Thoughts and Prayers = Deplorable

Thing1 said:
Loads of generalization in there. Just loads.
Click to expand...

Where?
Hate the sin, but love the sinner is the summation in total...just 2 simple lessons...how difficult is this for you to grasp. I'm not saying you have to believe this...just looking for your simple comprehension of what I've stated.

Do you understand the difference?
 
Covfefe said:
Islam borrowed much from both Islam and Christianity. Mohammad was influenced by both religions.
Click to expand...

Sure, as did Christianity from Greco Roman mythology, Jainism one and on. We are, after all, talking 920 AD or so.
I read a short book on Islam by Karen Armstrong some years ago. That's about all I know of the religion. At least she is a scholar
and the writing demonstrated it with the required dispassion. I tune out the right and the left and pop culture generally on Islam and all things, really.
 
Micawber said:
Sure, as did Christianity from Greco Roman mythology, Jainism one and on. We are, after all, talking 920 AD or so.
I read a short book on Islam by Karen Armstrong some years ago. That's about all I know of the religion. At least she is a scholar
and the writing demonstrated it with the required dispassion. I tune out the right and the left and pop culture generally on Islam and all things, really.
Click to expand...
Karen Armstrong is one of my favorites, I have all her books, “The History of God” is my favorite.
 
Thing1 said:
Some of those comments are ridiculous and go way too far, but I get why "thoughts and prayers" has become a focus point on this. It has just become a repetitive cycle, and it definitely isn't enough.

I don't know what the answer is on this stuff. I don't like that one guy can fire over 450 shots. I don't like that these kinds of incidents seem to be becoming more common. I support the 2nd, but don't know what it is about America that we have so much gun violence compared to most other countries.

I also don't like that Trump & the right have selective logic when it comes to mental health & extreme vetting.
Click to expand...

the problem with "mental health" is that it's in the governments hands and it is a backdoor for the government to confiscate weapons. I mean should a completely skitzo departed from reality individual like desh have a gun? No. What about someone that was depressed 10 years ago? Make no mistake, the mental health thing is feature creep and the government can't be trusted on it.

Re: gun violence.... if you filtered out gang shootings and suicides it drastically brings that number down. Randos getting shot as a result of mass shootings is immensely rare and a non-issue.
 
I think the sum of the "prayer" issue is simply a frustration. It may be the bible that coin word and deed go hand in hand.
They usually come from bible, get tarted up with Shakespeare and become modern idioms. Anyway, that's the whole of it.
Liberals are tired of expressions of sympathy when it is within ability to actually do something good instead of regretting the
past wrong which could have been prevented.

STFU and do something about it. Sympathy and prayer rings hollow.
 
Micawber said:
Yep, for openers the branding Islam with the stain of the terrorists who claim Islam.
Just who the hell do these Islam bashers think would really win the culture war if a quarter of the world's population were terrorists.

1.5 billion Muslims are not terrorists.

Second, the old testament is certainly not a book of love. It is a book of obedience and a wrathful jealous and petty tyrant who expresses love in the way
a jealous wife beating child beating abusive spouse does. Not admirable. As the Koran was cobbled together even after the old testement, not having read it,
I'd wager its text is no more facially obominable than the Christian bible.
Click to expand...

at least a third of all muslims worldwide support killing anyone that leaves the faith.

it's the most violent religion in the world today.
 
Covfefe said:
Karen Armstrong is one of my favorites, I have all her books, “The History of God” is my favorite.
Click to expand...

Yes, she pretty gifted. The slim volume was well endnoted as I recall. It documented well the history and schisms that evolved into Sunni and Sharia that
made historical sense from what presently just appears to be a ridiculous anachronism turned blood feud writ large. I liked the portions which highlighted the diversity
across epochs and civilizations. I recall a tolerant Islamic society perhaps ruling India in a sort of renaissance with much toleration and coexistence with Hindu and
Christianity. Different times place and a different Islam.
 
Micawber said:
Find a credible link for that falsehood. Total horseshit. Worldnet? Drudge? What's your scholarship for it?
Click to expand...

it's cute how you think I make such a strong specific claim without the means to back it up.

My source is the words from muslims themselves:

Remember, these are facts, not feels. This is straight from their own mouths:

Here is a pew research poll asking of muslims, among other things, their opinions on stoning for adultery, and their support for killing anyone that happens to leave the faith:

vQkIN.jpg


I decided to look at those numbers in greater depth. My focus was specifically on the "death for apostasy" part of the poll, as that is a question that directly ties into a core aspect of their religious belief (whereas stoning might have some more secular beliefs behind it as well..).

I think it's fair to say that if you believe someone should die for leaving your faith, that such a viewpoint is not very tolerant, and is in fact rather dangerous.

First, I took the population of each country as a whole, and then I isolated just the muslim members of each country. After that, I just calculated the raw totals of muslims that answered in the affirmative regarding death for apostasy. Just basic math here, simply multiplying the percentage stated on the poll versus the total population of the countries muslims:

(The population and demographic information come from wikipedia)

Turkey

Population: 74 million (98% muslim)

72.5 million muslims

Number of Muslims believing that someone should die if they leave the faith: 3.6 million

Egypt

**Population:** 90 million (90% identify as muslim)

81 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 68 million

Jordan

Population: 6 million (92% muslim)

5,500000 muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 4.7 million

Lebanon

Population: 4 million (60% muslim)

2.4 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 144,000 (good job lebanon)

Indonesia

Population: 237,400,000 (86% muslim)

204 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 61 million

Pakistan

Population: 180 million (97%)

174 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 132 million

Nigeria

Population: 170 million (50% muslim)

85 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 42.5 million

___

Total Muslims in these Countries: ~624,400,000 (Nearly 40% of ALL muslims in the world btw)

Total Muslims that believe you should be killed for leaving their religion: ~311,944,000 (50% of muslims polled)

Conclusion:

We only looked at 7 countries. We didn't include Syria, many north african muslim countries, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Yemen, and many other countries that no doubt also have very extreme believers in Islam. Even so, without even considering those other nations, we already have a hard number of at least 20% of all muslims world wide, being completely intolerant in their view of religion. They believe you should be put to death if you leave the faith. If we were to look at some of the other countries listed above, this number may even be higher, and probably closer to 30-35%.

While these intolerant/psychotic muslims are a minority, they are a very sizable portion of the muslim faith. They are not "extremists" or a fringe group of paltry numbers.

And of course I'll add the usual asterisk that many other religions may have similar numbers when it comes to having rather violent beliefs and attitudes.

tagging this with a unique word so i can find my copypasta later: islamcopypasta
 
archives said:
That is what is refered to as framing, the people saying such were not attacking prayer, as the article and comments that followed suggest, rather the employment of the cliche, "thoughts and prayers," that is echoed every time after a shooting to put off dealing with the issues surrounding guns

The article is nothing but another deflection
Click to expand...

I think many of this generation are just uncomfortable with ideas of true mourning, solace, condolences, sympathy and death. It's a part of life. When I was growing up (in the 50's & 60's) parents taught their children more about life and death, funerals, importance of sending sympathy cards, etc. It is a helpless feeling when someone dies. What can I do? What can I say? We want to think that our words or actions can somehow bring that loved one back to earthly life. When we realize we can not, many feel that sympathy and empathy are not enough so they would rather do nothing.
But, make no mistake, true heartfelt words of comfort, sympathy and prayer helps heal the hurt. Cooking a meal and bringing it to the bereaved family helps remove one more thing that family doesn't have to think about for a few days. Offering to run some errands for them, clean up their house or yard, doing their laundry for them for a few days so they can focus on funeral details/matters lifts a huge burden.

For whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because of your name as followers of Christ, truly I say to you, he will not lose his reward.
Mark 9:41
 
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Covfefe said:
Here is the latest from Pew on the subject
http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/...ligion-politics-society-beliefs-about-sharia/
Lower but substantial proportions of Muslims support severe punishments such as cutting off the hands of thieves or stoning people who commit adultery. The survey finds even lower support for executing apostates.
Click to expand...

Lots of stats but not the one claimed. Also, the article was already based on the Sharia slice of the pie, muddied by the offense of leaving Islam, and was further muddied by the country by country breakdown.
That was well done, though and about as thorough as you might find.
 
Covfefe said:
Seems like I’m not the only one, there were others that responded to your post. Like I said you Want respect for your religion, but want to judge others individually.

I grasp people like you completely.
Click to expand...

You can't read............you can't tell the difference between the 'actor' and the 'action'? Seriously?
I'll try this again.
Hate the sin, but love the sinner.

Breaking it down further:
Hate the actions, deeds, teachings, etc. of a particular organized religion.
Love the human beings who are associated with that particular organized religion.

Other example:
I hate the practice of the abortion of babies.
I love the abortionist.

Has the light bulb come on yet????
 
Stretch said:
You can't read............you can't tell the difference between the 'actor' and the 'action'? Seriously?
I'll try this again.
Hate the sin, but love the sinner.

Breaking it down further:
Hate the actions, deeds, teachings, etc. of a particular organized religion.
Love the human beings who are associated with that particular organized religion.

Other example:
I hate the practice of the abortion of babies.
I love the abortionist.

Has the light bulb come on yet????
Click to expand...
I can read just fine, I understand you completely!
 
Your prayers and an empty sack is worth the price of the empty sack.

This situation requires leadership, and Donald has sold his balls and bent the knee to the NRA.
 
CANADASLAVERY69 said:
it's cute how you think I make such a strong specific claim without the means to back it up.

My source is the words from muslims themselves:

Remember, these are facts, not feels. This is straight from their own mouths:

Here is a pew research poll asking of muslims, among other things, their opinions on stoning for adultery, and their support for killing anyone that happens to leave the faith:

vQkIN.jpg


I decided to look at those numbers in greater depth. My focus was specifically on the "death for apostasy" part of the poll, as that is a question that directly ties into a core aspect of their religious belief (whereas stoning might have some more secular beliefs behind it as well..).

I think it's fair to say that if you believe someone should die for leaving your faith, that such a viewpoint is not very tolerant, and is in fact rather dangerous.

First, I took the population of each country as a whole, and then I isolated just the muslim members of each country. After that, I just calculated the raw totals of muslims that answered in the affirmative regarding death for apostasy. Just basic math here, simply multiplying the percentage stated on the poll versus the total population of the countries muslims:

(The population and demographic information come from wikipedia)

Turkey

Population: 74 million (98% muslim)

72.5 million muslims

Number of Muslims believing that someone should die if they leave the faith: 3.6 million

Egypt

**Population:** 90 million (90% identify as muslim)

81 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 68 million

Jordan

Population: 6 million (92% muslim)

5,500000 muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 4.7 million

Lebanon

Population: 4 million (60% muslim)

2.4 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 144,000 (good job lebanon)

Indonesia

Population: 237,400,000 (86% muslim)

204 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 61 million

Pakistan

Population: 180 million (97%)

174 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 132 million

Nigeria

Population: 170 million (50% muslim)

85 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 42.5 million

___

Total Muslims in these Countries: ~624,400,000 (Nearly 40% of ALL muslims in the world btw)

Total Muslims that believe you should be killed for leaving their religion: ~311,944,000 (50% of muslims polled)

Conclusion:

We only looked at 7 countries. We didn't include Syria, many north african muslim countries, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Yemen, and many other countries that no doubt also have very extreme believers in Islam. Even so, without even considering those other nations, we already have a hard number of at least 20% of all muslims world wide, being completely intolerant in their view of religion. They believe you should be put to death if you leave the faith. If we were to look at some of the other countries listed above, this number may even be higher, and probably closer to 30-35%.

While these intolerant/psychotic muslims are a minority, they are a very sizable portion of the muslim faith. They are not "extremists" or a fringe group of paltry numbers.

And of course I'll add the usual asterisk that many other religions may have similar numbers when it comes to having rather violent beliefs and attitudes.

tagging this with a unique word so i can find my copypasta later: islamcopypasta
Click to expand...

You don't need to tag this with a unique word, you stole it without attribution from here:

http://rebrn.com/re/bill-maher-shredded-by-glenn-greenwald-on-us-intervention-in-mus-1003418/


Right?
 
CANADASLAVERY69 said:
it's cute how you think I make such a strong specific claim without the means to back it up.

My source is the words from muslims themselves:

Remember, these are facts, not feels. This is straight from their own mouths:

Here is a pew research poll asking of muslims, among other things, their opinions on stoning for adultery, and their support for killing anyone that happens to leave the faith:

vQkIN.jpg


I decided to look at those numbers in greater depth. My focus was specifically on the "death for apostasy" part of the poll, as that is a question that directly ties into a core aspect of their religious belief (whereas stoning might have some more secular beliefs behind it as well..).

I think it's fair to say that if you believe someone should die for leaving your faith, that such a viewpoint is not very tolerant, and is in fact rather dangerous.

First, I took the population of each country as a whole, and then I isolated just the muslim members of each country. After that, I just calculated the raw totals of muslims that answered in the affirmative regarding death for apostasy. Just basic math here, simply multiplying the percentage stated on the poll versus the total population of the countries muslims:

(The population and demographic information come from wikipedia)

Turkey

Population: 74 million (98% muslim)

72.5 million muslims

Number of Muslims believing that someone should die if they leave the faith: 3.6 million

Egypt

**Population:** 90 million (90% identify as muslim)

81 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 68 million

Jordan

Population: 6 million (92% muslim)

5,500000 muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 4.7 million

Lebanon

Population: 4 million (60% muslim)

2.4 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 144,000 (good job lebanon)

Indonesia

Population: 237,400,000 (86% muslim)

204 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 61 million

Pakistan

Population: 180 million (97%)

174 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 132 million

Nigeria

Population: 170 million (50% muslim)

85 million muslims

Intolerant/Dangerous Beliefs: 42.5 million

___

Total Muslims in these Countries: ~624,400,000 (Nearly 40% of ALL muslims in the world btw)

Total Muslims that believe you should be killed for leaving their religion: ~311,944,000 (50% of muslims polled)

Conclusion:

We only looked at 7 countries. We didn't include Syria, many north african muslim countries, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Yemen, and many other countries that no doubt also have very extreme believers in Islam. Even so, without even considering those other nations, we already have a hard number of at least 20% of all muslims world wide, being completely intolerant in their view of religion. They believe you should be put to death if you leave the faith. If we were to look at some of the other countries listed above, this number may even be higher, and probably closer to 30-35%.

While these intolerant/psychotic muslims are a minority, they are a very sizable portion of the muslim faith. They are not "extremists" or a fringe group of paltry numbers.

And of course I'll add the usual asterisk that many other religions may have similar numbers when it comes to having rather violent beliefs and attitudes.

tagging this with a unique word so i can find my copypasta later: islamcopypasta
Click to expand...

:thup:
 
Stretch said:
You can't read............you can't tell the difference between the 'actor' and the 'action'? Seriously?
I'll try this again.
Hate the sin, but love the sinner.

Breaking it down further:
Hate the actions, deeds, teachings, etc. of a particular organized religion.
Love the human beings who are associated with that particular organized religion.

Other example:
I hate the practice of the abortion of babies.
I love the abortionist.

Has the light bulb come on yet????
Click to expand...

Hate homosexuality and deny homosexuals equal protection under the law.

Light come on yet, cherry-picker?
 
Amadeus said:
Your prayers and an empty sack is worth the price of the empty sack.

This situation requires leadership, and Donald has sold his balls and bent the knee to the NRA.
Click to expand...

And what's leadership going to do? Not cause the AF to f up next time?
 
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