Emmett Till / Trayvon Martin - An Awakening to Racist Evil in America

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Superfreak said:
yes, that does happen. We have seen it before and we will see it again. Because the prosecution must be able to show beyond a reasonable doubt that the person did it. So unless you are suggesting we change that standard, then it will continue.
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She wants him to be taken outside the courthouse and strung up, apparently she wants a new crop of 'strange fruit'.
 
Superfreak said:
No, it is not irrelevant. How often to do we hear about the call for justice for those young black men who are killed by other young black men? No, we only hear about it when the young black man is killed by someone of a different race. In this case by an Hispanic man.

Can you honestly say the prosecution made its case beyond a reasonable doubt? That is what they are required by law to do.
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IMO the prosecution was so bad I'm tempted to wonder if a fix was in. Whether the whole intent was to get GZ off with bad lawyering.

There's no doubt in my mind the case went from prosecuting GZ to prosecuting TM. And for all the people here talking about evidence, you guys are basing it mostly on what GZ said, i.e. "he attacked me first", "he jumped me while I was waiting for the cops", "he looks suspicious, like he's on drugs or something". Do you not see the unfairness of giving GZ's testimony the most weight because he's alive and TM isn't? And what about Serino sneaking in his opinion that GZ seemed straightforward in his answers? The judge trying to strike that is like unringing a bell, it's out there for good.

I'll say it again, it was wrong for everyone to assume GZ was telling the truth about the killing when his own record of lying and deceit was downplayed.
 
christiefan915 said:
IMO the prosecution was so bad I'm tempted to wonder if a fix was in. Whether the whole intent was to get GZ off with bad lawyering.

There's no doubt in my mind the case went from prosecuting GZ to prosecuting TM. And for all the people here talking about evidence, you guys are basing it mostly on what GZ said, i.e. "he attacked me first", "he jumped me while I was waiting for the cops", "he looks suspicious, like he's on drugs or something". Do you not see the unfairness of giving GZ's testimony the most weight because he's alive and TM isn't? And what about Serino sneaking in his opinion that GZ seemed straightforward in his answers? The judge trying to strike that is like unringing a bell, it's out there for good.

I'll say it again, it was wrong for everyone to assume GZ was telling the truth about the killing when his own record of lying and deceit was downplayed.
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This whole post is exactly dead on. If I see one more moron claiming that Martin was "guilty" of attacking Zimmerman...

Moron, liar, racist? All three?
 
How ironic that this movie is coming out at just this time ..

Fruitvale Station and Trayvon Martin: We Have to Act

If the deaths of Trayvon Martin and Oscar Grant, the real-life protagonist of the new film Fruitvale Station, were isolated incidents, we could complain and then feel better. We could protest, and then move on. We could be angry, but with the hope that the travesties would not be repeated.

However, neither death represents a random miscarriage of justice. The unpunished (or underpunished) killing of a young man of color at the hands of a man with a gun is very familiar in our society, and familiar to me as an elected official. It takes me back to some of my past campaigns to place civilian oversight over police.

The release of Fruitvale Station, though, is a reminder of how we must still fight for common sense controls to rein in the few bad actors among the officers who are supposed to protect us.

---

Oscar Grant was killed in 2009, the year I became an Assemblymember. It moved me to take the San Francisco experience and try to transfer its success to BART. Police for that transit agency obviously need the same kind of civilian oversight that has made a difference in San Francisco. Grant is not the only one to have been shot and killed by BART police and, in the 1990s, a Bay Guardian review found that BART police's internal affairs had not sustained a single one of the 162 complaints against its officers.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tom-ammiano/fruitvale-station-trayvon-martin_b_3604058.html

 
blackascoal said:
How ironic that this movie is coming out at just this time ..

Fruitvale Station and Trayvon Martin: We Have to Act

If the deaths of Trayvon Martin and Oscar Grant, the real-life protagonist of the new film Fruitvale Station, were isolated incidents, we could complain and then feel better. We could protest, and then move on. We could be angry, but with the hope that the travesties would not be repeated.

However, neither death represents a random miscarriage of justice. The unpunished (or underpunished) killing of a young man of color at the hands of a man with a gun is very familiar in our society, and familiar to me as an elected official. It takes me back to some of my past campaigns to place civilian oversight over police.

The release of Fruitvale Station, though, is a reminder of how we must still fight for common sense controls to rein in the few bad actors among the officers who are supposed to protect us.

---

Oscar Grant was killed in 2009, the year I became an Assemblymember. It moved me to take the San Francisco experience and try to transfer its success to BART. Police for that transit agency obviously need the same kind of civilian oversight that has made a difference in San Francisco. Grant is not the only one to have been shot and killed by BART police and, in the 1990s, a Bay Guardian review found that BART police's internal affairs had not sustained a single one of the 162 complaints against its officers.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tom-ammiano/fruitvale-station-trayvon-martin_b_3604058.html

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Yeah I've been reading a lot about this I definitely want to see it.
 
Over 1,200 posts in, and I see that we still have a bunch of dummies rendering the word "racist" completely meaningless by leveling it at anyone who sneezes.

Good work, enlightened ones. You're really elevating the dialogue in America.
 
Rana said:
What testimony conflicted with hers? Zimmerman the liars?
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she stated that Martin was saying get off, yet others said Martin was on top

she stated that Martin would have told her if he was going to confront Zimmerman, yet also said that Martin asked Zimmerman why he was following him, then Zimmerman replied 'what are you doing around here', then she said a fight broke out. She testified that Martin was hit, yet when questioned on that she admitted she didn't know whether or not he was hit.

She testified it was Martin calling for help, yet her transcript from her deposition showed she had stated then that she didn't know if it was Martin or not.
 
blackascoal said:
How ironic that this movie is coming out at just this time ..

Fruitvale Station and Trayvon Martin: We Have to Act

If the deaths of Trayvon Martin and Oscar Grant, the real-life protagonist of the new film Fruitvale Station, were isolated incidents, we could complain and then feel better. We could protest, and then move on. We could be angry, but with the hope that the travesties would not be repeated.

However, neither death represents a random miscarriage of justice. The unpunished (or underpunished) killing of a young man of color at the hands of a man with a gun is very familiar in our society, and familiar to me as an elected official. It takes me back to some of my past campaigns to place civilian oversight over police.

The release of Fruitvale Station, though, is a reminder of how we must still fight for common sense controls to rein in the few bad actors among the officers who are supposed to protect us.

---

Oscar Grant was killed in 2009, the year I became an Assemblymember. It moved me to take the San Francisco experience and try to transfer its success to BART. Police for that transit agency obviously need the same kind of civilian oversight that has made a difference in San Francisco. Grant is not the only one to have been shot and killed by BART police and, in the 1990s, a Bay Guardian review found that BART police's internal affairs had not sustained a single one of the 162 complaints against its officers.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tom-ammiano/fruitvale-station-trayvon-martin_b_3604058.html

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I am sorry, I only got to the point they put him on the ground, I couldn't watch anymore, I am crying. I can't imagine my son going through that. It breaks my heart.
 
christiefan915 said:
IMO the prosecution was so bad I'm tempted to wonder if a fix was in. Whether the whole intent was to get GZ off with bad lawyering.
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That is another topic all together. But it was most certainly horrid. No clue as to whether or not that was intentional.

There's no doubt in my mind the case went from prosecuting GZ to prosecuting TM. And for all the people here talking about evidence, you guys are basing it mostly on what GZ said, i.e. "he attacked me first", "he jumped me while I was waiting for the cops", "he looks suspicious, like he's on drugs or something". Do you not see the unfairness of giving GZ's testimony the most weight because he's alive and TM isn't? And what about Serino sneaking in his opinion that GZ seemed straightforward in his answers? The judge trying to strike that is like unringing a bell, it's out there for good.
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I wasn't just GZ's testimony. But rather the fact that he had injuries from a fight and Martin did not (other than gunshot wound). That the gunshot wound came from an angle that supported his story. That GZ hadn't confronted others in the past, but had followed them. That the FBI investigation didn't reveal any previous racist behavior. That some witnesses said Martin was on top and others GZ. There was simply too much out there to get a conviction of 2nd murder. The manslaughter case I think could have been made, but the prosecution was inept at doing so.

I'll say it again, it was wrong for everyone to assume GZ was telling the truth about the killing when his own record of lying and deceit was downplayed.
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I understand that point of view. But he wasn't the only one whose story changed.
 
blackascoal said:
I'm glad that his sheets are off. It's so obvious now that he might as well just come right out and declare his hate for black people. His problems with me are more obvious now.

Like most racists, his world view and perceptions of people are rooted in fear and ignorance.
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We don't tend to live in racially segregated communities like you do in the US. My next door neighbour is black and you couldn't ask for a nicer person. She makes jerk chicken, rice and peas for us and my wife reciprocates with Thai food. I live right next to a large Muslim area, holy shit my dentist is aPakistani and his wife is the hygienist/receptionist. I must say that I had a huge amount of respect for you initially but some of the shit that you have come out with recently just makes the mind boggle.
 
Darla said:
LOL I love this response.

I just feel sad again reading this today. Superfreak actually isn't a racist, he just doesn't know how to listen, and arrogantly presumes he knows. A long time ago I told him that his postion on Acorn was a racist one, not meaning that he actually was racist. He flipped man. That's what led, at least in my mind, to our biggest falling out, because he was still enraged over that when Tom started his infamous rape thread.

Some people just don't want to listen. Or can't. At least not yet. I don't think they're hopeless, I just can't really stand listening to them talk.
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yet when I ask for an explanation to TRY and understand, her response was simply to dismiss me. Whatever the reason, I honestly do not understand that which I posted to her.
 
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