Will the State or Federal Gov’t prosecute Trump?

[Into the Night]

I’d say that Trump going down big in his last election, coupled with his midterm disasters, and totally discrediting himself with his Big Lie bullshit, pretty much “got” Trump, even now his loyal allies as Murdoch are dissing him

You are hallucinating again.

 

[Into the Night]

C. All of the above.

Trump is screwed, and so is the GOP. He will take EVERYONE down with him. There are sitting US Congressmen who are going to be indicted. Probably a Senator or two as well. This is going to be epic, after all the shit we've taken from these morons. And they will do NOTHING except go to work the next day and feel like the chumps that they are.

KILL THE DISSIDENTS!

 

[Into the Night]

Trump has committed crimes by the truckload.

...such as??

He is guilty of wrongdoing repeatedly in the classified documents that he stole. He hid them, lied to the FBI and copied the docs onto a computer for future sales.

Trump didn't steal or sell any classified documents.

Trump has no chance in Georgia for his criminal attempt to try and get the Secretary of State to overthrow a fair and honest election. His phone calls are on tape.

Not a crime.

His organizing an insurrection is another crime he did.

Trump can't overthrow himself.

He also paid off women he had affairs with to keep quiet breaking election laws.

No such election law.

 

[Into the Night]

Here's the problem with that logic.

You discard logic.

Trump was told multiple times by his advisors, family, friends, cabinet members etc. that the election was not stolen.

The election was stolen. You can't make the evidence of election fraud by Democrats just disappear.

Willful ignorance is not a dodge for criminal intent.

You are not ignorant. Democrats intentionally committed election fraud. They still do.

The other thing that's missing to us is what others testified to grand jury.

It's very clear that the grand jury recommended indicting Trump. Trump must be indicted or there is no more rule of law. What the MAGA idiots might do in reaction should not be any part of the consideration. We either indict people for clear criminal violations or we don't. Not indicting Trump on multiple charges would be a disaster for public confidence in the system.

MAGA isn't a person. Trump has committed no crime.

Biden has, though.
Impeachable offenses by Biden include:

Supplying the enemy with weapons in time of war. This act was intentional.
Assisting in the invasion of the United States by a foreign power. This act was and is intentional.
Seizure of authority by unlawful means. This act was intentional.
Obtaining and retaining classified documents without authority, an exposing those documents to unauthorized personnel. This act was intentional and lasted for several years at least.
Encouraging civil war. This act was intentional.

I could go on, but a single one of these acts is sufficient for impeachment and removal from office.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Yes, of course.

 

[LurchAddams]

“Will Donald Trump go to prison for asking a Georgia official to ‘find’ him votes?”

“How easy it’s going to be to prosecute him for asking the secretary of state of Georgia to “find” 11,780 votes.”

“Trump’s meaning was perfectly clear: Find me enough ballots to put me just one vote ahead of my opponent. Overturn my defeat. The official tally had Joe Biden winning Georgia by 11,779 votes.”

“In situations like this one, prosecutors generally need to prove intent. In this instance they would presumably need to persuade jurors that Trump knew he was asking Raffensperger to cheat or to commit fraud or to meddle with legitimate election results. That’s what I’d want to find out if I was a juror.”

“But here’s the problem: Everything Trump said on the call suggests he was merely asking for a wrong to be righted and that he truly believed — correctly or not — the votes had been stolen from him.”

“If you take his words at face value, they suggest that he thought he’d been robbed and wanted Raffensperger to make things right, not that he was intentionally soliciting Raffensperger to commit election fraud.”

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/sto...d-raffensperger-11780-fani-willis-votes-crime

In other words, just like Russian collision, Trump’s Ukrainian “perfect call,” and even Trump’s attempted precoup speech on the morning of 1/6, it could come down to proving Trump’s intent, what was he hoping to accomplish based upon his words

Of course all evidence proves Trump knew by 1/2 that the Big Lie was a Big Lie, even his own staff told him so, but proving he knew it to an entire jury won’t be an easy task

Don’t be surprise if the Fulton County DA or DOJ doesn’t indite nor prosecute Trump, not worth the effort nor handing him/Fox the attention, which will just like the situations I noted above, lead the MAGA militia to echo he did nothing wrong, was totally innocent, innocent like OJ

I won't be surprised. trump still has a great deal of influence and even if he lacks resources, he'll raise money from the MAGA crowd for his defense. In the end, the State and Federal governments might decide the cost of prosecuting trump is greater than the benefit.

 

[LurchAddams]

Here's the problem with that logic. Trump was told multiple times by his advisors, family, friends, cabinet members etc. that the election was not stolen. Willful ignorance is not a dodge for criminal intent. The other thing that's missing to us is what others testified to grand jury.

It's very clear that the grand jury recommended indicting Trump. Trump must be indicted or there is no more rule of law. What the MAGA idiots might do in reaction should not be any part of the consideration. We either indict people for clear criminal violations or we don't. Not indicting Trump on multiple charges would be a disaster for public confidence in the system.

Even if trump's indicted he'll have unlimited resources and half the country behind him. It'll be tough slog.

 

[LurchAddams]

Wouldn’t be so sure of that, as usually works in these cases, some low lying subordinate takes the fall

As I’ve said before, Trump’s army of lawyers and accountants will keep any legal procedure delayed, appealed, and postponed out beyond Trump’s lifeline, and he ‘ll have a major TV Network arguing his case regardless of what he is accused of or done

I agree and I hope we're both wrong.

 

[LurchAddams]

In the MAGA militia, the “rule of law” is subjective, how else would anyone else seriously characterize 1/6 as a regular tourist day at the Capitol

Trump, along with many on the right, have pretty much torn down and ridiculed nearly every institution in the Government, the Law is just another example

One of the things trump fans liked about him was his ability to avoid consequences for anything he did and how much that infuriated his political enemies.

You can see some of that happening in this thread already.

 

[Into the Night]

Intent is the issue, but we have a lot of evidence he knew he had lost Georgia and the rest.

He also vaguely threatened the GA officials. I think most juries could see intent here. Whether it’s worth it or not is another question but to me showing that an ex-president is not above the law would be worth the effort.

Georgia never chose any electors. Trump didn't lose. Trump didn't threaten anyone in Georgia.

 

[Into the Night]

If he's indicted, that's good enough for me. Let him delay all he wants. But not bothering is unacceptable. It has to happen, or the rule of law is over.

So...you advocate civil war.

 

[Concart]

Even if trump's indicted he'll have unlimited resources and half the country behind him. It'll be tough slog.

Agreed, but my point is that the law is the law. Trump broke the law. Not indicting means he is allowed to do what no other person could do because everyone is afraid of him. I have no idea why, he is a fucking dunce.

 

[Into the Night]

In the MAGA militia, the “rule of law” is subjective, how else would anyone else seriously characterize 1/6 as a regular tourist day at the Capitol

Trump, along with many on the right, have pretty much torn down and ridiculed nearly every institution in the Government, the Law is just another example

MAGA isn't a militia. 'The Law' is not an institution.

 

[Into the Night]

As I just explained to your fellow MAGA militia there “red tsunami,” Trump has already lost, his embarrassment in 2020 plus humiliation over his Big Lie debacle has pretty much confined him to his Xanadu in Florida

MAGA isn't a militia. Trump didn't lose. There was no election in 2020.

 

[Into the Night]

I think they have a LOT more supporting evidence. But we'll see. I would honestly be shocked if he isn't indicted in Georgia. And Smith is clearly after him, and will also recommend multiple indictments. It's now all about whether someone is willing to pull the trigger. It has to happen.

Trump committed no crime in Georgia.

 

[Into the Night]

All the more reason to make it clear that we, the people, want to see those institutions restored. It is taking a long time to get rid of the stench of Trump, but it's going to happen. Watergate took this long, so did shutting down McCarthy.

No institution was dissolved by Trump.

 

[Concart]

ITN is on another bender. Who tilted him this time?

 

[Into the Night]

Agreed, but my point is that the law is the law. Trump broke the law.

You keep saying this, but you cannot specify the law or the specifics of any crime.

Not indicting means he is allowed to do what no other person could do because everyone is afraid of him. I have no idea why, he is a fucking dunce.

YOU are afraid of him. I am not. You don't get to speak for everyone.

 

[Concart]

Damn maybe I tilted him. I can tilt a poster I have on ignore. I'm that good!

 

[LurchAddams]

Agreed, but my point is that the law is the law. Trump broke the law. Not indicting means he is allowed to do what no other person could do because everyone is afraid of him. I have no idea why, he is a fucking dunce.

The reason: His influence and his unlimited resources. His flock will gladly contribute to his legal fund - not because they necessarily think he's innocent - but because they love to see his political enemies suffer.

Deep down, the MAGA crew knows what scum they've been supporting - it's part of what makes them so angry.