The Language of God

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

"Is this just mass delusion? And if it is some form of mass delusion, what is the cause? Why do humans have such a delusion, over and over and over again for as far back as history goes? Damn if it doesn't almost seem like this delusion is something important to man, it hasn't made its way to the dustheap of superstition, human spirituality is as strong as ever. WHYYYY? "


Here is your answer:

"Our entire universe is filled with the most astonishing and amazing things, and to think that it is all without purpose, without reason, without meaning, is just not something I can accept, and I don't believe many rational people could. "

Wow, not too many pinheads have the courage to use a Dixie quote to answer Dixie questions! But I am still a little confused about your viewpoint. It seems that you are saying.... Because the astonishing and amazing universe existing without reason is highly illogical and unreasonable, humans are compelled to seek comfort and become inspired to dramatically shape their lives through faith in something which appears to help them cope and make sense of it all?

I think you may have just proved the existence of God!

 

[Onceler]

Wow, not too many pinheads have the courage to use a Dixie quote to answer Dixie questions! But I am still a little confused about your viewpoint. It seems that you are saying.... Because the astonishing and amazing universe existing without reason is highly illogical and unreasonable, humans are compelled to seek comfort and become inspired to dramatically shape their lives through faith in something which appears to help them cope and make sense of it all?

I think you may have just proved the existence of God!

Well, you DO basically admit that you can't really comprehend a Universe without God, or a god. That viewpoint is independent of whether or not God or a god actually exists; your starting point is that a Universe without one would be too much to handle mentally, at least for you. It hardly serves as proof of that god.

One other thing that you generally assert, and that I have always found interesting, is that people have no reason to be good or treat others well without a god, or threat of punishment. Not that I have to share this, but I do believe in "god," though what I believe in probably has little in common w/ what you believe in. That's somewhat beside the point, however. My belief in "god" has absolutely nothing at all to do with how I treat people, and my general value system. I believe in treating people well for its own sake; not to avoid punishment.

Regardless of everything, it's also strange how it bothers you that some people don't believe in anything.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Well, you DO basically admit that you can't really comprehend a Universe without God, or a god. That viewpoint is independent of whether or not God or a god actually exists; your starting point is that a Universe without one would be too much to handle mentally, at least for you. It hardly serves as proof of that god.

I never said it would be too much to handle mentally, I said it makes no logical sense, and it doesn't. When you take an objective look at the universe, all of the universe, in all its glory and splendor, with all its abundant beauty and wonder, it simply doesn't comport with logic that it merely exists "just because" and nothing more.

One other thing that you generally assert, and that I have always found interesting, is that people have no reason to be good or treat others well without a god, or threat of punishment.

I have never made that statement in my life. I disagree with the statement, as a matter of fact. There are any number of reasons for people to be good, however, most of them revolve around self-serving interests. I have said, without belief in something greater than self, morality becomes subjective and you have no foundational basis to exhibit good morality. Read carefully, I didn't say people can't behave morally, just that there is no foundational reason for it, and no consequences for not doing it. Those who have faith in a God, do not behave morally out of fear of punishment, rather, out of a sense of honor, reverence and respect.

Not that I have to share this, but I do believe in "god," though what I believe in probably has little in common w/ what you believe in. That's somewhat beside the point, however. My belief in "god" has absolutely nothing at all to do with how I treat people, and my general value system. I believe in treating people well for its own sake; not to avoid punishment.

I think I may have mentioned I am a spiritualist.... just a few times now... but once more for goodness sake... As a spiritualist, I believe in a force or energy which is greater than human intellect, and something we are not capable of fully comprehending. I have no idea whether this force would "punish" you for behaving in a certain way or not, and I don't have a clue as to what sort of "punishment" it may invoke, or at what level for what action, etc. I exhibit decent moral behavior because it enhances the positive energy flowing around me. So, in my case, it is completely self-serving, I had rather be surrounded with positive energy than negative. I also know of several Christians, none of which have ever indicated they behave morally because they fear punishment.

So, before we go any further at all here, you need to support your argument with something, because it appears to be a baseless one.

Regardless of everything, it's also strange how it bothers you that some people don't believe in anything.

LOL... It doesn't "bother" me a bit! Again, you have a reading comprehension problem, you think, because I said "I do take exception with..." it means it "bothers me" and that is not the case at all. In the first place, I highly doubt more than about 1% of the world population, really and truly, honestly do not believe in anything greater than self. I think the vast majority of Atheists and people who claim they don't believe, are being dishonest, and actually DO believe in something. In some cases, I think their belief is stronger than people who practice their faiths religiously. No way to prove it, because it is a matter of whether you believe an Atheist is telling the truth....it's not like they believe there is a consequence for lying.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

I never said it would be too much to handle mentally, I said it makes no logical sense, and it doesn't. When you take an objective look at the universe, all of the universe, in all its glory and splendor, with all its abundant beauty and wonder, it simply doesn't comport with logic that it merely exists "just because" and nothing more.

I agree; because why would we be here, if there was no purpose.

Plus; I figure all those stars are out there for a bigger reason then just for us to look at or to hold the rest of everything together.

 

[midcan5]

I never said it would be too much to handle mentally, I said it makes no logical sense, and it doesn't. When you take an objective look at the universe, all of the universe, in all its glory and splendor, with all its abundant beauty and wonder, it simply doesn't comport with logic that it merely exists "just because" and nothing more.

So answer Ivan's question above. Because if purpose exists, it contains horror on an astounding level.

 

[Whomever]

Mankind has always used religion or mysticism if you will to expplain things they could not understand.
It has not been long since we thought diseases were caused by evil spirits instead of pathogens and such.
The planets were gods.
the rain, etc was controlled by certain gods.
Witches float or is it the other way around?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Mankind has always used religion or mysticism if you will to expplain things they could not understand.
It has not been long since we thought diseases were caused by evil spirits instead of pathogens and such.
The planets were gods.
the rain, etc was controlled by certain gods.
Witches float or is it the other way around?

This is often passed off as an "argument against religion" but it is a red herring. In the day when "religious" people were blaming spirits, the "science" people were letting blood with leeches. It doesn't appear one is any more on the 'right track' as the other, if you go by past history.

Indeed, mankind has an intrinsic need to 'explain the unexplained' and according to Darwin, this attribute must be something required by our species, else it would have been cast aside through natural selection. So, we have established, religion (spirituality) is fundamentally required by our species, for whatever reason.

Now, let's examine this concept of how man adopts religious belief to "explain the unexplained." Wouldn't you agree, even with religious belief, there are many things about our universe, which remain unexplained? Even with religious faith, it remains unexplained why babies die of horrible diseases, or why innocent people are killed. Why so many people in the world are starving, or oppressed. These questions are not answered through religious faith, so mankind is not adopting the belief to explain the unexplained.

From an objective viewpoint (I'm not religious), the practice of human spiritual belief through religion, provides some level of comfort, strength, inspiration for man. It is not a coincidence, we are the only species who practice spirituality, and we are the most advanced species on the planet. Could there be a connection between unprecedented human achievement and human spirituality?

 

[Whomever]

Umm yes there remains many unelplainable things in our universe.

But consider just put your trust in God and you do not have to be concerned about all the unexplainable things, it is all gods will and god will take care of you?

A cop out to me.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Umm yes there remains many unelplainable things in our universe.

But consider just put your trust in God and you do not have to be concerned about all the unexplainable things, it is all gods will and god will take care of you?

A cop out to me.

Whomever, do you have much experience with beating your head on a brick wall? Setting your self on fire with Napalm? Putting a knitting needle in your ear and beating on it with a ball peen hammer or other forms of self abuse like debating Dixie?

 

[ib1yysguy]

 

[Whomever]

Whomever, do you have much experience with beating your head on a brick wall? Setting your self on fire with Napalm? Putting a knitting needle in your ear and beating on it with a ball peen hammer or other forms of self abuse like debating Dixie?

Well he can change a little. It only took 7 years for him to mostly quit worshipping Bush's bluejean but.
A 2x4 around his head and shoulders works best. Repeat as needed.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Umm yes there remains many unelplainable things in our universe.

But consider just put your trust in God and you do not have to be concerned about all the unexplainable things, it is all gods will and god will take care of you?

A cop out to me.

Well, okay, so you are now shifting your point of religion from "explain the unexplained" to "not concerned with the unexplained." Which one is it? And, if it's as you claim (latest), that man worships God so he doesn't have to be concerned with the unexplained, then why is religion always doing things to help the needy and feed the hungry? Seems they wouldn't be concerned, since it's Gods will and he will take care of it.

So we see, neither of your arguments for religion hold water. It isn't merely something people do to explain the unexplained, because the unexplained still remains, despite religious belief. It's also not so religious people won't have to be concerned with the unexplained, because they still remain concerned.

You have now failed twice to explain why people believe in God. I think it is a very good indication, you really don't have a clue as to why people worship God. Perhaps your analysis needs reexamination? I would suggest you 'pray' about it, but............

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Well he can change a little. It only took 7 years for him to mostly quit worshipping Bush's bluejean but.
A 2x4 around his head and shoulders works best. Repeat as needed.

LMAO.... and during that 7 years, how many times have you changed your stupid pinhead name? How many utter volumes of stupidity are you avoiding accountability for, because you (like most pinheads) change your name as often as you change underwear?

Yeah, it's a pretty sweet gig you've set yourself up with, you can be as clueless and stupid as your pinhead heart desires, and never fear someone throwing something up from your posting past, because you've switched names! Meanwhile, I am the same person I've always been, making the same points, pwning the same pinheads, and furthering my reign as Living Legend.

 

[Sammy Jankis]

Indeed, mankind has an intrinsic need to 'explain the unexplained' and according to Darwin, this attribute must be something required by our species, else it would have been cast aside through natural selection. So, we have established, religion (spirituality) is fundamentally required by our species, for whatever reason.

Perhaps curiousity is just an adaptive trait?

Evolutionary pressures can act upon physical and mental traits alike.

I've seen animals with a NEED TO UNDERSTAND. Curiousity has killed many cats.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Perhaps curiousity is just an adaptive trait?

Evolutionary pressures can act upon physical and mental traits alike.

I've seen animals with a NEED TO UNDERSTAND. Curiousity has killed many cats.

You are confusing curiosity with man's unique need to explain the unexplained. What we have, goes beyond the normal "curiosity" found in the rest of the animal world, wouldn't you agree? There is something else in man, which drives him to find cause, explanation, reason. It goes way beyond simple curiosity.

While human curiosity has often been the catalyst for great achievement, it doesn't explain it. Otherwise, many a monkey would have made great discoveries, and that isn't really the case. I realize, to you, this is kind of a 'circular argument' since you will contend we ARE monkeys. But the fact remains, we possess an attribute none of the other species on the planet possess. Isn't it curious, we are also the only species to possess spirituality?

 

[Sammy Jankis]

You are confusing curiosity with man's unique need to explain the unexplained. What we have, goes beyond the normal "curiosity" found in the rest of the animal world, wouldn't you agree? There is something else in man, which drives him to find cause, explanation, reason. It goes way beyond simple curiosity.

While human curiosity has often been the catalyst for great achievement, it doesn't explain it. Otherwise, many a monkey would have made great discoveries, and that isn't really the case. I realize, to you, this is kind of a 'circular argument' since you will contend we ARE monkeys. But the fact remains, we possess an attribute none of the other species on the planet possess. Isn't it curious, we are also the only species to possess spirituality?

I think a need to understand the unexplained is synonymous with curiousity.

Why is parsing words the most favoritest pasttime of the intellectually dishonest?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

I think a need to understand the unexplained is synonymous with curiousity.

Why is parsing words the most favoritest pasttime of the intellectually dishonest?

They are two entirely different things, you can think they are synonymous, but you will never 'think' that into being so. A puppy is curious, a cat is curious, a monkey is curious, lots of animals exhibit curiosity. Only one animal acts upon that curiosity to find explanation and understanding. When is the last time a cat or dog won the Nobel Prize? It doesn't happen, because "curiosity" is quite different from "need to understand the unexplained!"

 

[Sammy Jankis]

They are two entirely different things, you can think they are synonymous, but you will never 'think' that into being so. A puppy is curious, a cat is curious, a monkey is curious, lots of animals exhibit curiosity. Only one animal acts upon that curiosity to find explanation and understanding. When is the last time a cat or dog won the Nobel Prize? It doesn't happen, because "curiosity" is quite different from "need to understand the unexplained!"

They are the same. And curiousity and learning is an adaptive behavior, increasing the survivability of the individuals exhibiting that trait.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

They are the same. And curiousity and learning is an adaptive behavior, increasing the survivability of the individuals exhibiting that trait.

As I said, you can THINK they are the same, you can even continue to CLAIM they are the same, but we've already demonstrated there is something different. Humans act upon their curiosity, to explore and find answers. No other species utilizes "curiosity" in the same way. This is why apes and gorillas don't win Nobel Prizes, and humans do. This is why dogs and cats don't publish books, and win Pulitzer Prizes, and humans do. This is why a human discovered nuclear fission, not a chimpanzee.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

As I said, you can THINK they are the same, you can even continue to CLAIM they are the same, but we've already demonstrated there is something different. Humans act upon their curiosity, to explore and find answers. No other species utilizes "curiosity" in the same way. This is why apes and gorillas don't win Nobel Prizes, and humans do. This is why dogs and cats don't publish books, and win Pulitzer Prizes, and humans do. This is why a human discovered nuclear fission, not a chimpanzee.

To be honest; Cats would publish books, but they're just to damn lazy and they've got humans to do it for them.