Will Obama Tax Health Benefits?

I can make a firm pledge," he said in Dover, N.H., on Sept. 12. "Under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase. Not your income tax, not your payroll tax, not your capital gains taxes, not any of your taxes."

He repeatedly vowed "you will not see any of your taxes increase one single dime."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=7228536

read my lips......

bye bye obama....
 
Yurt said:
I can make a firm pledge," he said in Dover, N.H., on Sept. 12. "Under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase. Not your income tax, not your payroll tax, not your capital gains taxes, not any of your taxes."

He repeatedly vowed "you will not see any of your taxes increase one single dime."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=7228536

read my lips......

bye bye obama....
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The other stuff seems to make clear that he is talking about income taxes but this is a whole 'nother animal and he should have stopped at capital gains taxes.

It's not quite a read my lips moment though. Let's get real.
 
No and he's not going to,
It's a balloon floated to get the eyes off the real details of cost.
neocons will think they have a small victory by him not taxing the benies.
 
Damocles said:
That would depend on whether you think cigarette taxes are part of "any".
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I still think the "any taxes" line is tied to taxes based on income as opposed to taxes based on whether you purchase cigarettes.

As I said, it seems to depend on whether you want to give Obama the benefit of the doubt.
 
Yurt said:
I can make a firm pledge," he said in Dover, N.H., on Sept. 12. "Under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase. Not your income tax, not your payroll tax, not your capital gains taxes, not any of your taxes."

He repeatedly vowed "you will not see any of your taxes increase one single dime."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=7228536

read my lips......

bye bye obama....
Click to expand...

He's said that more than once. I don't see how he can look himself in the mirror.
 
TuTu Monroe said:
He's said that more than once. I don't see how he can look himself in the mirror.
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All politicians lie. If you have guilt over lying the political field is probably not your ideal career choice. Now I agree Obama's opponent in '12 will hammer down on this issue if he/she feels Obama has broke his promise. Just my opinion not wanting to look in the mirror over this is probably nothing compared to what he or others have had to do to get to this level of government.
 
Dungheap said:
I still think the "any taxes" line is tied to taxes based on income as opposed to taxes based on whether you purchase cigarettes.

As I said, it seems to depend on whether you want to give Obama the benefit of the doubt.
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He is very careful in his speech, I have a difficult time believing that in this one instance, actually repeated in several different instances, he was not careful. And whether or not you want it, this is a read my lips moment. He made a "firm pledge" to do something, and instead of honoring it appears to try to find ways to weasel out of it. If it stops at the cigarettes it is doubtful it will be harmful, but if that is just one instance of working around his pledge (like taxing health benefits or other taxation) it will most definitely find its way into campaigns..
 
Damocles said:
He is very careful in his speech, I have a difficult time believing that in this one instance, actually repeated in several different instances, he was not careful. And whether or not you want it, this is a read my lips moment. He made a "firm pledge" to do something, and instead of honoring it appears to try to find ways to weasel out of it. If it stops at the cigarettes it is doubtful it will be harmful, but if that is just one instance of working around his pledge (like taxing health benefits or other taxation) it will most definitely find its way into campaigns..
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Well, if you want to be technical (which apparently you do) he said "under my plan . . ." in the quote above. In the debate he also talked about "under his plan . . . " So, the question becomes whether the cigarette taxes were part of his plan or not. Do you have him talking about not raising taxes aside from under his plan?

It's not a read my lips moment, which you seemingly concede. I agree that if he goes further it my evolve into a read my lips moment, but let's get real here. If taxes are not raised on people earning under $250,000 across the board (as opposed to cigarette smokers) you won't hear peep about it. The only folks making an issue of the cigarette taxes are people that hated Obama in the first place.

My theory seems to be holding up so far.
 
Dungheap said:
Well, if you want to be technical (which apparently you do) he said "under my plan . . ." in the quote above. In the debate he also talked about "under his plan . . . " So, the question becomes whether the cigarette taxes were part of his plan or not. Do you have him talking about not raising taxes aside from under his plan?

It's not a read my lips moment, which you seemingly concede. I agree that if he goes further it my evolve into a read my lips moment, but let's get real here. If taxes are not raised on people earning under $250,000 across the board (as opposed to cigarette smokers) you won't hear peep about it. The only folks making an issue of the cigarette taxes are people that hated Obama in the first place.

My theory seems to be holding up so far.
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Again, ways to weasel out are not what wins elections. Now you are beginning to make a new sound byte that reminds me of a different one. "I voted for it before I voted against it". Technically it wouldn't have been damaging, however in the real world of politics what lives on is a bit less romantic than that.

And you will note I made no issue about the cigarettes, I simply pointed out that if it becomes one of many examples it would definitely make it into campaigns and it won't magically go away on "Technically speaking..."
 
Onceler said:
Once again...can you tell me exactly where he has broken this promise?
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Federal tobacco tax for one. Hits the poor hardest, but you don't care. Each new tax proposed is going to be the "well, he didn't mean THAT tax.

This will be a major one if they go through with it, since the average company health care plan runs about $750/mo per employee. That's $9000/yr, which at the 15% tax bracket adds $1350 to that person's tax burden. That ain't peanuts. And that's not all. Removing the exemption for health benefits will also do away with pre-tax medical saving plans. That'll go over like a lead balloon, too. Most people who have a pre-tax medical savings plan at least put in their deductible - which is usually $1000/individual or $2000 per family.

What part of "not any of your taxes" is so difficult to understand? The promise was not only made, but hammered on repeatedly for several months during the campaign. You may support the tax increases, but at least be honest and admit they are going against one of his most central campaign promises. OTOH, I knew he was lying at the time. He's just proving us right - when all is said and done the liberal democrat government thinks the money earned by the people's labor belongs to the government. Letting us keep any of it is being generous.
 
Good Luck said:
Federal tobacco tax for one. Hits the poor hardest, but you don't care. Each new tax proposed is going to be the "well, he didn't mean THAT tax.

This will be a major one if they go through with it, since the average company health care plan runs about $750/mo per employee. That's $9000/yr, which at the 15% tax bracket adds $1350 to that person's tax burden. That ain't peanuts. And that's not all. Removing the exemption for health benefits will also do away with pre-tax medical saving plans. That'll go over like a lead balloon, too. Most people who have a pre-tax medical savings plan at least put in their deductible - which is usually $1000/individual or $2000 per family.

What part of "not any of your taxes" is so difficult to understand? The promise was not only made, but hammered on repeatedly for several months during the campaign. You may support the tax increases, but at least be honest and admit they are going against one of his most central campaign promises. OTOH, I knew he was lying at the time. He's just proving us right - when all is said and done the liberal democrat government thinks the money earned by the people's labor belongs to the government. Letting us keep any of it is being generous.
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If he stops with cigarettes it really won't resonate that loudly, but if there are many more it will become one of many in campaign commercials across the land.

Obama will be out, "Well, technically, I said..." and it will sound like, "I was for it before I was against it..." It won't work out well if he doesn't pay attention. But if he signs legislation that taxes health care benefits expect a double, they'll play this and the debate where he denigrated that idea then start listing taxes... I'm sure that one would likely get its own commercial.

It isn't difficult to see where it will go.
 
If anyone tries to make a big deal about Obama "breaking his promise" with an increase in the cigarette tax, they'll look ridiculous.

I would agree that if he taxes health bene's or anything beyond that, it would be damaging for him.
 
blackascoal said:
But you've hit upon the very reason why Americans have little control over our government.

Obama is a perpetual candidate and is more interested in making good speeches than he is in making good policy. I'm willing to bet you right now that there will be no public option in his healthcare tweaking plan. He's a centrist .. he doesn't do causes.

On the other side we have the republicans, 71% of whom said they would vote for Sarah Palin as president. Outside of Palin, the worst possible contender for the office in human history, they have little else, just as you say.

In the end, the American people are the lossers .. who are left to bash each other on websites like chickens in a pen, and who are left with few meaningful choices in determining the best government "for the people."

So we all stand around and just watch the sunset on the American Century .. and bash each other like chickens in a pen.

The only thing wrong with America is Americans.

It's OUR fault, not the politicians.
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Sigh.......I can't argue with that
 
when Obama starts taxing health benefits and then inevitably has to dip lower on the income tax tables for ways to pay for single payer, how many democrats on here will STILL vote for him in 2012?
 
SmarterThanYou said:
when Obama starts taxing health benefits and then inevitably has to dip lower on the income tax tables for ways to pay for single payer, how many democrats on here will STILL vote for him in 2012?
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All of them. What would be important is how many of the Independents that are registered would. Most Democrats are Democrats because the platform more closely resembles their political beliefs and they will vote Democrat because it is the most likely to progress those ideas, just like most Rs will vote for an R they dislike over a D because even the one they dislike is more likely to progress some of the ideas they believe are important.
 
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