We're a pro-choice nation

We want abortion to be rarely done, using it as routine birth control for those who cant be bothered to use birth control is wrong.
 
BartenderElite said:
And getting more so. Close to 60% consistently in polls support a woman's right to choose.

Everyone has the same goal: make abortions rare.

But keep them legal. It's middle ages stuff to ban them.
Click to expand...

We are a pro-choice nation but not about one topic...about everything. Can you deal with that bolshevik?
 
TOP said:
So why contribute to making people more careless and more irresponsible by offering that unlimited option? Do me a favor...Please don't tell those people they would have been better off aborted even if that's what you believe... I've been fighting against people who have been doing that my entire career.... I'm really on my BE KIND kick these days...we even had tshirts made.....sold out.. they were super soft..:) I pretty much try to get along with everyone....and do.. if that weren't true I would have never been able to do my job... which is one that, even though I'm retired, is never-ending... ;)
Click to expand...

You're really missing my point, here, TOP--all of them in fact, which is unlike you.

1. As an atheist, I don't now nor have I ever believed in the absolute value of human life.
I have always believed that life has to be valued, like everything else, in qualitative terms. That's the only thing that makes sense.
A life in which the rewards don't adequately compensate the travails , and I don't understand why this isn't obvious to everybody,
is a net-negative experience and therefore not worth much at all. Such is the life of an unwanted child.
Forcing anyone to live such a life is sadistic, and sadistic people need themselves be humanely euthanized for the good of decent people.

2. People who have unplanned children, or, at the very least, unwanted children, when they could have been prevented by birth control,
are much too irresponsible to be even minimally adequate parents. Not only should they be encouraged to abort such unplanned or unwanted pregnancies, but they should undergo psychiatric evaluation
to see if they should be sterilized. Everybody isn't mentally and/or physically qualified to be a breeder. I'm not saying to neuter them. Let them enjoy all the consensual recreational sex that they want.
Just don't subject innocent children to be raised by such despicable reprobates.

3. The theocratic and misogynist conservatives who want to deny women sovereignty over their own bodies are usually the very same people who complain about big government
interfering in our lives. I dare you to come up with an argument against euthanizing these logic-challenged, mentally deficient people for their own good and society's alike. It
cannot be done. You can't do it.

4. They shouldn't be telling us to not have abortions. We should be forcing them to have abortions--but we are not even suggesting that. Only I'm doing that.


Now, hopefully, I've been specific enough about my feelings on these matters so that whether one agrees or not, I'm understood
It's also important to understand that now of the above is hyperbole.
I mean everything that I said quite literally.
 
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NiftyNiblick said:
You're really missing my point, here, TOP--all of them in fact, which is unlike you.

1. As an atheist, I don't now nor have I ever believed in the absolute value of human life.
I have always believed that life has to be valued, like everything else, in qualitative terms. That's the only thing that makes sense.
A life in which the rewards don't adequately compensate the travails , and I don't understand why this isn't obvious to everybody,
is a net-negative experience and therefore not worth much at all. Such is the life of an unwanted child.
Forcing anyone to live such a life is sadistic, and sadistic people need themselves be humanely euthanized for the good of decent people.

2. People who have unplanned children, or, at the very least, unwanted children, when they could have been prevented by birth control,
are much too irresponsible to be even minimally adequate parents. Not only should they be encouraged to abort such unplanned or unwanted pregnancies, but they should undergo psychiatric evaluation
to see if they should be sterilized. Everybody isn't mentally and/or physically qualified to be a breeder. I'm not saying to neuter them. Let them enjoy all the consensual recreational sex that they want.
Just don't subject innocent children to be raised by such despicable reprobates.

3. The theocratic and misogynist conservatives who want to deny women sovereignty over their own bodies are usually the very same people who complain about big government
interfering in our lives. I dare you to come up with an argument against euthanizing these logic-challenged, mentally deficient people for their own good and society's alike. It
cannot be done. You can't do it.

4. They shouldn't be telling us to not have abortions. We should be forcing them to have abortions--but we are not even suggesting that. Only I'm doing that.


Now, hopefully, I've been specific enough about my feelings on these matters so that whether one agrees or not, I'm understood
It's also important to understand that now of the above is hyperbole.
I mean everything that I said quite literally.
Click to expand...

You sound like a ringside fat man with a cheap cigar.
 
ptif219 said:
Stop your lies. Abortion is what they do and they talk women into getting an abortion
Click to expand...

No dumbfuck that isn't what they do. They council and teach young women about birth control and where to get it and how to use it. Their education of the young has cut the number of abortions and cases of sexually transmitted diseases in this country in half or more. Yes they do refer those who are pregnant and don't want to have a child where to get an abortion but they don't perform them nor talk them into it. Your ignorance is astounding. The rightwing idea to "defund Planned Parenthood" would do nothing but cause the number of abortions in this country to skyrocket.


A new report from the Guttmacher Institute finds that U.S. abortion rates have reached a historic low since 1973 when Roe v. Wade made abortion legal across the country. This low is due to a decline in pregnancies overall, including increased access to birth control since the Affordable Care Act (ACA) was enacted in 2011. “This report confirms what we’ve long known to be true — that increasing people’s access to affordable and effective methods of birth control leads to fewer abortions. The report also shows that restrictive state laws are not responsible for a reduction in abortion. This shouldn’t be up for debate.

Cutting off Planned Parenthood does mean reducing access to birth control. Access to birth control reduces unplanned pregnancies, and 40 percent of unplanned pregnancies end in abortion.

The right truly doesn't give a flyin fuck about how many abortions are performed in this country when they say defund Planned Parenthood. Those who want to "defund" PP are truly PRO abortion because what they want will cause the number of them to skyrocket.
 
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BartenderElite said:
And getting more so. Close to 60% consistently in polls support a woman's right to choose.

Everyone has the same goal: make abortions rare.

But keep them legal. It's middle ages stuff to ban them.
Click to expand...

So I'm confused. You say everyone's goal is the same to, "make abortions rare" but keep them legal. But abortion has been legal for 40 yrs and there's been over 65 million abortions. Would that be considered legal and rare? There seems to be very little evidence that legal abortions result in rare abortions so I'm not sure what you're on about? Beyond that the only thing that's changed is states now decide the issue. It's funny how much you people hate it when you don't get everything you want.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
You're really missing my point, here, TOP--all of them in fact, which is unlike you.

1. As an atheist, I don't now nor have I ever believed in the absolute value of human life.
I have always believed that life has to be valued, like everything else, in qualitative terms. That's the only thing that makes sense.
A life in which the rewards don't adequately compensate the travails , and I don't understand why this isn't obvious to everybody,
is a net-negative experience and therefore not worth much at all. Such is the life of an unwanted child.
Forcing anyone to live such a life is sadistic, and sadistic people need themselves be humanely euthanized for the good of decent people.

2. People who have unplanned children, or, at the very least, unwanted children, when they could have been prevented by birth control,
are much too irresponsible to be even minimally adequate parents. Not only should they be encouraged to abort such unplanned or unwanted pregnancies, but they should undergo psychiatric evaluation
to see if they should be sterilized. Everybody isn't mentally and/or physically qualified to be a breeder. I'm not saying to neuter them. Let them enjoy all the consensual recreational sex that they want.
Just don't subject innocent children to be raised by such despicable reprobates.

3. The theocratic and misogynist conservatives who want to deny women sovereignty over their own bodies are usually the very same people who complain about big government
interfering in our lives. I dare you to come up with an argument against euthanizing these logic-challenged, mentally deficient people for their own good and society's alike. It
cannot be done. You can't do it.

4. They shouldn't be telling us to not have abortions. We should be forcing them to have abortions--but we are not even suggesting that. Only I'm doing that.


Now, hopefully, I've been specific enough about my feelings on these matters so that whether one agrees or not, I'm understood
It's also important to understand that now of the above is hyperbole.
I mean everything that I said quite literally.
Click to expand...
I don't think I missed any of your points and I'm sure that you do mean everything you post .... I respect most everyone's opinions and frustrations as long as they're sincere in their beliefs...... I'm just relieved that I don't agree with much of what you posted... if I gave up on people that easily I wouldn't have been much of a teacher...or a human...;)
 
TOP said:
I don't think I missed any of your points and I'm sure that you do mean everything you post .... I respect most everyone's opinions and frustrations as long as they're sincere in their beliefs...... I'm just relieved that I don't agree with much of what you posted... if I gave up on people that easily I wouldn't have been much of a teacher...or a human...;)
Click to expand...

I just find it difficult to understand how people see traits that I consider to be egregiously cruel to actually be virtuous,

but if one feels that there's value to living every life, no matter how ignominious,

then once we get past that,

it is understandable that said person would see things quite differently than I do.
 
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