two US teens show how NOT to be sociopaths

PostmodernProphet said:
is threatening to strike "good faith"......
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More right wing bullshit....do yourself a favor and look up the last time there was a general strike in Pennsylvania. I'd be willing to bet that there's a good chance it was before you were born.

Hell, I was just a kid....I'm thinking '74-'76....

Now...in PA, our school districts are locally operated....so they are much more common. But they aren't "Commonwealth Employees"
 
Steelplate said:
More right wing bullshit....do yourself a favor and look up the last time there was a general strike in Pennsylvania. I'd be willing to bet that there's a good chance it was before you were born.

Hell, I was just a kid....I'm thinking '74-'76....

Now...in PA, our school districts are locally operated....so they are much more common. But they aren't "Commonwealth Employees"
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so tell me.....if PA took action as they did in WI or IN, would you strike?......
 
PostmodernProphet said:
so tell me.....if PA took action as they did in WI or IN, would you strike?......
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If my union called for one? Yes. BTW, the last three contracts, we've given concessions. Big ones. But "union busting" is for the lazy and weak who don't want to sit at the table and work shit out.

I know, you don't believe that labor has the right to organize and negotiate in good faith. I do. All you have to do is look around you and see the state of our workforce in this country to see that we need unions more than ever.

But, I will give you this. In the 70's? Unions got way to big for their britches. Due to the OPEC oil embargo, businesses were hurt badly....they went to the unions for help and the unions wouldn't budge. So, in that respect...they helped seal their own fate.

Unions aren't bad unless they are inflexible to the needs of the business. What good is a $20/hour job if it forces the business to close or file bankruptcy?
 
Steelplate said:
If my union called for one? Yes. BTW, the last three contracts, we've given concessions. Big ones. But "union busting" is for the lazy and weak who don't want to sit at the table and work shit out.

I know, you don't believe that labor has the right to organize and negotiate in good faith. I do. All you have to do is look around you and see the state of our workforce in this country to see that we need unions more than ever.

But, I will give you this. In the 70's? Unions got way to big for their britches. Due to the OPEC oil embargo, businesses were hurt badly....they went to the unions for help and the unions wouldn't budge. So, in that respect...they helped seal their own fate.

Unions aren't bad unless they are inflexible to the needs of the business. What good is a $20/hour job if it forces the business to close or file bankruptcy?
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What did you get in return for those so called concessions. Unions aren't in the business of just giving shit up. You got something in return.

As for unions, like FDR, I only oppose them in the public sector because your real employer (the taxpayer) is not at the bargaining table but pandering politicians. Public unions have turned into nothing more than a money laundering scheme for democrats
 
Steelplate said:
If my union called for one? Yes. BTW, the last three contracts, we've given concessions. Big ones. But "union busting" is for the lazy and weak who don't want to sit at the table and work shit out.

I know, you don't believe that labor has the right to organize and negotiate in good faith. I do. All you have to do is look around you and see the state of our workforce in this country to see that we need unions more than ever.

But, I will give you this. In the 70's? Unions got way to big for their britches. Due to the OPEC oil embargo, businesses were hurt badly....they went to the unions for help and the unions wouldn't budge. So, in that respect...they helped seal their own fate.

Unions aren't bad unless they are inflexible to the needs of the business. What good is a $20/hour job if it forces the business to close or file bankruptcy?
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You'd enjoy sitting down and having a chat with my best friend about his job at Boeing. Not such a pretty picture in that case, and the engineers union actually cost him his job last October for a couple of months because he works through contractors and was in-between positions at the time and not covered by th union as a result. Pretty much he has nothing kind to say about them, and he's been working at Boeing for less than two years (he completed his BSME in 2011, and previously had a ton of engineering experience in Milwaukee).

That said, the Boeing unions are probably the lowest, shittiest example of organized labour in the country (especially the engineering onces as compared with the mechanics, etc.), simply because they already have dream pay and benefits and still feel entitled. I'm sure your sector and workplace experience shows a more favorable image. My friend is actually not as partisan as me, and his dad was a blue-collar Dem who worked at Boeing for 27 years as a millwright.
 
I Love America said:
What did you get in return for those so called concessions. Unions aren't in the business of just giving shit up. You got something in return.

As for unions, like FDR, I only oppose them in the public sector because your real employer (the taxpayer) is not at the bargaining table but pandering politicians. Public unions have turned into nothing more than a money laundering scheme for democrats
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Actually....we looked around at other states. Our local president had printouts of the agreements around the nation and compared them to what was negotiated and the Commonwealth's final offer and we agreed to accept it.

Four year contract, no pay raises for three out of the four, increased contributions to both our health care and our retirement, an increase in the time that a new employee becomes vested(the state matches retirement contributions) from 5 years to 10, loss of two sick days....and a few other things that I can't remember....it was two years ago.

Not in PA. Our Union dues go towards the local for operations. We have a voluntary PAC that we don't have to contribute to....and I don't.
 
Threedee said:
You'd enjoy sitting down and having a chat with my best friend about his job at Boeing. Not such a pretty picture in that case, and the engineers union actually cost him his job last October for a couple of months because he works through contractors and was in-between positions at the time and not covered by th union as a result. Pretty much he has nothing kind to say about them, and he's been working at Boeing for less than two years (he completed his BSME in 2011, and previously had a ton of engineering experience in Milwaukee).

That said, the Boeing unions are probably the lowest, shittiest example of organized labour in the country (especially the engineering onces as compared with the mechanics, etc.), simply because they already have dream pay and benefits and still feel entitled. I'm sure your sector and workplace experience shows a more favorable image. My friend is actually not as partisan as me, and his dad was a blue-collar Dem who worked at Boeing for 27 years as a millwright.
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That's the problem with unions....you can't keep demanding more when things are bad. Personally, I like the way Germany has a representative of labor as part of the board of directors. It cuts through the bullshit and provides transparency so that management can't be deceptive and the Union can't overreach.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
I don't think anyone should be paid higher pensions than the people who's property taxes are used to pay it......
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Maybe you should be questioning why private sector pensions went away rather than trying to take shit away from others. It's the private sector that got screwed out of them and it certainly wasn't because of "Gubmint" that did it.
 
The private sector pensions are going to start to disappear/diminish because they are turning out to be budget wreckers all over the place. Some of the townships facing bankruptcy accross the country (such as in California) can't meet their budgets because the most expensive liabilities are funds owed to city pension plans.
 
Threedee said:
The private sector pensions are going to start to disappear/diminish because they are turning out to be budget wreckers all over the place. Some of the townships facing bankruptcy accross the country (such as in California) can't meet their budgets because the most expensive liabilities are funds owed to city pension plans.
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They didn't use to be a problem until the Private Sector decided that paying employees good wages was so passe, and decided that...."hey, we could make a killing if we just had slave labor....you know there are many countries that are so dirt poot that we could get them to make our shit for pennies on the dollar!"

But now, since the vast majority of our population relied on those jobs, and they were replaced by shitty ones....now all of a sudden it's the Public Sector worker that's the enemy.

Like it's our fault that big business fucked the country....well, us...the poor and the elderly, that is.

Yes, public sector pensions will and should change. But don't fuck over the people who have dedicated their lives to public service and are nearing retirement. Start with new and low seniority employees that have the time to make the adjustment.
 
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