Obama

[Cypress]

There's a reason historians, people who study history, wait years if not decades to fully judge a Presidency because the full effects of the administrations decisions can't be known the day after they leave office.

President Obama gets credit for being the first black President. We have a long history of racial trouble in our country so this is a major accomplishment. He is also a very eloquent and at times inspiring (and when he wants to be inclusive) speaker.

You are correct that people don't say President A has 2.6% growth, President B had 3.1% etc. We don't remember those exact numbers. But we do know what happened overall. We have to go back to the 1920's to find a President who didn't have at least one year of 3% economic growth during their term. Obama was in office for eight years.

As to your other claims, he didn't save the auto industry. He should have allowed the auto industry firms to file for BK as firms in other industries do. There's a reason our auto manufacturers were performing as they were and BK is set up to allow them to reorganize and attempt to compete again.

If Obamacare leads to single payer then yes he will definitely get credit for the major move in that direction. As far as advancing civil rights did you have something particular in mind?

As far as being a transformative President I'm not exactly sure what you had in mind other than he broke a major glass ceiling in this country and hopefully gave inspiration to millions of kids that they too can have and reach that dream.

His foreign policy was full of disasters highlighted with Libya and Syria. If you want an appeal to authority I'd be glad to post the work of Middle East and foreign policy scholars who state this.

You are entitled to your opinion.

I don't think anyone who voted for Dumbya and supported the catastrophic Iraq War Disaster is allowed to say Obama's foreign policy was a disaster.

Future historians place little weight on localized regional geopolitical conflicts. The Phillippine Insurrection carries almost no weight on the overall historical consensus of Teddy Roosevelts presidency. He is still considered a top five president. A Word War 2 and Civil War? Yes, great weight applies in presidential historical contexts.

For partisan reasons it could be entirely understandable why Bush voters don't want Obama's legacy ranked highly, because it would then reflect on the voting judgement of Bush voters themselves.

You could make lists all day long about Obama's achievements and mistakes. The bottom line is that I think there is a high probability history will easily rank him a transformational president, easily making the top third, or even a top ten spot.

 

[Airstrip One]

Nobody actually remembers what the GDP growth rate was under Teddy Roosevelt, Calvin Coolidge, FDR, Lincoln, or Eisenhower.

Obama is going to be remembered for saving the nation from the Second Great Republican Depression, advancing the cause of universal health care and civil rights, saving the American auto industry, being very prescient on the foolish invasion of Iraq, and generally fixing the utter clusterfuck left to him by his predecessors, George Dumbya and Dick Cheney.

Reasons for which he is already being ranked 12th best by historians in this scholarly survey.

Well, for one thing, they calculated GNP back then. It wasn't until the clear movement toward economic globalization that economists shifted toward GDP.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

We didn't have one year of greater than 3% economic growth during his eight years. There is zero chance he ends up in the top ten with that record.

LOL LOL LOL LOL Spoken like a true chamber of commerce free market fundamentalist. Has it occurred to you that his economic record will be he prevented the Bush recession from becoming another Great Depression and that the recovery would have been far more robust if not for obstructionist in the opposing party who would rather have brought this nation down in flames than see a niger succeed?

The reality is, whether you like it or not, is Obamas legacy will largely be for three things. Digging this nation out of the huge shithole the previous administration dug us into, beginning the modernization of our backward and wasteful health care management system and for bringing the criminal responsible for the 911 terrorist attack to justice (something his predecessor deemed unimportant.).

If history blames anyone for weak economic growth during that period it will be an obstructionist GOP congress that accomplished exactly nothing during that time and prevented measures that would have improved economic growth from being implemented.

 

[cawacko]

You are entitled to your opinion.

I don't think anyone who voted for Dumbya and supported the catastrophic Iraq War Disaster is allowed to say Obama's foreign policy was a disaster.

Future historians place little weight on localized regional geopolitical conflicts. The Phillippine Insurrection carries almost no weight on the overall historical consensus of Teddy Roosevelts presidency. He is still considered a top five president. A Word War 2 and Civil War? Yes, great weight applies in presidential historical contexts.

For partisan reasons it could be entirely understandable why Bush voters don't want Obama's legacy ranked highly, because it would then reflect on the voting judgement of Bush voters themselves.

You could make lists all day long about Obama's achievements and mistakes. The bottom line is that I think there is a high probability history will easily rank him a transformational president, easily making the top third, or even a top ten spot.

You're making this a personal partisan thing. (For instance did you vote for Hillary Clinton? She voted for the Iraq War. So how could you nominate and support such a person?)

I assume historians who we turn to too rank our Presidents attempt to take a dispassionate look when judging and coming up with their rankings and not just selecting their partisan favorites.

If someone is transformational it should be pretty easy to list why right?

 

[Truth Detector]

I certainly miss President Obama thesedays. I bet he's feeling pretty smug right now about Obamacare not being repealed. I am.

Translation:

I bet he's feeling pretty smug right now about Obamacare not being repealed. I am.

Obama was known for his smug and narcissistic attitude. But only a complete idiot thinks the Party of the Jackass has won on Obamacare.

But again, idiots like you and Obama think that they are still winning.

 

[Truth Detector]

Obama does stand in stark contrast to the Orange Clown.

Do be honest, I was a little annoyed by some of those on the left who seemed to spend the first six years of Obama's administration stating how "very disappointed" they were in Obama. Annoyed in the same way I was annoyed with Nader-voting lefties who claimed Al Gore was no better than George Dumbya Bush.

Obama was a transformational president in many ways, and mostly for the better. There are indeed few presidents who can lay claim to have been truly transformational. Obama is already being recognized for that, and as the years go by he might even crack the "top ten" list of best presidents.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Nobody actually remembers what the GDP growth rate was under Teddy Roosevelt, Calvin Coolidge, FDR, Lincoln, or Eisenhower.

Obama is going to be remembered for saving the nation from the Second Great Republican Depression, advancing the cause of universal health care and civil rights, saving the American auto industry, being very prescient on the foolish invasion of Iraq, and generally fixing the utter clusterfuck left to him by his predecessors, George Dumbya and Dick Cheney.

Reasons for which he is already being ranked 12th best by historians in this scholarly survey.

Agreed.

He will also be remembered clone attacks, less transparency in government, retaining the Patriot act and its internal spying on citizens and the significant increase in income inequality that occurred after the Bush recession and his inability to address the problem.

In other words Barry wasn't perfect but he sure was a far cry better than the previous administration which was historically one of the worst in this nations history.

 

[Truth Detector]

I wouldn't be smug if my signature program was causing insurance premiums to spike by 30-125% in every state of the union.

^Spot on.

There's a few things I will say for Obama. He can speak the English language, and he isn't a douchebag (at least in his public persona).

DUH: the man was a real genius. Of course, if you think saying "uh" and "me" or "myself" in every other word of as sentence is a sign of intelligence, you go for it!

I consider those the minimum basic requirements to run for/serve as president.

Well, if there were any truth to this laughable statement, you wouldn't have voted for Obama or Hillary. I am betting that you did. Hypocrite.

His successor couldn't even read a birth certificate, and hasn't fared much better in the literacy department ever since.

Now you just engage in flat out lies; typical with the whiney hypocritical left. The notion that a successful businessman who has made billions and gone to Warton School of Business can't read is laughably stupid and false.

You liberals love making yourselves look like the pathetic jackasses that represents the party of the Jackass don't you?

 

[Truth Detector]

I don't miss him at all as he almost succeeded in destroying the middle class. His stench will be felt for decades.

^Spot on. But remember, we are seeing these statements from really stupid dolts who vote for dishonest lying assholes from the DNC.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

You are entitled to your opinion.

I don't think anyone who voted for Dumbya and supported the catastrophic Iraq War Disaster is allowed to say Obama's foreign policy was a disaster.

Future historians place little weight on localized regional geopolitical conflicts. The Phillippine Insurrection carries almost no weight on the overall historical consensus of Teddy Roosevelts presidency. He is still considered a top five president. A Word War 2 and Civil War? Yes, great weight applies in presidential historical contexts.

For partisan reasons it could be entirely understandable why Bush voters don't want Obama's legacy ranked highly, because it would then reflect on the voting judgement of Bush voters themselves.

You could make lists all day long about Obama's achievements and mistakes. The bottom line is that I think there is a high probability history will easily rank him a transformational president, easily making the top third, or even a top ten spot.

I agree top third. Top ten? Time will tell.

 

[Truth Detector]

OBAMACARE IS BULLETPROOF ...
ALL THAT CAN REPLACE IT IS SINGLE PAYER...[/CENTER]

Irony from the leftist twit who claimed Hillary would win in a landslide, stupidly predicted a December surprise and now doubles down on his insanity by thinking that Trump will be removed from office due to the wild eyed, emotional hysterics of a FAKE media devoted to....wait for it....diminishing the Presidency.....something they hypocritically lampooned when they thought Hillary would win.

Let's face it; you leftists are too stupid for words and are incapable of comprehending the OBVIOUS.

 

[Truth Detector]

Nobody actually remembers what the GDP growth rate was under Teddy Roosevelt, Calvin Coolidge, FDR, Lincoln, or Eisenhower.

Obama is going to be remembered for saving the nation from the Second Great Republican Depression, advancing the cause of universal health care and civil rights, saving the American auto industry, being very prescient on the foolish invasion of Iraq, and generally fixing the utter clusterfuck left to him by his predecessors, George Dumbya and Dick Cheney.

Reasons for which he is already being ranked 12th best by historians in this scholarly survey.

Another massive pile of leftist bile; you Liberals are quite FULL of it.

 

[cawacko]

LOL LOL LOL LOL Spoken like a true chamber of commerce free market fundamentalist. Has it occurred to you that his economic record will be he prevented the Bush recession from becoming another Great Depression and that the recovery would have been far more robust if not for obstructionist in the opposing party who would rather have brought this nation down in flames than see a niger succeed?

The reality is, whether you like it or not, is Obamas legacy will largely be for three things. Digging this nation out of the huge shithole the previous administration dug us into, beginning the modernization of our backward and wasteful health care management system and for bringing the criminal responsible for the 911 terrorist attack to justice (something his predecessor deemed unimportant.).

If history blames anyone for weak economic growth during that period it will be an obstructionist GOP congress that accomplished exactly nothing during that time and prevented measures that would have improved economic growth from being implemented.

Mott, you laugh because you are a Keynesian who thinks the gov't can essentially do no harm to the economy when enacting legislation. This if we only had more stimulus the econony would have been better.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

You're making this a personal partisan thing. (For instance did you vote for Hillary Clinton? She voted for the Iraq War. So how could you nominate and support such a person?)

I assume historians who we turn to too rank our Presidents attempt to take a dispassionate look when judging and coming up with their rankings and not just selecting their partisan favorites.

If someone is transformational it should be pretty easy to list why right?

I voted against her in the primary but voted for he, and violated a vow, as I'll be damned I'd vote for Trump and his slimy low ball racist rhetoric.

As for Obama being transformational he was in that his election transformed our political process so that a racial minority can achieve high office. So he was certainly transformational in regards to our political process. In terms of governance and attempting to bridge our partisan divide and to lessen the influence of interest he failed to be transformational.

 

[Jarod]

You shouldn't be. If experience has taught me anything it is that it's not wise to be smug about anything having to do with politics.

I agree with that, but I do, cant help it.

 

[Truth Detector]

I voted against her in the primary but voted for he, and violated a vow, as I'll be damned I'd vote for Trump and his slimy low ball racist rhetoric.

LMAO; so in other words you are a lying hypocrite. Bravo!

As for Obama being transformational he was in that his election transformed our political process so that a racial minority can achieve high office.

Wrong again; his Presidency defined the failure of someone so woefully prepared to manage anything beyond a small local community organizer.

His arrogant, smug partisan methods caused the Democrats to LOSE the house in 2010, LOSE the Senate in 2014 and hand the Presidency to Trump and the republicans in 2016. Only BillyBob Clinton was capable of doing the same....and leftists admire these idiots.

So he was certainly transformational in regards to our political process.

Wrong; he transformed nothing but did succeed in being the most divisive Presidency in modern history.

In terms of governance and attempting to bridge our partisan divide and to lessen the influence of interest he failed to be transformational.

Wrong; he exacerbated it to the point that it is now. The FAKE media is doing everything it can to drive that wedge further into the American psych.

This will lead to further losses for the party of the Jackass.

 

[Truth Detector]

I agree with that, but I do, cant help it.

That's because you are

 

[Cypress]

You're making this a personal partisan thing. (For instance did you vote for Hillary Clinton? She voted for the Iraq War. So how could you nominate and support such a person?)

I assume historians who we turn to too rank our Presidents attempt to take a dispassionate look when judging and coming up with their rankings and not just selecting their partisan favorites.

If someone is transformational it should be pretty easy to list why right?

So here we go with the old "Democrats are just as bad if not worse than Republicans" meme.

Do you admit you were wrong, and Jarod, Evince, USCitizen, and I were right about the wisdom of invading Iraq? Just wondering what you think since you have had over a decade to think about the wisdom of your support for that invastion.



My conscience in clear, Cawacko. I voted for Bernie Sanders in the primary. And when my realistic voting choices came down to two people, both of whom initially supported that foolish invasion, I voted for the one that at least admitted years ago that her vote was a mistake. What was my other option, vote for a guy who actually lied about being against the war, while at the same time bellowing that we should have stolen the oil?

Cawacko, you anger is directed at the wrong person. It doesn't matter what I think of Obama, I know my opinion means nothing to you. I have posted tangible, reliable testimony of historical experts who rank Obama 12 best president ever. And you cannot claim these are biased Democratic historians, and they give prominent Republican presidents high marks.

I already gave you my personal reasons for why Obama was transformational. I'm not going to repeat myself. Ask any gay people you know how Obama has generally been on civil rights.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Mott, you laugh because you are a Keynesian who thinks the gov't can essentially do no harm to the economy when enacting legislation. This if we only had more stimulus the econony would have been better.

No Wacko. I'm a Keynesian/monetarist who believes there is a time and a place for public investment. I'm laughing cause history will blame an obstructionist congress for the weak recovery after the Bush recession as it is well known and time tested solutions to that problem that the GOP lead congress opposed every step of the way. This isn't arcane fed policy shit.

The fact is Obama is a moderate on fiscal policy who used proven methods to fix problems caused by free market fundamentalist supply siders.

Obamas major failure there was he didn't put enough of the Wall Street bankers who defrauded the American public in prison for their crimes. Now that would have been transformational.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

So here we go with the old "Democrats are just as bad if not worse than Republicans" meme.

Do you admit you were wrong, and Jarod, Evince, USCitizen, and I were right about the wisdom of invading Iraq? Just wondering what you think since you have had over a decade to think about the wisdom of your support for that invastion.



My conscience in clear, Cawacko. I voted for Bernie Sanders in the primary. And when my realistic voting choices came down to two people, both of whom initially supported that foolish invasion, I voted for the one that at least admitted years ago that her vote was a mistake. What was my other option, vote for a guy who actually lied about being against the war, while at the same time bellowing that we should have stolen the oil?

Cawacko, you anger is directed at the wrong person. It doesn't matter what I think of Obama, I know my opinion means nothing to you. I have posted tangible, reliable testimony of historical experts who rank Obama 12 best president ever. And you cannot claim these are biased Democratic historians, and they give prominent Republican presidents high marks.

I already gave you my personal reasons for why Obama was transformational. I'm not going to repeat myself. Ask any gay people you know how Obama has generally been on civil rights.

Hey you forgot me. I was one of the very first to oppose the immoral war in Iraq.