Happy Indigenous People's Day!

Cypress said:
I have never intentionally sugar coated that slavery and ritual sacrifice were practiced by some indigenous cultures.

That is a separate issue from how the Europeans choose to treat native peoples. Europeans had overwhelming military superiority and had the choice to dictate terms.

"Might makes right" was supposed to go out of fashion with the end of Roman pagan culture and the rise of Christendom. Christianity supposedly was a harbinger of a new kind of morality.

If the Indians had sent fleets over to Europe and cheated, lied, and decieved their way into taking over Europe, my reaction would be exactly the same.

I do not expect the European colonizers to have been boy scouts. But the fact we know that the French and the Spanish treated native peoples in substantially different ways means that cruelty and lying was not the only option open to Europeans
Click to expand...

Never thought you did.

Agreed on the Euros. OTOH, they were not superior except in their ability to kill. They're still human beings and, IMO, most human beings are assholes when it comes to survival and resolving conflict.

"Might makes Right" was in full play on 1/6, Cancel Culture and in every riot in America. It has never gone away. Agreed on Christianity, but most "Christians" aren't really more than lip-service Christians. As everyone can see on JPP, most Christians are anti-Christian and wear their religion as a mask, not as a faith. Their actions and words belie their claims of religious beliefs.


Agreed had it gone the other way. My ancestors were victims of the fucking Romans, the fucking Spaniards and the fucking Brits. All through "Might makes Right". I refuse to be a victim of a Trump dictatorship.


The Spanish enslaved indigenous peoples and left a culture where there's one El Hefe and a shitload of Peons. We can see the result of the French in their own country today and how they treated citizens in their colonies: Second Class Citizens.
 
I signed up for a best of the Westerns channel on Prime video. The stereotyping of native Americans
and South Americans by both Hollywood and the Italian spaghetti western crowd is interesting.
Partly interesting because they did deal (honestly confront)with Western immorality and duplicity towards Indians, but the language
used "savages" "redskins" "peasants," and I actually heard "peons" in one movie.

The movies range from 1940-1974....
 
Hello leaningright,

leaningright said:
I remember when the proposal was gaining traction. I wrote a letter to our chief back then basically outlining the stance I have laid out here and urged him to propose choosing another day. I just feel that it is divisive to choose that day…especially when presented with the word “replacing.”
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I respectfully disagree.

Ultimately the old irresponsible and wrong celebration does need to be replaced with the new and proper one.

We have been celebrating the wrong thing.

It'd never too late to change.
 
Hello Cypress,

Cypress said:
I have never intentionally sugar coated that slavery and ritual sacrifice were practiced by some indigenous cultures.

That is a separate issue from how the Europeans choose to treat native peoples. Europeans had overwhelming military superiority and had the choice to dictate terms.

"Might makes right" was supposed to go out of fashion with the end of Greco-Roman pagan culture and the rise of Christendom. Christianity supposedly was a harbinger of a new kind of morality.

If the Indians had sent fleets over to Europe and cheated, lied, and decieved their way into taking over Europe, my reaction would be exactly the same.

I do not expect the European colonizers to have been boy scouts. But the fact we know that the French and the Spanish treated native peoples in substantially different ways means that cruelty and lying was not the only option open to Europeans
Click to expand...

They came with the sanction of royalty. They should have been more honorable. The fact that they were not contributed to an understanding that the very notion of governance by royalty was a flawed concept.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Never thought you did.

Agreed on the Euros. OTOH, they were not superior except in their ability to kill. They're still human beings and, IMO, most human beings are assholes when it comes to survival and resolving conflict.

"Might makes Right" was in full play on 1/6, Cancel Culture and in every riot in America. It has never gone away. Agreed on Christianity, but most "Christians" aren't really more than lip-service Christians. As everyone can see on JPP, most Christians are anti-Christian and wear their religion as a mask, not as a faith. Their actions and words belie their claims of religious beliefs.


Agreed had it gone the other way. My ancestors were victims of the fucking Romans, the fucking Spaniards and the fucking Brits. All through "Might makes Right". I refuse to be a victim of a Trump dictatorship.


The Spanish enslaved indigenous peoples and left a culture where there's one El Hefe and a shitload of Peons. We can see the result of the French in their own country today and how they treated citizens in their colonies: Second Class Citizens.
Click to expand...

I don't think I have ever commended you for being an insightful and intelligent participant in all these kind of threads. Cheers, chap!
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Do you agree it's been going on for over 20,000 years in the Americas and over 200,000 years in Africa/ME/Mediterranean/Asia/Europe?
Click to expand...

The planet is only so big. Names of lands have changed. Borders have changed. I never argued specifics. You're fighting over nothing. Geeeeesh. In another 20k years it'll be different again.
I'm just talking in the broadest sense. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with any of you. Simply mentioned that the inhabitants have all changed over time. That's life.
 
Evidence of humans in North America during the Last Glacial Maximum

Early footsteps in the Americas
Despite a plethora of archaeological research over the past century, the timing of human migration into the Americas is still far from resolved. In a study of exposed outcrops of Lake Otero in White Sands National Park in New Mexico, Bennett et al. reveal numerous human footprints dating to about 23,000 to 21,000 years ago. These finds indicate the presence of humans in North America for approximately two millennia during the Last Glacial Maximum south of the migratory barrier created by the ice sheets to the north. This timing coincided with a Northern Hemispheric abrupt warming event, Dansgaard-Oeschger event 2, which drew down lake levels and allowed humans and megafauna to walk on newly exposed surfaces, creating tracks that became preserved in the geologic record. —AMS



Abstract
Archaeologists and researchers in allied fields have long sought to understand human colonization of North America. Questions remain about when and how people migrated, where they originated, and how their arrival affected the established fauna and landscape. Here, we present evidence from excavated surfaces in White Sands National Park (New Mexico, United States), where multiple in situ human footprints are stratigraphically constrained and bracketed by seed layers that yield calibrated radiocarbon ages between ~23 and 21 thousand years ago. These findings confirm the presence of humans in North America during the Last Glacial Maximum, adding evidence to the antiquity of human colonization of the Americas and providing a temporal range extension for the coexistence of early inhabitants and Pleistocene megafauna.


https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126...=SciMag&utm_source=Social&utm_medium=Facebook
Click to expand...



Then ol' Chris discovered it, twenty three thousand years later.


Haw, haw, haw, haw...............................haw.
 
Goodbye The Sage of Main Street,

The Sage of Main Street said:
You can ....
Click to expand...

My first post to you, I asked if it was agreeable that we do not get personal with one another; you never answered. Not good. That let me know that you had no intention of such an agreement. You were on thin ice since that moment. I told you how I roll. You ignored it. And now here you are, ignoring my clearly stated standard for basic respectful conversation, talking about me, trying to make me the subject, trying to put me personally on the defense. I'll simply not have it.

I say no. I am not going there. And this is the exact moment to cut that off. A line has been crossed. I have identified it.

I choose to note that demarcation with an excommunication.

I don't come here to talk about me or be in a conversation about me. I come here to actually talk about politics.

Here's why. It's the Eleanor Roosevelt Rule. Great minds talk about ideas. Average minds speak of current events. And small minds talk about other people. I don't want to be small-minded. That's why I have my rule.

Now you are free to talk about me all you like. But you are done placing me personally on the defensive. Talk all you like about me but know that I will not be reading it, nor responding. You may reply to this post but it would be pointless. Go ahead. Knock yourself out. Really let me have it. Say whatever you like about me, but if you think you are going to play mind games with me you've got another thing coming.

You done been shut down!

Now, I hold no malice. I don't hate you. I don't hate anybody. I wish you well. I hope you have a really good life. I simply refuse to be part of it.

I have my standards. I have to stand up for what I believe in. I think you have to stand for something or you'll fall for anything. I'll leave you with a song as I say: Goodbye forever and have a nice life:"

 
I enjoy giving one three-hundred-and-sixty-fifth of my year to honoring the First Americans. Some lost Italian in a boat- not so much.



Haw, haw............................haw.
 
PoliTalker said:
Goodbye The Sage of Main Street,



My first post to you, I asked if it was agreeable that we do not get personal with one another; you never answered. Not good. That let me know that you had no intention of such an agreement. You were on thin ice since that moment. I told you how I roll. You ignored it. And now here you are, ignoring my clearly stated standard for basic respectful conversation, talking about me, trying to make me the subject, trying to put me personally on the defense. I'll simply not have it.

I say no. I am not going there. And this is the exact moment to cut that off. A line has been crossed. I have identified it.

I choose to note that demarcation with an excommunication.

I don't come here to talk about me or be in a conversation about me. I come here to actually talk about politics.

Here's why. It's the Eleanor Roosevelt Rule. Great minds talk about ideas. Average minds speak of current events. And small minds talk about other people. I don't want to be small-minded. That's why I have my rule.

Now you are free to talk about me all you like. But you are done placing me personally on the defensive. Talk all you like about me but know that I will not be reading it, nor responding. You may reply to this post but it would be pointless. Go ahead. Knock yourself out. Really let me have it. Say whatever you like about me, but if you think you are going to play mind games with me you've got another thing coming.

You done been shut down!

Now, I hold no malice. I don't hate you. I don't hate anybody. I wish you well. I hope you have a really good life. I simply refuse to be part of it.

I have my standards. I have to stand up for what I believe in. I think you have to stand for something or you'll fall for anything. I'll leave you with a song as I say: Goodbye forever and have a nice life:"

Click to expand...

Why dignify them with a swan song. I just read his native Americans are Darwin case savages post. He's a scumbag. Block.
Why take a tour of human blight when he so clearly marked a bypass for you? Oh well, we each get to truth our way.
I don't need to be personally insulted to not converse with an uneducated moron.
 
Micawber said:
I signed up for a best of the Westerns channel on Prime video. The stereotyping of native Americans
and South Americans by both Hollywood and the Italian spaghetti western crowd is interesting.
Partly interesting because they did deal (honestly confront)with Western immorality and duplicity towards Indians, but the language
used "savages" "redskins" "peasants," and I actually heard "peons" in one movie.

The movies range from 1940-1974....
Click to expand...
Peons is Spanish.

Savages and Redskins is certainly racist by modern standards. I have a Tablo and record movies off the digital broadcast channels (all non-prime channels).

Due to high freq hearing loss, I have CC up all the time. On one "family channel" of old westerns, they always bleep certain words. The only words they are bleeping in a 1950s Western are racist terms such as "redskins".
 
Micawber said:
Why dignify them with a swan song. I just read his native Americans are Darwin case savages post. He's a scumbag. Block.
Why take a tour of human blight when he so clearly marked a bypass for you? Oh well, we each get to truth our way.
I don't need to be personally insulted to not converse with an uneducated moron.
Click to expand...
He has a few screws that are loose and could be a Legion incarnation.

There's a couple posters who use a nonsensical posting style. My guess is they are all the same nutjob playing on the computer in between medication times and masturbating in a mental facility shower.

5qedi1.gif
The Sage of Main Street said:
Todd. With Two Ts, Whereas God Requires Only One

HeiressHeads have a tinsel-wrapped charisma that mesmerizes people who fixate on shiny objects.
Click to expand...
 
Micawber said:
lol, yes, a sort of what not to do again guide.
Click to expand...

Both what not to do, and what to emulate.

The historical figures of Ghandi, Frederick Douglass, the abolitionist movement, the woman's suffrage movement, the Prague Spring are all both inspirational and instructional.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
He has a few screws that are loose and could be a Legion incarnation.

There's a couple posters who use a nonsensical posting style. My guess is they are all the same nutjob playing on the computer in between medication times and masturbating in a mental facility shower.

5qedi1.gif
Click to expand...

Probably. Conversely, show me an intelligence who likes to insult me personally and I'll probably go toe to toe with them for quite some time.
The insults don't bug me, it's that arguments are so stupid I infer they think I'm stupid, and that insults me.
 
Cypress said:
Both what not to do, and what to emulate.

The historical figures of Ghandi, Frederick Douglass, the abolitionist movement, the woman's suffrage movement, the Prague Spring are all both inspirational and instructional.
Click to expand...

Outliers! I can make a longer list of infamy. I'm a half empty kind of guy.
 
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