Atheist Survives Tornado, most of those killed were likely christians. LOL God!

[Steelplate]

instead of zealot spin I'll just give it to you without the ignorance you inserted.......saying that atheists are capable of doing good is not the same thing as saying that atheists will be capable of entering heaven without believing in a deity......

Did you read his quotes? "Just do good and I'll meet you there" I'm sure he didn't mean the depths of Hell.

 

[I'm Watermark]

Hmm, so a study by scientists who do not believe in God, shows exactly what they want it to, HUGE surprise. lolhttp://undergroundhealthreporter.com/effects-of-prayer-can-lead-to-healing#axzz2UD1eXi00
This is to show the other side of the coin

and one from a more liberal source
http://www.oprah.com/oprahradio/The-Power-of-Prayer

Who said the scientists don't believe in god?

 

[patriot66]

Who said the scientists don't believe in god?

the ones who don't believe in the power of prayer

 

[Timshel]

the ones who don't believe in the power of prayer

So, if their research says that prayer is ineffective then they don't believe in God sufficiently and we should not accept their research because of that? Yeah, you are objective.

 

[Sierra]

Who said the scientists don't believe in god?

I don't know about God, but only 6% of scientists are Republicans. Researchers puzzled why that number is so high.

 

[Sierra]

God never promised that there would be no suffering.

Especially for little colored children. He has some serious issue with them. Rich white guys though, he lessens their suffering quite a bit. Wait, maybe it's the tax code that does that....

 

[patriot66]

How ridiculously stupid and condescending. How is science their God? It would benefit them to have it work what way?

There is no proof of the efficacy of prayer as anything more than a placebo. You did not offer any. You googled for whatever piece of crap link you could find and pretend that a book linked to by Oprah Winfrey (who is a nut and one of the biggest advocates of woo in the country) and written by a doctor, not a researcher, is some sort of unbiased proof and equivalent to the largest study to date, because Oprah likes Obama. It is absurd. Really, I am laughing at you.

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=132674&page=1#.UZ-ZsUf0ob0

I laugh at you too, so it's cool

 

[patriot66]

So, if their resaerch says that prayer is ineffective then they don't believe in God sufficiently and we should not accept their research because of that? Yeah, you are objective.

No, if they do not beleive in the power of prayer, I would say they are not Christian at all.

 

[Phantasmal]

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=132674&page=1#.UZ-ZsUf0ob0

I laugh at you too, so it's cool

http://www.examiner.com/article/scientific-studies-on-the-effectiveness-of-intercessory-prayer

 

[I'm Watermark]

the ones who don't believe in the power of prayer

Research often doesn't align itself with the opinions of those conducting it. Sometimes it confirms their opinions, sometimes it changes it, sometimes it has no impact - but science is not just telling the public what you believe, and coming up with numbers to say you're right.

 

[Timshel]

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=132674&page=1#.UZ-ZsUf0ob0

I laugh at you too, so it's cool

A news article about various studies... Is that supposed to be proof of something?

Krucoff, who has promoted the notion that prayer helps says the study showed no impact.

http://www.dukehealth.org/health_library/news/9136

"it's clear there was no measurable impact on the primary composite endpoints of this study..." Krucoff

http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/PrayerTherapy.htm[URL="http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/PrayerTherapy.htm"][/URL]

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

How very condescending of you, most scientists have science as their god, so yes it would benefit them to have that work that way. What I am saying is that there a findings for both cases.

I don't think you know many scientists.

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

the ones who don't believe in the power of prayer

Scientists wouldn't be very good at their job(s) if they believed things not only without evidence but in spite of evidence showing otherwise. That's called being retarded, not being a scientist.

 

[Steelplate]

Scientists wouldn't be very good at their job(s) if they believed things not only without evidence but in spite of evidence showing otherwise. That's called being retarded, not being a scientist.

Scientists would be fine at their job if they believed in God but let empirical evidence determine the project they are working on.

Only close minded science zealots deny the possibility of the spiritual...there is enough testimonial evidence of near death experiences alone to create the possibility. But then again....only close minded religious zealots deny scientific empirical evidence.

There is no reason that the two have to be mutually exclusive of one another.

 

[Timshel]

Only close minded science zealots deny the possibility of the spiritual...there is enough testimonial evidence of near death experiences alone to create the possibility. But then again....only close minded religious zealots deny scientific empirical evidence.

Near death experiences provide no more scientific evidence for anything than do claims of alien abduction.

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

Scientists would be fine at their job if they believed in God but let empirical evidence determine the project they are working on.

You'll need to show where I stated otherwise.

Only close minded science zealots deny the possibility of the spiritual...

Why? Because they require evidence for a belief?

there is enough testimonial evidence of near death experiences alone to create the possibility.

Which is EASILY destroyed by rationality and logic.

But then again....only close minded religious zealots deny scientific empirical evidence.

More or less.

There is no reason that the two have to be mutually exclusive of one another.

Again, you're going to have to show me where I said otherwise.

 

[Steelplate]

Near death experiences provide no more scientific evidence for anything than do claims of alien abduction.

A consistent testimonial? Nearly everyone having virtually the same experiences doesn't even warrant the POSSIBILITY?

You guys are just as bad as the young Earthers.

 

[Steelplate]

You'll need to show where I stated otherwise.

Why? Because they require evidence for a belief? Which is EASILY destroyed by rationality and logic. More or less.

Again, you're going to have to show me where I said otherwise.

Read the first sentence in the post I responded to.

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

A consistent testimonial? Nearly everyone having virtually the same experiences doesn't even warrant the POSSIBILITY?

Possibility can mean anything. It's equally possible (and far more probable) that those testimonials were influenced by preconceived notions of death and the afterlife. Would it be proof of my beliefs if I, near dying, saw the unspeakable horrors of R'lyeh?

You guys are just as bad as the young Earthers.

Uh huh, ok.

 

[Steelplate]

Possibility can mean anything. It's equally possible (and far more probable) that those testimonials were influenced by preconceived notions of death and the afterlife. Would it be proof of my beliefs if I, near dying, saw the unspeakable horrors of R'lyeh?

Uh huh, ok.

We are not talking about near dying...we are talking about heart stopped, no brain activity dead and brought back. Chemical changes within the brain as it's dying? I could buy that...but that has nothing to do with preconceived notions.

No, there are consistent reports of a bright light, an incredible feeling of peace and oft times, a deceased family member greeting them and telling them they are "going back". All of this while they are clinically dead on the gurney....there are also reports of the clinically dead patient recalling word for word the conversations between the doctors and nurses that are working on them.

The most reasonable scientific explanation is chemical changes in the brain to decrease the fear of death and make the transition to death easier for the dying....and I won't dismiss the possibility of that....but "science only" guys are extremely quick to dismiss the possibility of consciousness moving on after the physical body dies.