Trump U. on outsourcing

cawacko

cawacko

Well-known member
Came across this on Twitter which linked to the article so I'm assuming this is real but leave room open that it's not. I agree with what Trump is saying here. It does suck for workers who lose their jobs, no denying it, but it also is part of capitalism and what makes our economy grow.

Of course candidate Trump is saying the opposite today. I think he knows he can't do anything about offshoring but his rhetoric plays well on the campaign trail.



Outsourcing Creates Jobs in the Long Run


by Donald J. Trump
Chairman, Trump University



We hear terrible things about outsourcing jobs--how sending work outside of our companies is contributing to the demise of American businesses. But in this instance I have to take the unpopular stance that it is not always a terrible thing.

I understand that outsourcing means that employees lose jobs. Because work is often outsourced to other countries, it means Americans lose jobs. In other cases, nonunion employees get the work. Losing jobs is never a good thing, but we have to look at the bigger picture.

Last year, Nobel Prize-winning economist Dr. Lawrence R. Klein, the founder of Wharton Econometric Forecasting Associates, co-authored a study that showed how global outsourcing actually creates more jobs and increases wages, at least for IT workers. The study found that outsourcing helped companies be more competitive and more productive. That means they make more money, which means they funnel more into the economy, thereby, creating more jobs.

I know that doesn't make it any easier for people whose jobs have been outsourced overseas, but if a company's only means of survival is by farming jobs outside its walls, then sometimes it's a necessary step. The other option might be to close its doors for good.



https://web.archive.org/web/2006120...mp.trumpuniversity.com/default.asp?item=98255
 
Thats an interesting thought.....so the first question that pops into my mind is why.

Is it some gov. regulation that makes it necessary for companies to out source jobs overseas....
Is it gov. taxation for instance ?
Is it Union demands that drive companies overseas ?.....
Is it the opposition to 'right to work laws' ?
Is it immigration ?
Is it corporate greed ?

15 years ago I worked for a company that gave generous benefits, pensions, and reasonable pay to its employees.....whats changed in the last 15 years.....?
This outsourcing didn't happen by osmosis....so what is it ?

Whatever the reason is, these are the things that must be ironed out to make it impracticable to outsource US manufacturing offshore....even to make it unprofitable to do it....

Trump insists he will make Mexico pay for a wall and halt illegal immigration....how can he do it ?
The obvious answer to me is some sort of taxation or tariffs on Mexican goods imported....maybe some changes to NAFTA or something.....
 
NOVA said:
Thats an interesting thought.....so the first question that pops into my mind is why.

Is it some gov. regulation that makes it necessary for companies to out source jobs overseas....
Is it gov. taxation for instance ?
Is it Union demands that drive companies overseas ?.....
Is it the opposition to 'right to work laws' ?
Is it immigration ?
Is it corporate greed ?

15 years ago I worked for a company that gave generous benefits, pensions, and reasonable pay to its employees.....whats changed in the last 15 years.....?
This outsourcing didn't happen by osmosis....so what is it ?

Whatever the reason is, these are the things that must be ironed out to make it impracticable to outsource US manufacturing offshore....even to make it unprofitable to do it....

Trump insists he will make Mexico pay for a wall and halt illegal immigration....how can he do it ?
The obvious answer to me is some sort of taxation or tariffs on Mexican goods imported....maybe some changes to NAFTA or something.....
Click to expand...

The reality is there are certain jobs that are labor intensive and don't take a whole lot of brain power. So a US business would have the expenses of setting up shop here along with paying workers $20/hr plus benefits (or something along those lines) or they can go overseas where infrastructure costs are minimal and they can pay workers a couple of bucks an hour so that's what they do.

When people hear Trump (or anyone) say we're going to put tariffs on Mexico it can sound great in theory. But ultimately what that does is lead to a trade war. So we end up with higher priced goods locally and shrinking foreign demand for U.S. goods which costs us jobs.

We know technology and automation have eliminated many former manufacturing jobs and continue to do so. We could through up massive taxes to try and stop offshoring but that ends up having more negative consequences than the good it would do.

Ultimately we need to educate our youth in a way that prepares them better for the 21st century.
 
cawacko said:
The reality is there are certain jobs that are labor intensive and don't take a whole lot of brain power. So a US business would have the expenses of setting up shop here along with paying workers $20/hr plus benefits (or something along those lines) or they can go overseas where infrastructure costs are minimal and they can pay workers a couple of bucks an hour so that's what they do.

When people hear Trump (or anyone) say we're going to put tariffs on Mexico it can sound great in theory. But ultimately what that does is lead to a trade war. So we end up with higher priced goods locally and shrinking foreign demand for U.S. goods which costs us jobs.

We know technology and automation have eliminated many former manufacturing jobs and continue to do so. We could through up massive taxes to try and stop offshoring but that ends up having more negative consequences than the good it would do.

Ultimately we need to educate our youth in a way that prepares them better for the 21st century.
Click to expand...

True, there are many jobs that are labor intensive....why must they be paid 20 bucks an hour plus benefits....

if you're claiming no American will for less, you're obviously wrong....

If its because the business can't afford those wages because of taxes, its a taxation problem...

If you're claiming a unionized labor force demands that wage, then its a union problem making jobs scarce...remedy, right to work laws.......

If its businesses that are looking for slave labor, its corporate greed......an maybe a need to import tariffs on US owned offshore manufacturing.....

Illegals seem to have no problem finding work and don't bet you bank acct. that they work for nothing or min. wage in most cases......

Ultimately we need to educate our youth in a way that prepares them better for the 21st century.?....
You know what they say, 'you can lead a horse to water, but etc, etc. etc.....
 
NOVA said:
True, there are many jobs that are labor intensive....why must they be paid 20 bucks an hour plus benefits....

if you're claiming no American will for less, you're obviously wrong....

If its because the business can't afford those wages because of taxes, its a taxation problem...

If you're claiming a unionized labor force demands that wage, then its a union problem making jobs scarce...remedy, right to work laws.......

If its businesses that are looking for slave labor, its corporate greed......an maybe a need to import tariffs on US owned offshore manufacturing.....

Illegals seem to have no problem finding work and don't bet you bank acct. that they work for nothing or min. wage in most cases......

Ultimately we need to educate our youth in a way that prepares them better for the 21st century.?....
You know what they say, 'you can lead a horse to water, but etc, etc. etc.....
Click to expand...

1) Lower labor costs

2) Less environmental regulation

3) Less government regulation on their operations

4) Lower taxes

Those are reasons business offshore. There are some places where labor costs and environmental rules are increasing and companies are actually bringing manufacturing jobs back to the states.

It has to be a two prong approach to attacking this. One is what do we do today and the other is what do we do for the future. As far as schooling more emphasis needs to be placed on STEM studies to better prepare our kids for the information age.
 
NOVA said:
Thats an interesting thought.....so the first question that pops into my mind is why.

Is it some gov. regulation that makes it necessary for companies to out source jobs overseas....
Is it gov. taxation for instance ?
Is it Union demands that drive companies overseas ?.....
Is it the opposition to 'right to work laws' ?
Is it immigration ?
Is it corporate greed ?

15 years ago I worked for a company that gave generous benefits, pensions, and reasonable pay to its employees.....whats changed in the last 15 years.....?
This outsourcing didn't happen by osmosis....so what is it ?

Whatever the reason is, these are the things that must be ironed out to make it impracticable to outsource US manufacturing offshore....even to make it unprofitable to do it....

Trump insists he will make Mexico pay for a wall and halt illegal immigration....how can he do it ?
The obvious answer to me is some sort of taxation or tariffs on Mexican goods imported....maybe some changes to NAFTA or something.....
Click to expand...

I blame both sides (employees and employers) for the way things are now.
One side is going to say that the employers want more work, for less money
and
One side is going to say that the employees want less work, for more money.

When I was growing up, we had a lumber mill in town and pretty much everyone worked there, if you wanted a good paying job, and I remember one incident where a long term employee got to old to safely do the work.
So instead of the company "cutting him loose and putting him out to pasture", they talked to him, recognized the work he had done for all those past years, and offered him a different position, at his existing pay.
Basically they created a position and instead of having everyone sweep up around the machinery they were working at, they had him doing it.
Some people tried to tell him that the job was demeaning and his response was - "I had to sweep up before and still keep up with production; but now I get to sweep up and that this allows you all to stay on production. Plus I get good pay for doing it".
Some of the "guys tried to complain that the old man sweeping was making as much as or even more then they were and all he had to do was push a broom around.
They immediately changed their mind set, after a lot of the guys who had worked for years with the older guy explained life to them and the error of their thinking.
That "old guy" worked for many years after that, took pride in his job, and kept those floors clean, until his health finally got to the point that a Doctor said he couldn't work anymore.
They shut the plant down for his retirement party, gave him the old complimentary engraved gold pocket watch, and a monthly stipend, to where he wasn't in need.

Of course the thinking was different back then and people lived within their means and "keeping up with the Joneses" usually meant they passed you on some road.
 
cawacko said:
1) Lower labor costs

2) Less environmental regulation

3) Less government regulation on their operations

4) Lower taxes

Those are reasons business offshore. There are some places where labor costs and environmental rules are increasing and companies are actually bringing manufacturing jobs back to the states.

It has to be a two prong approach to attacking this. One is what do we do today and the other is what do we do for the future. As far as schooling more emphasis needs to be placed on STEM studies to better prepare our kids for the information age.
Click to expand...
youre ignoring why so many of them come back.

1) Superior, more reliable infrastructure.
2) A vast supply of highly skilled, highly educated worker.
3) Those workers are also the most productive in the world.
4) effective public institutions
5) a consistent regulatory environment
6) which 4 and 5 assure less graft, corruption and protects public safety and creates a secure business climate.
7) Quality of life.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
youre ignoring why so many of them come back.

1) Superior, more reliable infrastructure.
2) A vast supply of highly skilled, highly educated worker.
3) Those workers are also the most productive in the world.
4) effective public institutions
5) a consistent regulatory environment
6) which 4 and 5 assure less graft, corruption and protects public safety and creates a secure business climate.
7) Quality of life.
Click to expand...

If you're Nike you don't need highly educated workers to pay someone in Vietnam $2/hr to make shoes. And quality of life has nothing to do with that. What business have brought back manufactory for the reasons you listed?
 
cawacko said:
If you're Nike you don't need highly educated workers to pay someone in Vietnam $2/hr to make shoes. And quality of life has nothing to do with that. What business have brought back manufactory for the reasons you listed?
Click to expand...
You're missing my point. Many companies have outsourced work only to return because the lower costs for labor did not offset hidden inefficiencies.
 
Interesting thread for a change and all are making good points.....keeping jobs in the US and creating more is a multifaceted problem and each
company probably has its own unique problems that make moving offshore attractive.....both gov. and corps. need to sit down and talk it out.....
There is probably blame on both sides and a one size fits all approach to rectify problems doesn't seem to be working.....

nice chat....
 
cawacko said:
That may be for some but the biggest reason is escalating wages, especially in China.
Click to expand...
That and a less stable business environment (corruption) abroad, proximity to their supply plan, lower transportation and warehousing costs, superior customer service leading to higher customer problem resolution through superior communication, higher production quality, improved operational efficiencies, ability to deliver products to customers more timely and efficiently, improved adaptability to changing business conditions and technological innovations, etc.

Even manufacturing has been finding that the lowest cost model isn't always the most profitable.
 
Last edited:
Mott the Hoople said:
That and a less stable business environment (corruption) abroad, proximity to their supply plan, lower transportation and warehousing costs, superior customer service leading to higher customer problem resolution through superior communication.
Click to expand...

Millions of manufacturing jobs have been offshored over the past decade. Recently a few have been brought back but it's not even in the same area code numbers wise as those that have left.
 
cawacko said:
Came across this on Twitter which linked to the article so I'm assuming this is real but leave room open that it's not. I agree with what Trump is saying here. It does suck for workers who lose their jobs, no denying it, but it also is part of capitalism and what makes our economy grow.

Of course candidate Trump is saying the opposite today. I think he knows he can't do anything about offshoring but his rhetoric plays well on the campaign trail.



Outsourcing Creates Jobs in the Long Run


by Donald J. Trump
Chairman, Trump University



We hear terrible things about outsourcing jobs--how sending work outside of our companies is contributing to the demise of American businesses. But in this instance I have to take the unpopular stance that it is not always a terrible thing.

I understand that outsourcing means that employees lose jobs. Because work is often outsourced to other countries, it means Americans lose jobs. In other cases, nonunion employees get the work. Losing jobs is never a good thing, but we have to look at the bigger picture.

Last year, Nobel Prize-winning economist Dr. Lawrence R. Klein, the founder of Wharton Econometric Forecasting Associates, co-authored a study that showed how global outsourcing actually creates more jobs and increases wages, at least for IT workers. The study found that outsourcing helped companies be more competitive and more productive. That means they make more money, which means they funnel more into the economy, thereby, creating more jobs.

I know that doesn't make it any easier for people whose jobs have been outsourced overseas, but if a company's only means of survival is by farming jobs outside its walls, then sometimes it's a necessary step. The other option might be to close its doors for good.



https://web.archive.org/web/2006120...mp.trumpuniversity.com/default.asp?item=98255
Click to expand...

This as many issues is a complete distraction. The issue isn't really how much money you earn. The issue is your purchasing power. Meaning how far can your money go.

Americans started losing purchasing power at the formation of the federal reserve that steals citizens wealth through inflation

This process accelerated when we were taken off of the gold standard. Of course the wizards of smart will scoff at the idea of the gold standard as "unworkable". But, then you notice that those that are vehemently opposed to the gold standard are big government statists and the bankstas.

Blaming China, Mexico, Vietnam for "outsourcing" is a ploy used by the statists to distract the economically illiterate.

They want people to blame foreigners and not the government elitist who rob them blind every day.

Whether a job is eliminated through advancements in technology or sent overseas is really irrelevant.
 
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