subsidies to build one reactor.

Traveling wave reactor was scrapped, as it didn't work. You do remember I asked for current data?

Yeh that's bullshit, it wasn't scrapped the design was amended. I will not discuss this with you further as you have a very antipathetic, almost Rune-like, attitude to 4th gen nuclear. You talk about subsidies yet completely ignore the huge subsidies given to both wind and solar.

http://www.economist.com/news/leade...ting-them-wind-and-solar-power-are-disrupting

Sent from my iPhone 10S

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Which is why Bill Gates is building his prototype travelling wave reactor in China. If he did it in the US the NRC would delay the project by a decade at least.

You're not exactly impartial here, you make your living by implementing health and safety. The more bureaucracy and red tape there is, the more employment for you. There has to be a balance and I think it has gone way too far in the direction of being so risk adverse that it seriously hinders large scale projects like 4th gen nuclear power.

Sent from my iPhone 10S

Tom...you're clueless on this. Objectively, all bias aside, health and safety is one of the single biggest engineering criteria in designing any nuclear power reactor. It always has been.

 

[cancel2 2022]

Tom...you're clueless on this. Objectively, all bias aside, health and safety is one of the single biggest engineering criteria in designing any nuclear power reactor. It always has been.

Please don't patronise me, I know that damn well but there are huge obstacles put in the way by bodies like the NRC. Bill Gates and others have realised that the future of nuclear is small molten salt reactors that can be assembled off site and are scalable merely by adding more units. This obviates the need for huge pressure vessels as they work at atmospheric pressure. A decade from now China and India will have a huge advantage with this technology and the West will have to go cap in hand to them. Thorium will happen without any doubt in spite of Luddites and treehuggers.

Sent from my iPhone 10S

 

[Althea]

Yeh that's bullshit, it wasn't scrapped the design was amended. I will not discuss this with you further as you have a very antipathetic, almost Rune-like, attitude to 4th gen nuclear. You talk about subsidies yet completely ignore the huge subsidies given to both wind and solar.

http://www.economist.com/news/leade...ting-them-wind-and-solar-power-are-disrupting

Sent from my iPhone 10S

Good. Don't discuss it with me. That doesn't negate the fact that traveling wave was dumped, as it didn't work as expected.

The Feds have subsidized every nuke facility in this country, long before solar was a viable alternative.


Best case scenario, they're 5 years away from MAYBE having a prototype.


http://www.zdnet.com/article/bill-gates-stops-chasing-nuclear-wave-pursues-variety-of-reactors/

Gilleland said the change "didn't set us back at all." Despite the alteration - made about two years ago - TerraPower still calls the reactor a "traveling wave" (TWR). It's working with partners in Russia, China, Japan, South Korea and the U.S. in hopes of building a prototype by 2022 and a commercial reactor by the mid-2020s.

 

[cancel2 2022]

Good. Don't discuss it with me. That doesn't negate the fact that traveling wave was dumped, as it didn't work as expected.

The Feds have subsidized every nuke facility in this country, long before solar was a viable alternative.


Best case scenario, they're 5 years away from MAYBE having a prototype.


http://www.zdnet.com/article/bill-gates-stops-chasing-nuclear-wave-pursues-variety-of-reactors/

Gilleland said the change "didn't set us back at all." Despite the alteration - made about two years ago - TerraPower still calls the reactor a "traveling wave" (TWR). It's working with partners in Russia, China, Japan, South Korea and the U.S. in hopes of building a prototype by 2022 and a commercial reactor by the mid-2020s.

I won't discuss this with you any further because you're just being an arsehole, and a very cynical one at that. Thorium reactors have massive potential and anybody who disputes that is not worth very much to my mind. You have a preconceived and closed mind that is not amenable to discussion, I bid you adieu.

Sent from my iPhone 10S